430 2ND F430 converted

I understand about the bypass. Why is the power unit removed? Do the factory gated cars have a working e-diff?

 

Sorry, I'm certainly not trying to question a Ferrari technician. I'm just trying to understand what I've been told, which is I need a new pump motor for the F1 on my converted car for the e-diff. Here is a working e-diff on a conversion. When my conversion was completed, and they took it out for a test drive, I was told the e-diff wasn't working and it was diagnosed as a bad motor pump. Once the pump is replaced, it should solve the problem. Starts around the 8 minute mark where he discusses the e-diff on this converted car.

 

Well done getting it done in your garage. I almost wish there were parts to do for the GranTurismo too. Wouldn't that be fun, the only manual 6 speed GT in the world.

 

Without changing the throw out bearing seal I have 2 questions. Are you running ATF in the clutch line instead of Dot 4? If so how do you avoid the ATF blowing out the master cylinder seal after a few weeks?

 

Why would anyone put atf in their brake reservoir? That would be stupid. The clutch line runs from the brake master reservoir.

Also, why would brake fluid dissolve the seals in the F1 clutch bearing when atf wouldn’t? There have been fchat users that have used the f1 throw out bearing with no issues. How does it blow out?.. like explode fluid?

 

@vrsurgeon - The seals swell up like a rotting fish on the seashore.


(sea what I did there?)

 

Oooh I like that!

Rub I see is that the O,O-di-C1-14-alkyl esters in Power steering fluid should have the same effect as the glycol ethers in brake fluid... and that isn't seen..

 

Do the factory manual cars have the same F1 pump as the F1 cars? Does it just have the gearbox bits disconnected? Removing it altogether is clearly the easier option and of no concern unless you plan on sliding sideways. Oh and Lorenzo well done, again! Just my 2c worth but my 2 post lift was the best US2k I've ever spent!

 

The clutch master cyclinder is delivered with EPDM seals suitable for dot 4 fluid.

A F1 car has viton seals in the slave cylinder.

Manual and F1 slave cylinders are identical save for the seals - EPDM on the manual cars.

So, you can choose to use a standard master cylinder, change out the slave cylinder seals (lot of work to get the gearbox off), and run the fluid connection from the brake fluid reservoir to the master cylinder. This is the setup that factory manual cars use.

Anyone that’s doing the conversion in 3 hours is not doing this. They are instead leaving the slave cylinder as it is with viton seals, and installing a master cylinder with the EPDM seals changed out for viton. It’s not rocket science. You just have to install a small reservoir for ATF under the scuttle where the master cylinder lives. Or just get a master cylinder with an integral reservoir.

Both solutions will work equally well as the braided hose that runs between the master and slave uses a PTFE inner liner which is compatible with both fluid types.


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Lorenzo, what is the part number for that power unit?

 

I'm quite certain that part was not replaced in my car. That part alone is $4,000. Did you replace the F1 power unit with it? If you by-pass the e-diff, is that part still needed? Just trying to learn.

 

What EAG will have done, and what most do, is to retain the F1 pump and manifold but simply block off all of the connections to the F1 actuator. Again, ain't rocket science. The clever bit though is in re-wiring the ediff unit so that it controls the F1 pump in the absence of the TCU, which would normally be on station to monitor the pressure in the system and run the pump accordingly.

 

I believe this is what they did. Is it not possible just to reprogram the TCU without having to rewire everything? I assume this is a really stupid question, but I'm trying to learn.

 

The e-diff is indeed functional in the six speed cars. But the power unit is different as well as the ecu running it. I would assume in the manual conversions in most cases to keep costs down, the e-diff function is simply eliminated with the bypass.

 

Seems that the E-diff elimination should be disclosed depending on the conversion.

 

Well I can't speak for everyone, but I know that the EAG kits include the plugs for the F1 manifold, wiring to alter the E-diff module, and wiring instructions. You have to remember that the ediff delete is a relatively recent product compared to how long people have been converting cars.

I really don't care how people convert their cars, but I'm all for openness and transparency so that people know whats gone into a given conversion. I dont see that as giving away any trade secrets.

 

Separate reservoir on the clutch master filled with ATF. That's the only way I can see this working, otherwise as others have said the clutch throw out seals will turn to mush in short order if they see dot 4.

 

Im so impressed and proud to own an F430. Someday when shi* hits the fan, ill have a lift and convert on my own too. Hopefully by then, parts be more readily available and you pioneers will have discovered more to share. Thank you Lorenzo.

 

Excellent post!