car design thread

The 296 name started in 1958 with the Jano inspired 296S Dino motor wich was put in a Testa Rossa chassis and raced by Hawthorn at Silverstone.

 

And it is a 2.9 liter V6

 

Maybe by the time it hits production it can look like this...

Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

After looking at this for a few days, my impression is that overall it's a bit boring. I'm not convinced you can successfully transfer design cues from the era of cars with more ovoid cross sections to contemporary design although the 458/488 were very good. Also, given Ferrari's tradition, I don't really get the hard horizontal leading to the somewhat crude side inlet followed by the exaggerated rear quarter profile. It's all a bit too Fiberfab Valkyrie...
I don't think this will age well.

 

Very interesting observations on the 296 design. However KISS seems to have been thought of and then just as quickly cast aside with the expectation that 800 plus HP can fix anything. As @day355 noted Ferrari could have gone in a different direction but chose the 296 way out instead.
The term "KISS principle" was in popular use by 1970. Variations on the phrase include: "Keep it simple, silly", "keep it short and simple", "keep it simple and straightforward", "keep it small and simple", "keep it simple, soldier", or "keep it simple, sailor".
Some see the 250LM as inspiration for the 296 but that Ferrari had a V12 and was almost HALF the weight of the 296. Mr. Manzoni doesn't do 'retro' and doesn't even like that idea even though he does own a 308...

 

IMHO, I only wish that the rear roof slope had a tad of wide-radius curve in it; reminds me of a DIY plywood hack. The rear quarters look wonderful.

 

He is a liar if he says that.

 

'Retro' design according to Flavio Manzoni as provided by Wei Koh in this interview>

By Wei Koh

In almost every way, it is insufficient to declare Flavio Manzoni a car designer. In his role as the Design Director at Ferrari he has, in six short years at the helm of the most iconic sports car company in the world, already created some of Ferrari’s most progressive vehicles, and as such some of the most striking cars in present memory.

Under his leadership, Ferrari has won the Compasso d’Oro, one of the world’s most revered and oldest industrial design awards, for the F12berlinetta in 2014 and again for the FXXK in 2016, making Ferraris only two of the nine automobiles to every achieve this prize since the founding of the competition in 1954.

In 2015, Ferrari achieved a staggering three Red Dot Awards for the FXX K (winner of the Best of the Best prize), the California T and La Ferrari. Again in 2016, the Ferrari 488 won the Red Dot Best of the Best Award.

But more than this, Manzoni is a once-in-a-generation artist, like Constantine Brancusi or Gio Ponti, who has selected instead of sculpture or architecture, the medium of the super car as his elected path to immortality.

At the helm of Ferrari, he has brought this halcyon marque to one of its most fecund belles epoques, characterised by cars such as the 488 GTB, Ferrari’s first production mid-engine turbo-charged V8 car since the 1987 F40, the operatic siren song to the naturally-aspirated V8 known as the 458 Speciale, the hallucinatory panjandrum on wheels, that’s seen even the most jaded collectors at crossroads at midnight trying to sign over the deeds to their soul, that is the F12tdf, and, of course, arguably Ferrari’s greatest modern masterpiece, the unforgettably-named LaFerrari.

Already these cars are being heralded as the Dino, the 250 and 288 GTOs, the 275 GTB4s and the F40s of their generation. It is not coincidental that Ferrari has never been more successful, with waiting lists for admission into the waist list of their regular production cars, let alone their special editions. But Manzoni and Ferrari’s latest project is a collaboration with that most dynamic of watch brands, Hublot, and the results are timepieces that are the first collaboration between Ferrari’s design team and a Swiss high watchmaking brand.

It was my pleasure to speak to this aesthetic revolutionary, this one-in-a-million visionary to learn about his most recent accomplishments at the fabled Ferrari.


OK. What is your job reduced to its barest essential?
I think Ferrari is one of the very few objects, one of the few cars that transmit this ideal of the soul. The Greeks believed in the concept of “anima” in objects, or the animating principle. This is what triggers emotion in people.

A Ferrari is not a machine. Yes, on some level it is the reconciliation of aerodynamic, mechanical and aesthetic properties. But it has to be more than this. It has to speak through a sort of meta language, not through words.

