Ferrari trying to take over ferrari club

A bit off topic, but what are the status and standing of the American organization that is actually known as the Ferrari Owners Club?

Thanks.

 

They are not recognized by Ferrari SpA. It is not part of the World Council o Ferrari Owners Clubs. Only the Ferrari Club of America is for the US and Canada.

 

So apparently SpA is not interested in preventing them using “Ferrari” and the cavallino image. Are authorized dealers discouraged from supporting or participating in FOC events?

 

A. People all over the country use it without interference. Ferrari is just not very thorough in protecting their copyright. I get told within a year or so and properly so, to stop while others I know have been doing it for decades. Whatever.

B. Never really heard of that kind of interference. If you rubbed their noses in it and the club was flaunting it on the internet they might pick up the phone. Generally someone needs to drop a dime on you for you to get attention.

 

From looking over the FOC web site it seems like the club is inactive anyway,

 

Ferdinand Porsche only became a party member in the mid 30's.... but yes the guy with the mustache liked him a lot.

 

From my time as a State director - at the time Ferrari SpA made FCA club change its logo, was the logo infringement and if we did not comply it would sue - tie up the club resources etc... so that is the financial impact - along with sponsorship and Ferrari leveraging its "suppliers etc.." to not interact with FCA members etc...

I think in reality FCA club is a not for profit 501C3 - so its not a business and its under the laws of the USA ... so I think Ferrari in todays age will have difficulty in really "taking over".... I'm sure however they would be successful in pulling any form of licensed logo from the FCA - but they cant take away the name - and frankly there is no way of preventing a private citizen consumer from not displaying a Ferrari flat, shirt logo etc... in private areas....

I do agree the level of arrogance at Ferrari knows no bounds - even when you are there for a Factory tour - the arrogance is clearly palpable... sad really... & I'm a share holder too!

 

From what I understand it is an Italian thing. They cover up their insecurities with bravado.

 

He did time in a French jail after the war because of his connection to the Austrian Painter and the family had to make a significant payoff to get him released. Interesting part is neither Porsche nor his benefactor were born in Germany.

 

yes - 100 Accurate. they were "Austro Hungarian by Passport - Czech by birth... & there is the troubling issue of Tatra and Hans Lewinka... but that's another story.

 

I guess.... I think its a vestige of European society and class system. Enzo Ferrari was born a lower middle class person.... son of a blacksmith... not super poor but not wealthy. he worked hard - and because of the end of WWI and inheritance from his father & brother ( tiny amounts ) he was able to parley that into becoming one of the most wealthy and famous industrialist in the world - and Italy..... those that came after - use that name to project their own "high class - superiority"... especially in the racing team, while Enzo basically remained the same small town provincial all his life... he did love that the rich and famous had to dance to his tune... that is what it all comes from ... and it basically still works. I know it sounds crazy - but the best way to deal with them is to ignore them completely - lock them out of the US Ferrari hobby... they will change their tune.

 

The club is a 501c7 not a c3.

 

Interesting idea. Never thought of it. In their biggest market yet, would that be a slap in the face or what?

 

I did not know this...I learn something new every day.

 

Ferdinand Porsche was not really an early member, but was a member in deed - he was at best agnostic on politics -but knew where to get $$$ to foster his company. when he worked at Mercedes Benz - he was well known to the German and Austrian Royals - and even drove with Kaiser Wilhelm II younger brother Prince Henry... so Porsche knew where the $$$ was and went for that. Same with Hitler and post Weimar Germany. Porsche was not an easy guy to deal with and very stubborn in his ideas - which is why he left MB and Auto Union ( AUDI) ... and had to go on his own. Hitler liked him because of the huge F-1 type racers ... V-16 Auto Unions... and basically when Mercedes go the govt. support he petitioned directly to Hitler and split the money - that is where the Silver Arrows legends come from. during the War Porsche kept designing larger and larger Tanks and weapon systems ( really transport bases for weapons ) until even the General Staff thought this guy is getting out of control ... his design for the Maus tank - is pretty crazy... and he had a design for basically a navy destroyer on tracks...... his contribution to the Volkswagen - KDF wagen as it was known in period, was on suspension and engine placement - the engine is contested in that Hans Lewinka from Tatra came up with the air cooled design and even the rough schematics for the VW beetle... ( Not trying to be at all political but posting for Historical perspective ) there is no denying that Ferdinand Porsche I - was a Nazi - personally I think he would have been what ever was needed so he could get work... there is a famous Picture of Porsche showing Hitler the model for the beetle ( KDF wagen).... while they were not super close - they both had mutual respect.... Hitler usually did not like to be surrounded with experts - but in Porsche he found someone who shared his delusions of grandeur.

