FORMULA 1 PIRELLI BRITISH GRAND PRIX 2021 - SILVERSTONE - THE RACE - ▄▀▄▀ SPOILERS▄▀▄▀▄▀. | Page 25 | FerrariChat

FORMULA 1 PIRELLI BRITISH GRAND PRIX 2021 - SILVERSTONE - THE RACE - ▄▀▄▀ SPOILERS▄▀▄▀▄▀.

Discussion in 'F1' started by DF1, Jul 18, 2021.

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  1. Bas

    Bas Four Time F1 World Champ

    Mar 24, 2008
    41,299
    ESP
    Full Name:
    Bas
    Watch Max's onboard. Lewis drove into the corner at a daft angle. Could've lifted a bit more, he would've made the corner and neither would've crashed. It's up to the overtaking driver to make the pass safely.

    Either way it sets a nice precedent for the rest of the season doesn't it? Since we can now simply ram off championship rivals and receive a mere slap on the wrist.

    Who is talking about charles here? Certainly not me.
     
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  2. Bas

    Bas Four Time F1 World Champ

    Mar 24, 2008
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    I wouldn't say useless, sadly. Pole position for the sprint race and Max wasn't driving away in the sprint race either...Perez even with the low drag wing couldn't do anything useful during the race, either, and he was well behind in quali and sprint race (pre-spin). Bottas nearly qualified ahead of Max....I think the Merc has gained a bit of ground.
     
  3. LamboLover

    LamboLover F1 Rookie

    Jul 16, 2006
    2,534
    Texas
    Full Name:
    Rick
    Defending a driver who's literally got a history of ramming off Ferrari drivers himself. Gotta love this forum's ever-changing views.
    You've drummed up a weird theory your own driver doesn't agree that Max was making extra room.
     
    Terra likes this.
  4. NeuroBeaker

    NeuroBeaker Advising Moderator
    Moderator

    Oct 1, 2008
    38,742
    Huntsville, AL., USA
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    Andrew
    Yes. Either he screwed up (which he doesn't acknowledge) or he did it intentionally (10 second penalty, 2 points added to his license). The points on his license, given by those who are able to analyse telemetry along with all video footage, are pretty odd if it was an innocent racing incident.

    I've gone through cycles with him. I loved him in his first 2 seasons, he was a surprising young talent, refreshing, and exciting. However, I got a bit disenfranchised after that. Wasn't a fan during his early Mercedes title years and was pretty happy to see Rosberg beat him. I thought he was going through something of a redemption arc over these last 2 years or so, coming across more reasonably, but the incident in Copse and his behavior afterwards revised my thinking on warming up to him again. Earned penalties which most teams and drivers respect, are often framed by Hamilton/Mercedes as injustices designed to hold him/them back, from which he/they will overcome. It's not so much the on-track aggression, which you'd expect from a top tier F1 champion in the heat of the moment, it's that downtrodden but unstoppable underdog narrative Hamilton tries to set that bears little resemblance to reality.

    He's an excellent driver, indisputably among the best that has ever driven in F1, special even among a crowd of other multiple world champions, but he behaves with such entitlement and self-absorption that I find him very difficult to like and cheer for.

    What I also find difficult to like is the argument you're putting forth that if people don't like Hamilton now, then that's evidence that they never liked him. Accusing someone of a disingenuous claim of losing respect simply to cloak their arguments as not originating from a card-carrying Hamilton-hater is pretty ungentlemanly. I think it shows you have no respect for the integrity of fellow forum members when you pose it with a sarcastic wink.

    All the best,
    Andrew.
     
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  5. F430 F1 Singapore

    Mar 4, 2016
    144
    Singapore
    Max and Lewis.

    One drove like a perfect GOAT.

    The other drove like a perfect goat.

    You decide which is which. :D:D:D

    Actually, the incident itself can perhaps be written off as a racing incident, but it was the celebration at the end that tipped me over. When a driver has a massive shunt, it's only human to feel concerned. When it's a massive shunt *you* caused (with a penalty to "prove" your guilt), then the concern and remorse should increase exponentially. To run up and down waving the British flag as if he were channeling Bruce Dickinson at a Maiden concert in a performance of "The Trooper" is downright sociopathic in my view. :mad:

    I'm not one of the usual LH hate brigade. I've even defended him in the past. Not today. His behaviour was beyond the pale.
     
