812 Replacement Rumors

@italiafan

No 'glossing' here, Ferrari+Hybrid = abandon now, their history of engine+hybrid remain 'works in progress' with significant downsides (excessive costs, downtime, etc.), sure, some 'get a good one' but many do not...
I have just as little regard for turbocharging an exotic as I do putting an EV battery/motor on it, not only is hybrid overly complicated, it adds weight, and is susceptible to many faults...no thanks.

 

Big gains for sure which is why I am interested and yes new designs. I was initially told we would see the AV replacement this qtr but it got pushed to 2023. I believe the H replacement will be shown this year but I dont know when just yet.

 

I certainly wouldn't buy the first version from Ferrari which is why I passed on the SF.

 

Its going to look like a hyper car. In fact no rear lid on the engine and some trick exhaust setup.

 

V12 Hybrid and the H will be a V8 TT Hybrid.

 

@Gh21631
Based on current technologies, for the Aventador successor to have 1200hp that would be about 430hp additional over the existing engine...presuming the new V12 will be smaller in size and far less powerful, they must be borrowing electric motors from a Rimac to achieve that figure, and note that the Concept Two weights in over 4700 pounds (2131kg), but, of course, the new car will not be full electric so its battery pack/s will not be as large, but, I expect to achieve both a smaller V12 + 1200hp means, at a minimum, to me, of 600hp engine, 600hp electric...truly a huge dilution of the experience, absolutely non-starter (for me)...

 

Understood, and I agree.
I was just commenting because it seemed as though several posters were implying that the end of the production V12 was just announced. It wasn’t. The “news” was that it likely wouldn’t remain unassisted NA only.

 

what a shame for V10, really stupid idea to put Turbo to baby Lambo

 

Definitely will be assisted and I dont know how the power will be divided between the V12 and electric motors. Good news is it will be incredibly fast and sound good but likely heavy and over complicated. However I trust Lambo more than Ferrari with this tech.

 

Noted, but, 'end of regular production' V12 means, to many, 'hybrid-free'...but, after my thinking(thoughts posted on this thread) that car (F167) may never occur in any form...or maybe it will be using such a small V12 (3L?) that many will see it as nod to the past but not desirable...(I am speculating on the engine size), but, hopefully I am 100% wrong and we will see a 7L monster that's not hybrid!

 

This is what I have been told so far, in either case both offerings will be above what Ferrari is doing in terms of power unless Ferrari will have competing products in 2023-2025.

 

fat chance.....!

 

That would simply be the same engine 4.0TT they use for the Urus/Audi RS models.
Simply add turbo boost with a 'mild hybrid set up' and it will probably make around 700-ish power.
Again, that would be the logical 'accountant' way of running Lamborghini as they would simply 'tune' an Audi engine.
Huracan with that engine would completely rob it from all of it's appeal as that engine lacks a soul (have it in my RS7). That V10 was all the huracan had going for it; besides the 'looks'.

 

Depending on the "power split" and "battery size", once the battery is "out of its performance range" (as judged by charge level %) all you will have is a heavier, slower car (than the Aventador it replaces)...

For instance, if the new car (Aventador successor) needs the battery level to be above 20% to achieve full power and once drops below 20% will only again allow full power once the battery charge level exceeds 40% (or more)...you have no 'hybrid boost' and just the combustion motor..

And if the battery pack is less than 40kWh, expect that 'charge level' to be a regularly experienced issue...(and to be 40kWh, with current tech, it will be heavy, battery alone around 500-600 pounds (270kg)...

So, lots to know and see, will be highly curious as to what they come up with.

 

It would force their hand.
Imagine being at Cars & Coffee with your shiny new 813 Ultra Fast 850Hp only to be laughed away by the Audi eeeeh LAMBO crowd with over 300hp more....
That won't go well with a rather large non-driver portion of Ferrari's clientele.

 

sound and look is two biggest advantages for Lambo, I wonder have many customers they will lose over lack of sound

 

I dont think we can make such an assertion this early. Lets give them a chance and see how they do. The SF90 as an example uses basically the same engine as the Pista with electric assist and it is much faster but of course it comes with some downsides.

 

Exactly

 

They should consider keeping an NA V12 with no hybrid in small production (relative numbers) to keep the passionate engaged and set themselves apart from other manufacturers and the rest electric/hybrid. I have no interest in hybrids or EVs for my expensive/performance cars ymmv but if that’s what’s mandated I’ll keep what I’ve got and look elsewhere in the future if needed. Unfortunately for Ferrari that’s how most everyone I know who’s into cars feels.

 

The Urus "sport" or "perf" will be about 700HP without assist, the next version of this engine will easily hit 900HP with a hybrid setup.

 

if Ferrari don't do this then Corvette or some other manufacturer will do, Corvette already start with flat V8 in Z06
Ferrari and other manufacturers need to stop care about Europe and stupid legislation by european politicians

 

I am just thrilled that I did order a GTS, it wont be the fastest but fast enough. Looks and sound will be there as well.

 

what is logical reson to kill V10??? if V12 can be eco why not V10?

 

I dont have an answer other than cost and further separating the two models.

 

Not exactly, the SF90 is 4L (not 3.9) and is 769hp up over 711hp from the Pista before adding the weak hybrid solution that has the front motors cap out at 130mph (210kph) leaving only the flywheel boosted.

So, the SF90, engine only, is far more powerful than the Pista engine...

It appears the Aventador replacement V12 will be smaller and less powerful, so, that seems to be 100% certain...to me, not comparable to SF90/Pista