Dino Starter Engagement Issue | FerrariChat

Dino Starter Engagement Issue

Discussion in 'Technical Q&A' started by racerboy9, Sep 23, 2021.

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  1. racerboy9

    racerboy9 F1 Rookie
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    Nov 3, 2003
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    Started having this problem with my starter engagement. Sometimes engages and starts right up but more often takes 10-15 times to get it to catch and turn the motor over. Original solenoid contacts and gear look like new. Ring gear looks like new with no chewed teeth. I put on a NOS solenoid, same problem. I put on another starter, same problem. Plenty of power from the battery. Only thing I can think of is maybe the alignment of the starter gear and the ring gear went bad though I don't know how that could happen. Maybe shimming one side of the starter to gain a little clearance? Any thoughts on a solution? I made this short video of the problem:

     
  2. raemin

    raemin Formula 3

    Jan 16, 2007
    2,388
    Lyon (FR)
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    R. Emin
    The "clong" sounds familiar... One of the teeth of my flywheel was crushed, the machinist said the engine is probably stopping very often on the same position, which induces lots of stress on a single portion of the flywheel.

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    The flywheel was repaired, but I also changed the starter for a modern one. It does have a gear with a slightly different shape. No more issues.
     
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  3. wmuno

    wmuno Formula Junior
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    Dec 24, 2007
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    Bill Muno
    These problems usually don't occur out of the blue. This isn't a common problem with Ferrari starters. Was something recently done to the engine or starter that might have caused the current problem?
     
  4. racerboy9

    racerboy9 F1 Rookie
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    I have done nothing to the car. This just started up out of the blue. Wish I could get an inspection camera in there to see what is happening. I may paint the teeth of the starter pinion with Prussian blue and see if that shows a meshing problem. It never grinds, just doesn't engage.
     
  5. racerboy9

    racerboy9 F1 Rookie
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    Nov 3, 2003
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    Here is an inside view of the starter action. Seems I am getting solenoid pinion engagement but only occasional starter rotation. Again, two different starters with new solenoids. This is a real head scratcher for me. Only thing I can think of is the solenoid contacts are only slamming together once in a while for some reason.

     
  6. Steve Magnusson

    Steve Magnusson Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Jan 11, 2001
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    Steve Magnusson
    I'd say this differently. Looks like you are getting pinion engagement, and the starter motor rotates, but what you are not getting is engagement/drive between the starter motor shaft and the pinion gear.
     
  7. Steve Magnusson

    Steve Magnusson Two Time F1 World Champ
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    #7 Steve Magnusson, Sep 25, 2021
    Last edited: Sep 25, 2021
    I should've added that it looks like you have a "Bendix" style pinion gear/mechanism which has a roller one-way clutch inside that (should) transmit torque when the starter motor RPM is higher than the flywheel RPM and release when the flywheel RPM exceeds the starter motor RPM -- doesn't seem to be working correctly. See this video at about 14:00:

    https://video.search.yahoo.com/search/video?fr=yfp-t-s&ei=UTF-8&p=how+does+a+starter+motor+pinion+work#id=1&vid=6bbb39ba347263287f396e9ef2864025&action=view

    or do a search on youtube using something like "Bendix clutch" for more.
     
  8. racerboy9

    racerboy9 F1 Rookie
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    Nov 3, 2003
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    Steve, thanks a bunch for your input. It was the almost new Ghibaudi starter drive that was bad. Put in another new Ghibaudi unit and works great. I hope that was just a fluke but my guess is it is an under engineered part. The original Marelli unit looks more heavy duty.
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  9. Steve Magnusson

    Steve Magnusson Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Jan 11, 2001
    26,932
    30°30'40" N 97°35'41" W (Texas)
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    Steve Magnusson
    Very good! I should correct what I wrote in post #7. I should've written: "...that (should) transmit torque when the pinion gear tangential velocity is higher than the flywheel gear tangential velocity and release when the flywheel gear tangential velocity exceeds the pinion gear tangential velocity..." (not RPMs).
     

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