  6. Bas

    Bas Four Time F1 World Champ

    Mar 24, 2008
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    You're making a whole lot of general assumptions.
     
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  7. Bas

    Bas Four Time F1 World Champ

    Mar 24, 2008
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    I know quite a few people that are in your position...Loved him at first, then his personality came to light. Even when they where pretty open minded regarding age & immaturity etc, most of them are just completely sick of him and see straight through his persona.
     
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  8. jgonzalesm6

    jgonzalesm6 Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Oct 31, 2016
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  9. subirg

    subirg F1 Rookie

    Dec 19, 2003
    4,186
    Cheshire
    Well this one will run and run. Probably beyond the end of the season! Won’t change anything. Max saw his wdc lead slashed to virtually nothing. The championship is still very much alive, but Redbull still have the better car and it’s theirs to lose IMHO. Expect more on track clashes before this is over. Exciting season!!!
     
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  10. Ferrari 308 GTB

    Ferrari 308 GTB F1 Veteran

    Feb 21, 2015
    7,716
    Tropical
    #610 Ferrari 308 GTB, Jul 19, 2021
    Last edited: Jul 19, 2021
    Maybe time for the old 'Mad Max' to resurface? He is more than capable of making crazy overtaking attempts,and failing miserably.Spa 2016 anyone?

     
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  11. jgonzalesm6

    jgonzalesm6 Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Oct 31, 2016
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    This is just a precursor of Prost/Senna 2.0 in 2021. Neither one is giving up(Max and Lewis).

    I expect a response in kind from Max to Lewis in the coming races.
     
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  12. fer312t

    fer312t Formula Junior

    Nov 16, 2010
    777
    Initializing a collision with your championship rival...one which you trail by over 25 points...going into a high speed corner, and potentially eliminating yourself (or perhaps only yourself!) in the process...sorry, but that makes zero sense to me.

    It was lap 1, when modern Formula races are often won or lost (contrary to the old adage) There is a sense of urgency...and sometimes there is contract, especially when two relatively uncompromising characters are involved. No much more complicated than that really.

    I think I'm probably quite correct in thinking that...you see that all over the internet. Realistically I don't think many people's opinions on Hamilton have changed much after today. It's just mostly a disingenuous tactic to suggest something has been newly lost. I'm not singling out anyone here - I brought it up re: your comment about 'brand damage.'

    Some perspective - he had a big hit and was winded. Then he walked to ambulance under his own power, and waved to the applauding crowd while doing so. All on the world feed, and no doubt seen by the other drivers during the red flag. He went to the hospital for precautionary checks and was released. Pretty standard stuff. I'm glad he's OK, as is everyone. Not sure why the hand-wringing.

    Everyone was chirpy in the post-race. Lewis, Charles, Lando etc... and I'm quite sure if Lewis had demonstrated more 'concern' it would have been attacked as disingenuous by some.

    Post-race was beautiful I thought...Monza level love from crowd to driver and back. Absolutely Loved it, will watch again :)
     
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  13. Bas

    Bas Four Time F1 World Champ

    Mar 24, 2008
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    Bas
  14. Beau365

    Beau365 Formula 3

    Feb 27, 2005
    1,284
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    Beau

    Tight racing and the Merc upgrades have worked a treat. That thing is fast.
     
  15. DF1

    DF1 Two Time F1 World Champ

    Marko and Horner and all team managers might need to be aware / reminded lol - https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/masi-f1-penalties-dont-reflect-consequences-of-incidents/6633632/

    Masi: F1 penalties don't reflect consequences of incidents
    By: Adam Cooper
    Jul 19, 2021, 5:59 AM
    FIA Formula 1 race director Michael Masi says it's a fundamental principle that stewards do not take the consequences of an incident into account when giving penalties.

    He also stressed that the team bosses had been part of the discussion when it was agreed to take that route.


    The clash between Max Verstappen and Lewis Hamilton on the first lap of the British GP led to the Dutchman's instant retirement, and generated a 10-second penalty for the Mercedes driver for causing a collision.