 

ok thanks... point is not for profit, so hard to allege FCA is making money from Ferrari SpA or FNA.... which will not stop Ferrari from trying to intimidate and threaten ... but I would think it very hard to prove that Ferrari has had any material damage from the clubs use of its logo, horse or any other form of registered trademark..... what would they argue - we should be Club of lovers of cars from Maranello Italy? ...

 

This would have to be a long term project... I'm sure the dealers would not like it - and some OEM suppliers etc, but in the end Ferrari cant shut off the tap, they have to sell cars and merchandize... and they cant force people in the after market to stop doing business and sponsoring FCA.... How could they not sell parts to a Private individual either... seems just a not very well thought out plan.

 

Thank you, Tom, this is fascinating, I appreciate you taking the time to write this and educating me on history. I'm very grateful to you.

 

USA is a very costly market for them to operate in and they have wanted to minimize it for a long time. With strong consumer laws, emission laws, strong civil liability courts and warranty laws that actually make them pay on warranty claims. Trouble is we are just too big to ignore. In my opinion it would be like voting out a tax. Pisses off the politicians and they try retribution but in the long run the right guy prevails.

 

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This is the original club logo devised that did not use any of the SpA trademarked elements: horse, long F, shield, etc.

This is the recently created version.
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One of the reasons these are needed is that sponsors of the club are prohibited from using the round club logo as that has the trademarked items that SpA lets only their sponsors utilize.

 

yes, I remember the original logos and all the problems around it... Its pretty sad if you ask me ... While I'm a 25 year FCA member owner... Ferrari just creates more drama than its really worth. but I get the legal aspect.

I have a letter from Franco Gozzi dated Jan. 1988 that is addressed to my Father about selling some of his Photographs - we send Enzo an 11x14 pic of Alboreto at Imola in 87 . and indicated that this was a popular seller... and the letter stated that we were not allowed to sell or market the picture due to copy right and sponsors logos etc... " you are prohibited from showing any of Ferrari SpA & Reparto Corse logos, features and elements of its racing cars" ....

 

I'm a font of useless automotive history....

 

Ferrari has been smart in never wanting to be too reliant on one market. They always tried to keep US market between 25 and 33%. There was a lesson on this from Porsche in the early 90s. Porsche got around 60% of their sales in the North American market, when the recession hit, then double gas guzzler tax, luxury tax and a Gulf War, Porsche was teetering on the brink of bankruptcy (VW obviously would have come to the rescue), if I remember correctly sales dropped to somewhere around 10,000 units.

While China can be a market equal to or larger to the US. They are very aware that the Chinese market could disappear in the blink of the eye with one Government decree.

 

Working in the car Industry on electric propulsion cars I can honestly say with great conviction that just making cars "faster" is no longer going to be "enough" for the premium brands like Ferrari. If you get to feel the rather uncomfortable "violence" of what an AWD 4-electric motor driven prototype vehicle with over 8000Nm+ of torque is like off the line, well I'm not sure everyone is going to want "that". Its not at all something that's particularly useful either in congested towns and cities, even only "1000hp" is getting on for ridiculous. The car world is changing so fundamentally now that consumers will have a hard time understanding how all of this relates to their personal use of their cars and the Ferrari brand itself will need to be significantly re-invented. Whether we like it or not government regulations have killed ICE cars and moving forward development is being driven by many people who don't even own a car and think the squishy human driving it is the weak link that needs to be eliminated out of the equation, step forward mandatory "autonomous driving in the cities" of 2029...

Innovation needs to come from many difference sources. They need to be premium yes but also fun, playful, engaging, enjoyable and exhilarating to drive or be driven in, they need to be the best of the breed or there is little point. The single dimension of speed alone (with no unfiltered V8/V12 soundtrack) is just one element but everyone will have that now even the cheapest brands will be ridiculously quick. Actually faster than most customers could ever want or handle without a raft of computer algorithms keeping it out of the hedges. Its going to be a very interesting next decade that's for sure...

 

today i went to one of my usual cars and coffee venues here in houston.
i met a porsche guy, who had brought his brand new F8..... he likes the car and was giving me a lot of comparison points to his Gt3.
he bought the car from the local dealer; working with the salesman on options etc, but chose the specs himself.
we then talked about what events to drive it to, and i mentioned that i had been on an FCA drive yesterday, and that we do this periodically and it is good fun.
he then told me that the dealer salesperson specifically told him NOT to join the ferrari club !!!!!!

ok.

this is just an anecdotal story.
who knows why the sales guy said that.
but it speaks volumes about the difficulty locally between the dealer and FCA.