Ferrari always comes from a dream. So our job is to find the conjunction between the dream and reality while still keeping all the beauty of an emotional object.

I am told that the technical constraints of a car actually help you to define what it should look like. Is this true?
Well, if you were to ask other designers, they may say the technical constraints are a problem, it is difficult to design a car if the technical constraints are too many. But at Ferrari, we respect first and foremost the engineering and we believe that engineering is a thing of beauty and therefore should be translated in a beautiful way.

I look at technical constraints as an opportunity to bring a signature design to a new Ferrari, to empower the visual identity of a new Ferrari. It is about understanding them and then channelling them in a creative way.

Can you give me an example of this?
Sure, for example, you look at the shark fins on the rear fender of the F12tdf. Many people felt that these were reminiscent of similar vents found in the 250 GTO and some of our other iconic cars.

But these are not a stylistic flourish; in fact, they come about from a specific request of the aerodynamicist. There was also the request to have additional little spoilers at the two sides of the rear screen. We made many proposals but they added so much unwanted detail, so much visual noise to the rear that I was completely against this.

And then at some moment I had the intuition to use a special T cut on the rear glass to function as a spoiler. So, combined with a kind of two scallops under the glass, it really works like spoiler. So we could reach the objective of the aerodynamicist in a very interesting way. And few people know this.

They might say, oh, this is a stylistic feature, but the reality is that the this theme is born of a technical need. Another detail is the aero bridge of the F12tdf. People recognise it as a signature design element but it is a technical necessity for the car.
I remember you once saying you didn’t like overtly retro details on Ferrari’s modern cars, what made you allow this sort of retro flourish here?
(Laughs) Well, to tell you the truth, honestly I didn’t want them. There were actually two solutions for the aerodynamic issue in the F12tdf. The first was a sort of channel that we created in this area of the car, similar to the channel you see in the 488 GTB rear fender.

Then there were these shark fins. But I didn’t like them because they were immediately recognisable as a sort of retro feature. Suffice it to say it was only after many attempts with the first solution that I had to accept to use these fins, which is a bit funny because it is something people very much love about the design.

I have to admit it works very well from a functional perspective, but for my way of thinking they are not subliminal enough and maybe a bit too overt. In the end, I said “OK if we’re going to do this let’s go all the way and do it in a very Ferrari way that recalls not just the GTO but the 275 GTB4, for example”.

What was your point of departure for the Tour de France model compared to the Ferrari F12berlinetta?
We made an analysis of the new content for the Tdf version of the F12. We recognised that the Tdf was meant to be much more of a race-specific car and this allowed us to follow a different set of stylistic codes in comparison to the Berlinetta, which can be somehow elegant and refined.

Conversely, the Tdf could be more “brutal” because it is a race car. So our focus was to interpret this brutality into a holistic product that represented a different aspect of Ferrari’s personality. I said, “Let’s show off all the racing elements in a graphic way as opposed to the more sculptural elegance of the bodywork”.

I think this interplay and tension between the new graphic elements and — let’s say — the organic plasticity of the underlying F12 model creates something very energetic. It makes the car very special. It creates a dynamic tension; a certain predatory feel.


This is interesting. Please give me more examples of how you created dynamic tension in the F12tdf.
One of the signatures of the Tdf is the carbon fiber blade that transitions into the air channel integrated into the door of the car. This is another integral aerodynamic element. But if you looked at the very original carbon fibre blade, this was very ugly and so we ended up having to treat it like a composition of elements.

But it also becomes an integral part of the design because in some ways it helps the proportion of the car as it cuts the car into two parts. It changes the whole balance and equilibrium of the car. It is a dialogue between lines in different directions. When you compare this to the three fins on the rear fender of the car, you feel again this tension between two such opposing elements, one that is so overt and one that is so subliminal and this again gives the car such great energy.

Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

himself >

Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

He can say what he wants but the 296 is incredibly retro. What he is bringing to market matters a lot more than his words.

 

Definitely splitting hairs. I agree that retro has simply become the term to use for a lazy design that references a brands heritage. But thats simply because we allow 'retro' to have that definition. I dont give retro that definition so when i use it, it can mean anything as clunky as the PT Cruiser all the way to something done as nicely as the 296.

