The (one and only) '0846' Debate Thread | Page 11 | FerrariChat
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The (one and only) '0846' Debate Thread

Discussion in 'Vintage (thru 365 GTC4)' started by El Wayne, Nov 1, 2003.

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Page 11 of 461
  1. Texas Forever

    Texas Forever Eight Time F1 World Champ
    BANNED Rossa Subscribed

    Apr 28, 2003
    85,600
    Texas!
    #251 Texas Forever, Feb 23, 2004

    Napolis, I noticed that it looks like you need additional security in your garage, and I'd like to volunteer my services. For mere bread and water (I need to lose weight anyway), I'll be happy to provide 24/7 guard duty. The only thing that I'll need is a mop...

    Dr "Drooling" Tax
     
  2. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ
    Honorary Owner

    Oct 23, 2002
    32,118
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    Jim Glickenhaus
    #252 Napolis, Feb 23, 2004
    As our shop abuts the local Police Force and they all seem to be car guys we seem to be covered.
    Moppers we can always use.
    Best
     
  3. zjpj

    zjpj F1 Veteran

    Nov 4, 2003
    6,124
    USA
    #253 zjpj, Feb 23, 2004
    haha, where can I get my bucket?
     
  4. KennyH

    KennyH F1 Veteran
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    Aug 13, 2001
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    Kenny
    #254 KennyH, Feb 23, 2004
    Where do I sign up :)
     
  5. P4weGo

    P4weGo Rookie

    Feb 24, 2004
    0
    #255 P4weGo, Feb 25, 2004


    I know a man who rebuilt a BMW motorcycle from a panier, does that make it a BMW motorcycle? Maybe.

    If Jims car has some genuine parts on it then is it genuine?

    Please no shouting, I was enjoying watching this chat develop, but it seems to have stopped.

    Has the car got genuine:

    uprights?
    brakes?
    a door?
    an engine?
    a gearbox?
    chassis?

    whatever, it would be nice to see it all on one page.

    PS some of you people are downright rude. Is there any chance that we can continue this discussion without being offensive.
     
  6. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ
    Honorary Owner

    Oct 23, 2002
    32,118
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    Jim Glickenhaus
    #256 Napolis, Feb 25, 2004
    No matter how many times, over no matter how many years, people continue to ask the same questions, instead of reading the answers which have already been posted many, many times the answers remain the same.
     
  7. Bryanp

    Bryanp F1 Rookie

    Aug 13, 2002
    3,825
    Santa Fe, NM
    #257 Bryanp, Feb 25, 2004
    Amen, Jim - I, for one, have always appreciated the openness you have displayed both in the restoration and in your sleuthing on your car.

    I'll buy the book (if you autograph it), but who will play you in the movie???

    Bryan P
     
  8. Miltonian

    Miltonian F1 Veteran

    Dec 11, 2002
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    Jeff B.
    #258 Miltonian, Feb 25, 2004
    Jim: In your own opinion, as someone who obviously knows more about the subject than the average person, is there one particular book or other source that contains ACCURATE information about the story of the various P3 and P4 variations, including specific chassis number histories? I would love to have the best book on the subject.

    I have been looking at the Salon story on P4 #0856 in Road & Track, January 1981. This article has a sidebar by Doug Nye (who is ordinarily pretty accurate and well-informed) which states that Daytona 1967 was won by Amon and Bandini, "apparently in 0856", which is apparently incorrect. I'd like to read the TRUE story in detail.

    I'm greatly enjoying seeing the details of your restoration, thank you for sharing!!
     
  9. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ
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    Oct 23, 2002
    32,118
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    Jim Glickenhaus
    #259 Napolis, Feb 25, 2004
    There are a number and I'll list some after I check them out again. The problem as you pointed out is that over time error becomes truth. Remember my MK-IV J6. A very nice P4 book, which has a lot of things correct features a car on the cover with a body that was fitted after it was reconverted back to a P4 from a 350 Can Am and that body has IMHO a few issues. Some of which I've already mentioned. (Shape of rear cut out)
     
  10. zjpj

    zjpj F1 Veteran

    Nov 4, 2003
    6,124
    USA
    #260 zjpj, Feb 25, 2004
    I think after time passes, enough of any car gets rebuilt that a lot of it won't be "original." As long as chasis numbers and engine numbers all match, wouldn't that make it "genuine?" I don't know - you're question really is at what point is it just an all new car? I think the chasis is probably most important.
     
  11. P4weGo

    P4weGo Rookie

    Feb 24, 2004
    0
    #261 P4weGo, Feb 25, 2004

    Im sorry. Mr G, there seem to be so many avenues of discussion, I have tried locating all that I can. It is probably all documented I just can't find it so basically laid out.

    Bryanp would you do the kindness of telling me?

    I think the designation for a P4 gearbox is 603? whatever, is the gearbox in the pictures a P4 gearbox?
     
  12. PSk

    PSk F1 World Champ

    Nov 20, 2002
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    Pete
    #262 PSk, Feb 25, 2004
    I believe it is all about continuous history, not about what part is genuine or not.

    Pete
     
  13. adesalos

    adesalos Formula Junior

    Mar 19, 2003
    252
    Texas
    #263 adesalos, Feb 25, 2004
    Enough controversy!