    Much to the frustration of Verstappen and his Red Bull team, Hamilton was able to overcome the penalty and still win the race.


    Masi stressed that the stewards could not take into account the fact that Verstappen had retired and Hamilton had continued, and any potential impact on the title battle.


    "I think one of the big parts that's been a mainstay for many, many years, and this came through discussions prior to my time between all of the teams, the FIA and F1, and the team principals were all quite adamant, is that you should not consider the consequences in an incident," Masi said.


    "So when they judge an incident they judge the incident itself, and the merits of the incident, not what happens afterwards as a consequence. And that's been something that the stewards have done for many years.


    "And have been advised to do from top down. I'm talking team involvement, and so forth. So that's the way that the stewards judge it, because start taking consequences into account, there's so many variables, rather than judging the incident itself on its merits."

     
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  16. DF1

    DF1 Two Time F1 World Champ

    As many feel below. https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/leclerc-hamilton-verstappen-clash-a-racing-incident/6633718/

    Leclerc: Hamilton-Verstappen British GP F1 clash a racing incident

    By: Jonathan Noble
    Jul 19, 2021, 6:51 AM
    Charles Leclerc believes the clash between Max Verstappen and Lewis Hamilton in Formula 1’s British Grand Prix was nothing more than a racing incident.

    Leclerc had the best view of the opening lap crash at Silverstone, as he was running right behind the lead Red Bull and Mercedes cars.

    While he believes Hamilton had a bit more room to play with at the apex of the corner to avoid contact, the Ferrari driver believes that Verstappen was aggressive with his turn in.

    “It is very difficult to judge it from the car; we are very low,” said Leclerc. “So it’s difficult to see.

    “Everything went very quick. Obviously I could see there were quite a bit of things going around in front of me. And yeah, I think it’s a racing incident.

    “It’s quite difficult to put the blame on one or the other. Obviously there was space on the inside. Maybe Lewis was not completely at the apex but it’s also true that Max was quite aggressive on the outside. So, things happen.
     
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  17. sp1der

    sp1der F1 Rookie

    Jan 10, 2009
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    I would say not this is a Merc track and they only just beat a hobbled Ferrari, that clearly also did not work on the hard tyres.
     
  18. tifosi12

    tifosi12 Four Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Oct 3, 2002
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    Andreas
    That part I agree with. Silverstone was always Merc territory, Max should have done a Prost and not a Senna.
     
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  19. jpalmito

    jpalmito F1 Veteran

    Jun 5, 2009
    7,281
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    mathieu Jeantet
    Don't understand why the race was red flagged?
    A safety car would have been enough.
    Oh wait, that way they could fix Lewis car..
    Well done the FIA and liberty media!
     
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  20. Bas

    Bas Four Time F1 World Champ

    Mar 24, 2008
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    Bas
  21. Bas

    Bas Four Time F1 World Champ

    Mar 24, 2008
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    It was to repair the barrier...no conspiracy on that one but just another bout of (enormous) Lewis luck...
     
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  22. jpalmito

    jpalmito F1 Veteran

    Jun 5, 2009
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    mathieu Jeantet
    My bad..
    I couldn't help but think this way..
    ;)
     
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  23. Beau365

    Beau365 Formula 3

    Feb 27, 2005
    1,284
    Congested London
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    Beau

    Merc was not short of speed on Lap1. Party Mode ?
     
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  24. DF1

    DF1 Two Time F1 World Champ

    Mercedes: British GP red flag saved Hamilton from retirement
    By: Haydn Cobb
    Jul 19, 2021, 7:36 AM
    Mercedes suspects Lewis Hamilton would have been forced to retire with damage sustained in his clash with Max Verstappen had Formula 1's British Grand Prix not been red-flagged.

    I would have preferred this. Both out. Let others race. No drama lol.
    Charles for the win. Too bad.
     
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  25. GuyIncognito

    GuyIncognito Nine Time F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Jun 30, 2007
    91,678
    correct me if I'm wrong, but the ability to repair a car under red flag is there so drivers can repair or switch to a spare car if there's a big accident on the start. so it's somewhat unique to F1 (I see a lot of Indy/sports car guys complaining about it).
     
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