Great info here!
Great info but I would just change the car. Why try to make the car something it’s not?! Exhaust I totally get, might change mine to Kline soon but this is just madness.
Normally I would tend to agree with you. But the camber and toe adjustment is well worth it and very easy - and can just as easily be reversed. The thing about these small changes are that unlike a lot of other changes, they are in fact dead cheap and the benefit is significant. Even if you don't want to track the car, it can still benefit from more front end camber etc.
I just replaced the original 2010 tires on my 458 with; 255-30/20 305-30/20 Pirelli PZC4 No issues with anything, ran 2 auto-X events, and 200 miles. Front to rear diameter stagger went from 1.5" to 1.1". Then.... Put on Hoosiers, new Oz 9 X 19 and 11 x 19 wheels 235-35/19 315-30/19 Stagger now is .5".....and CST failure warning light goes on in 7th gear, only, when lightly applying throttle. And car bucks as though stabbing the brakes. Shifting to 6th or lower gear seems to eliminate the light, and bucking. I assume that the bigger difference in diameter stagger, from 1.5" oem, to only .5" exceeded the ECU ability to work properly, but only in 7th ???...at any road speed. Any WOFO (Wise Old Ferrari Owner) out there, who can enlighten me?...any fix found? I admit to taking a chance with Hoosier sizes, as A-7's are not available in 20", and selection limited in 19".
That size difference is way too small. Your seeing it in 7th as that's where the car see a big issue. The car basically sense that you're car has lost traction, and tries to rectify this. The higher gear and speed, the more it tries to rectify this. Get them off, they are dangerous. Now as far as Hoosiers go. Unless you make some changes to the suspension, the stock setup is not set up, nor is it capable of handling the grip of the A7's - not even close. I really don't get your setup. You know you can run 255's in the front, but then you go from 255 front and 305 rear to 235 and 315? The last thing your car needs is more understeer. Your 255/305 is actually a great balance. 235/315, not so much. Here's a suggestion. Sell the Hoosiers, but keep the wheels. I take it, it is the OZ Superforgiata in 9x19 and 11x19 yes? For a track setup, the Trofeo R in 265/30R19 and 325/30R19 is a good choice. But put your 255's on and see if you have an additional 3 mm of clearance on the front inside shoulder, because you'll need that. Not in terms of radius, but rather shoulder width. I've seen others run it, so it should fit. If you go this route get 60 minutes of camber put on each front wheel, you'll need it. The car has way too little camber on the front for a high grip tyre. If you're dead set on trying Hoosiers, get R7's instead. Get 235/35R19 and 295/35R19. At any rate, get the 235/315 combo off. It is only a matter of time before that ends badly.
FWIW, the diameter stagger of a Speciale is even smaller at 0.4”. The CST must be calibrated differently from the 458 Italia. This is why I have not varied from stock tire sizes on my 458. Image Unavailable, Please Login Sent from my iPad using FerrariChat
Thank you for the timely reply...I should have been more complete in my description of set up, but mostly concerned with just what you are warning about. What is the danger, mechanically or safety, if I autocross like this, shifting manually (1st and 2nd gear), and driving on roads,keeping it out of 7th. The under steer concern is certainly valid. I started by adjusting the ride height to achieve original rake with the Hoosiers on. Lowered front 1/2" Set camber to 2 1/2 degrees negative Set toe to 3/8" out total (autocross) Hoosier 235/35/19 tread width is 9.2" vs. Pirelli 235/35/20. 8.1". OE ". 255/30/20. 8.7" new tires for street. Width stagger: Hoosiers 2.8" OE p-zeros. 3"
Thank you for the timely reply...I should have been more complete in my description of set up, but mostly concerned with just what you are warning about. What is the danger, mechanically or safety, if I autocross like this, shifting manually (1st and 2nd gear), and driving on roads,keeping it out of 7th. The under steer concern is certainly valid. I started by adjusting the ride height to achieve original rake with the Hoosiers on. Lowered front 1/2" Set camber to 2 1/2 degrees negative Set toe to 3/8" out total (autocross) Hoosier 235/35/19 tread width is 9.2" vs. Pirelli 235/35/20. 8.1". OE ". 255/30/20. 8.7" new tires for street. Width stagger: Hoosiers 2.8" OE p-zeros. 3"
I researched the stagger, and hoped, since the Speciale was .4", that it would be OK at .5" on the 458. Is there any way to calibrate the CST to work with this stagger?
