The Misguided Mythology of Ayrton Senna

Absolutely my perception: I liked to watch Gilles, but always thought that he did not have what was needed to win a Championship, and that I didn't understand the purpose of his car control exhibition; talent is one thing, and I understand that car control can fascinate people, but that's not enough, and the end game is to win the title. What fascinates me in Formula One is how a talented driver can harness his talent towards a goal; you need to use your brain for that.

All in all, taking together talent, raw speed, brains, intelligence not to forget class and elegance, Mika Hakkinen stands out: he had the whole package, and he was a gentleman; he had class written all over him; and I know that you don't succeed without being resolute, but he never was abrasive towards others.
(remember he had been elected by the McLaren people a few years back as the "most typical McLaren driver of all times").
He was the last of the gentlemen.

Rgds

 

Accumulating points over a season was complete anatema to Gilles Villeneuve. "I'm not an accountant", he once said.
He never focussed on the championsip, but seemed to fight every race like if it was his last, regardless of what it took of his car, or his tyres.
Although enjoyable, trashing his car to death and showboating in front of the crowd didn't bring much result.
Even when he was close to Schekter, his loyalty prevented him from challenging his team mate for the title.
Probably that winning the championship didn't mean much to him.

 

It depends on our definition of Great.

Is Hamilton "greater" than Lauda ?

Is Anthony Joshua "greater" than Mike Tyson ?

 

I don't follow boxing anymore - stopped when Ali left... its never been good since then.

I guess you can rate people by the numbers and if that is the only criteria, then Hamilton is way up there - if not at the very top. However, I think its more than just numbers. I think it has to be measured on the impact on the sport, the world and in their time racing. For me, that means only one person who stands out as the greatest ... Jackie Stewart. nobody has done more to grow F-1 and racing in general than Him. nobody is as well known as him ( but that is diminishing due to age) and clearly he's been able to stay in F-1 as an influence far longer than any other driver I can remember. Lauda comes close, but even he stepped away for a number of years to focus on his airline. people like Rosberg, and Button, or Alonso etc... are just doing it because they love it and can make money. Stewart did that as well, but he left a lasting impact on safety, business, broadcasting, road car development, sponsorship and even out of the racing world he's making a sustained impact in Dementia prevention and care.

So if you ask me who the greatest is - Jackie Stewart - hands down. and his driving was just as competent if not better as any other Champion.

 

As a lifetime body of work Stewart is hard to top. 3x World Champion, retired in 73 with most wins out of 99 starts and not broken until 1987 (not to mention his pioneering efforts for safety). Brand ambassador for Rolex, Ford, Heineken, and many other brands. Ford test and development driver, television commentator, and driving safety advocate. Junior formula team owner winning many championships and nurturing many great talents. F1 team owner and race winner. Outside of this is his groundbreaking work to raise awareness and research for both Dementia and Dyslexia (something he suffers terribly from). I'm sure I'm missing something but some people find more hours in the days than others. JYS is as great a motorsports ambassador as the world has ever had.

Beyond this, he has never been anything but a first class gentleman. Alan McNish told me a few years back that when it was him and Paul Stewart in the junior formulae at Paul Stewart Racing that Jackie treated him 100% equal to his son. He told me that never did Paul get an introduction or an advantage ahead of me. I find that to be incredible but it came straight from the guy who would have the most reason to feel hard done and there was none of it.

 

...and I well remember when he called quits, in october 1973 the feeling that an era has come to an end, that the King has left. Perhaps this is age-related (= I was 13 in october 1973) but I have never felt again such a strong impression, that the Master was gone, and that nothing would be the same anymore (even if, after he left, 1974 actually was a pretty interesting season...but a new era indeed)

Rgds

 

I agree - achieving the greatest numbers does not automatically equate to being the greatest. Especially in F1 when much depends on the car and team management.
The challenges that a competitor overcomes matters more.

For me, Clark, Lauda and Stewart are certainly seated at the top table.
I would also include Nuvolari, Schumacher, Fangio and Moss at that table.

 

Yes. I think Schumacher is about the only one from the "modern" era that gets a seat. Hamilton is good - no doubt but the rules are so tight - and he has the best car its hard to see anyone else winning. I would add Prost, and Mario Andretti. Graham Hill gets an honorable mention - he's still the only one to win F-1, Indy, and Lemans... on top of racing lots of other types of cars... for me however Stewart still sits atop the ladder. My dad loved Clark. and the more I have read I see how amazing he was. its really hard to see how if he had lived he would not have at least been a 3 - 4time World Champion. easily beating Fangio's record. Stewarts record of 27 wins seems like nothing today... and that its because you have 20 races a year. back in the 60's you had maybe 8-10 depending... so it was really hard to win huge amounts of races back then. And the racing was longer - over 2 hours in come cases... today a race rarely lasts an hour and a half.

 

As far as accomplishments over multiple driving disciplines Mario Andretti is on another planet compared to anyone else. F1 Champion, Indycar Champion, Indy 500 winner, Le Mans class winner, Daytona 500 winner, Pikes peak hill climb winner, countless sprint car wins on dirt and pavement. Even a little small time drag racing in there. Combine that with just an incredible personality and wonderful enthusiasm for the sport and it is difficult not to include him in the very few all time greats.

There is a whole world outside of F1 when determining driving greatness.

 

Yes I totally agree. Mario, is likely to be the single best driver ever.. because of the wide range of accomplishments. Also he drove for so long. That to me seems unlikely today. seems like kids start in karting - get into either dirt track or road racing ... and it is either NASCAR or Indy or IMSA... not that many that do all 3 and not many who do rally, drag, f-1 Eurpoean, Dakkar etc...

 

JPM has done all four major series mentioned (incl F1, of course). Many drivers participate in other series outside of F1. They just don’t have the success that Andretti had

 

It is so much harder today for an F1 driver to have a wide spread career because they are such specialists and bound by contract as such. In the days of Andretti it was not uncommon for him to drive 3-4 disciplines of cars in a single week. Nowadays the only opportunity for an F1 driver is that they are so much younger, and their careers tend to finish earlier, that they have more life ahead of them to try their hands at other forms of racing. Alonso is a good example of that.

 

With a 21/23 races calendar, there aren't many weekends left to participate fully in another series.
Some F1 drivers did sporatically in the WEC like Hulkenberg who won Le Mans between 2 GPs.
But there are also contract obligations that prevent many F1 drivers to race outside the championship.

 

Andretti used to race Monaco and then hop onto a Concorde to make the start at Indy.

No need for different weekends !