 

First time I've seen a Jensen Interceptor used as a styling inspiration........

 

Mr. Manzoni speaks; some 296 GTB design insight from the designer himself>

Towards the rear are where the biggest changes can be seen. The company decided to take inspiration from the Le Mans-winning 250 LM, incorporating a completely vertical rear windscreen, a flat rear deck, and an exterior hoop that acts as a hood over the front-most part of the engine bay which Manzoni calls the "flying bridge."
Ferrari's internal design team is well-versed in the company's history, and often references past models in its modern lineup. "We consider all the elements of the Ferrari language like a dictionary, a vocabulary," Manzoni says. "It’s normal to integrate these stylistic codes into something that’s really unique and original."

[The rear haunches] take inspiration from the 250 LM especially," Manzoni adds. "These sections are romantic, well defined."

That vertical rear windscreen isn't just there to pay tribute to Ferrari's past, though. "The idea for the vertical rear screen is that it makes the cabin visually shorter," Manzoni tells us. "From the profile, you can see that it looks quite compact and visually cab forward, extending the tail."

There's also the complex piece of glass that shrouds the engine bay. It's a single item that stretches from the rear windscreen to the rear bumper, sporting some impressive shapes that give it real definition. "On a car like this we wanted to keep the entire engine bay visible through the glass," Manzoni says. "So we worked on the idea of two buttresses, but transparent. It has been quite difficult to develop this. A glass with this kind of shape is one of the most complex in the automotive field."

Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

Excellent observations as usual.

One of the things I noticed about the 296 is that they lost the surface tension they had in the original sketches. Something just seems "off" to me in pics. The original sketches , particularly the side intake and rear quarter arch line, have taut, fast lines. It seems from pics of the production car that they lost this essence. No doubt a result of conforming to packaging.

 

Thanks for this thoughtful and insightful post!
I am no designer, I just know what I like vs. what I find jarring: and I think the 296 is gorgeous!

I clearly see elements of 250LM and 246 and I think that is a good thing. Much like the Roma and the Monza I feel that Manzoni is “bringing back” that Ferrari elegance coupled with romantic motoring. I am not a fan of overly done wings, scoops, ducts, etc...I think it makes a car look like it is trying too hard to be “super cool.” For instance; I greatly prefer the look of the F8 over the Pista. I think the drastic S-duct on the Pista is downright ugly and bifurcates the front of the car into a curving hood section and a pseudo-straight edged wing right out front. F8 is far prettier to my eye, and I suspect give’s 99.5% of the desired performance the Pista solution does...thus the design wins over the “fake” aero-marketing claims, especially for street driving.

I see the 296 as bridging a gap between the elegant classic voluptuous Ferrari design language and trying to also appear modern and exotic given that it is rear-midengined. The shapes curve gracefully, for the most part, and appear clean to me. Yet, there are enough angles and scoops to state, “I’m a mid-engined Italian supercar capable of astonishing performance.”

In short I love it and would buy one in a second if it weren’t a hybrid. From a technological point of view I see it as a miss, as I see all the new “horsepower wars” as a ridiculous miss by all manufacturers taking part. Lunacy, sheer lunacy. These are road cars, not GT3 cars competing in LM series. Porsche GT3 winged/touring “get it.” Driving quickly, aggressively, but not like an ***hat madman on public roads with families out there in my Porsche 991.2 GT3 with a lowly 500hp and slow-shifting manual will get the job done as well as a 1000hp SF90.

If this car was a NA V6 non-hybrid with 500hp, as light as possible, offered with DCT and a 6-speed manual...then I’d buy two....one to drive daily and one to covet and drive rarely. And no one can tell me that they “can’t do it anymore” because of Euro overlords...to them I say BS...Porsche can do it, and Ferrari can do it as well..if there are fines attached to the car then so be it..attach those fines to the price of the car and carry on. Now I’m rambling on about non-design issues...lol...

Manzoni is brilliant, no doubt whatsoever in my book and I am willing to bet the 296 will become a cherished design classic over the years.