    Let's make sure Jim doesn't waste his time answer our questions (I don't care if it is more or less orginial or certified or verified, or... Jim isn't going to sell it, and I don't have the money to buy it), and that he can spend time on his car and taking pictures for us.

    Jim, more pictures please, your project is facinating!
     
  14. Erich

    Erich Formula 3

    Sep 9, 2003
    1,190
    Poway CA
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    Erich Coiner
    #264 Erich, Feb 25, 2004
    P4 we go.

    Go back to the first post in this thread by wax.
    Click on every one of those links and READ, READ, READ. THEN read all 4 pages of this thread from start to finish.
    There will be a test when you get back.

    Erich
     
  15. thecarreaper

    thecarreaper F1 World Champ
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    Sep 30, 2003
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    Savannah
    #265 thecarreaper, Feb 28, 2004


    i have done just that. thank you Napolis , for all your time, your patience, for sharing your passion. the hunt is sometimes better than the kill. the quest for the truth, the facts and history would make a hell of a movie. i will buy whatever you publish, whenever that is. i cannot imagine the fun and frustration in seeing this come to fruition . its a ferrari, its beautiful, like sex embodied in metal. it is history. the car is real to ME , i dont know where this P4 guy is coming from with these inflamitory questions. i love the car. what it represents of passion, of ferrari and its racing heritage. my stomach was churning reading these posts about numbers and papers ect. i wont focus on the negative, or lower myself by typing what i really feel about this guy picking on Napolis and his car.
    WAX thanks to you also for all your work on this thread. i dunno how i missed so much, so fast. having it all in one place is like settling down with an old favorite book, but this one is still bieng written and i cant wait to witness the finished car, as it starts new life. this is a great community. i am glad to be here . michael
     
  16. Restoration Man

    Restoration Man Rookie

    Feb 19, 2004
    0
    #266 Restoration Man, Feb 29, 2004
    And what the devil is the green red and ally car? P4racer can you let us know what you have there?
     
  17. PSk

    PSk F1 World Champ

    Nov 20, 2002
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    Pete
    #267 PSk, Feb 29, 2004
    P4Racer has discussed that car a few times on this forum. Try searching for the "Poor Man's P4 Replica thread ..." in the General Section.

    Pete
     
  18. P4Racer

    P4Racer Rookie

    Dec 18, 2003
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    max wakefield
    #268 P4Racer, Mar 1, 2004
    Thanks for the interst Restoration Man. I didn't mean to bring my car into this forum of chat. I got excersized by a couple of comments about my knowledge of these cars. In the heat of the moment I showed a picture that is frankly pretty insignificant. Other than I suppose it shows that I have some understanding of "our" pet subject.

    Therefore I am going to keep the car off discussion. As I have always said I think JG's doing a really good job. Theres a wealth of different feelings about these cars and their legitamcy. The bottom line is, if you are lucky enough to have a car like this, as I do, then it really doesn't matter what "nose picking armchair expert" thinks. What matters is that one has achieved ones own Everest. What others think of these achievements is their buissiness.

    If a car is made of all genuine parts, stamped or not, then the only man who will deny them a compliment is someone who is condumed by jelousy. Which is easily achieved when I see the excellent work that JG ahs done.


    However, anyone who wants to chat about making a very fast racecar that looks like a P4, I am up for anything.

    Max
     
  19. tomgt

    tomgt F1 Veteran
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    Tom Wiggers
    #269 tomgt, Mar 4, 2004
    Anyone interested in old pics (P4, some 0846 I think, all gathered from the internet)
     
  20. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ
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    Jim Glickenhaus
    #270 Napolis, Mar 4, 2004
    Yes.
     
  21. tomgt

    tomgt F1 Veteran
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    Tom Wiggers
    #271 tomgt, Mar 5, 2004
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  22. tomgt

    tomgt F1 Veteran
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    #272 tomgt, Mar 5, 2004
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  23. tomgt

    tomgt F1 Veteran
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    #273 tomgt, Mar 5, 2004
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  24. trkevin

    trkevin Formula Junior

    Nov 3, 2003
    918
    Belgium
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    K. Blommaert
    #274 trkevin, Mar 5, 2004
    I have the following:
    - #21 = 0858 at '67 Le Mans (Ludovico Scarfiotti / Mike Parkes) 2nd
    - #22 = 0848 at '67 Le Mans (Jean Guichet / Herbert Müller) DNF
    - #23 = 0846 at '67 Daytona (Lorenzo Bandini / Chris Amon) 1st
    & #26 = s/n 0844 at '67 Daytona (Pedro Rodriguez / Jean Guichet) 3th
    - #23 = 0846 at '67 Daytona (Lorenzo Bandini / Chris Amon) 1st
    - #224 = 0846 at '67 Targa Florio (Nino Vaccarella / Ludovico Scarfiotti) DNF
    - #20 = 0846 at '67 Le Mans (Chris Amon / Nino Vaccarella) DNF
    - #23 = 0846 at '67 Daytona (Lorenzo Bandini / Chris Amon) 1st
    - #6 = ?
     
  25. macca

    macca Formula Junior

    Dec 3, 2003
    698
    #275 macca, Mar 5, 2004
    In the first lot

    #10 is 0854 at Brands Hatch 1967
    #220 is 0848 at Targa Florio 1967

    Most of the second lot are P3s. The berlinetta #23 is P3/4 0854 at Le Mans 1967.


    PWM
     
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