I don’t know, but since it’s firmware, it should be possible. But of course the firmware is proprietary so it seems unlikely unless you could get Ferrari to do it. That said, I have heard anecdotal stories of how people have put Speciale wheels and tires on their 458s claiming no ill effects. Are the Hoosiers different diameters? Maybe that has more to do with the CST than the stagger difference, or perhaps it’s a combination of both. Sent from my iPad using FerrariChat
The danger lies in the fact that the car might run off the road. You're driving along at a high rate of speed, then shift to 7th. That bucking you feel, is not only ignition being cut, it's the brakes being worked as well. If the car suddenly thinks only one of your rear wheels have lost traction, it will apply braking force to that wheel. If this happens on a wet patch on your way back from the track for instance or the like, you can probably imagine why that would be bad. Aside from that, your ESC system cannot function properly, even when it's not bucking. It also wears down your brakes. It's just not worth it imo. I would look into the Pirellis. They are almost as soft as the Hoosiers with a wear rating of 60. And the much wider fronts will also displace heat a lot better. There isn't a whole lot that can be done with the A7 without getting a ton of rear tyre for the amount of front. There's the 325 but I just don't see the combination of 235 and 325 having a nice balance.
The Hoosiers are 25.6 Hoosier F 25.6", R 26.1" Maybe overall diameter vs. stock also affects it. btw, my toe is set to 3/16" total toe out, not 3/8"
Total diameter does not matter. What the car senses is wheel speed. This is measured on each wheel in relation to each other. Your car cannot read and does not know what it says on the side of your tyres. It just knows how fast each wheel is spinning. 25.6 and 26.1 is way off. You have gone from a 6.1% diameter difference to a 1.9% difference. This is way more than the system can deal with. Sent from my SM-G930F using FerrariChat.com mobile app
Hi Mike Last week I just installed a set of ADV.1 Rims on my 458 that are 9x20 Front Offset 44 and 11 x 20 offset 50 rear and the shop recommended your exact setup with 255/30/20 and 305/30/20 rears. So far so good with no issues at all. (only 100 miles) It looks like its about 4.5% larger rear compared to 6% with the stock set up so maybe the TC Side Slip Etc has a couple of percentile that it works within. Any thoughts folks?
So can one use MPS4S tires on the 458 stock wheels stock set up no lowering, no spacers in 245/35/20 and 305/35/20 in just the generic tire not a Ferrari rated tire? There are supply issues now and trying to find an in stock option. The Ferrari rated are on back order. The generic are in stock. The other choice is the OEM size 235/35 and 295/35. But in a Porsche rating. The generic rating is on back order. They don't make a Ferrari rating in OEM size that I can find.. What is best choice? What size and wait on Ferrari rated or go generic rating or Porsche? Thank you!
I ran into this very same issue when up in the Appalachian mountains - I (just barely) clipped a rock on the side of the road and damaged the sidewalls on the passenger side. I was kind of in a bind and could only get ‘Tesla’ rated MPS4S tires. The folks at Tire Rack assured me they were as robust as the Ferrari tires, but also contained sound deadening material. I installed and used them without incident, even tracking with them. They were absolutely fine and I could tell no difference in performance or wear. Later on, when it came time to replace them, due to supply chain issues I ordered Kumhos. I have been pleased with their performance and longevity, even on a track. I’d have to count, but I have roughly 6 track days and 5,000 miles on them. I also bought Cup 2s which I intend to use on track only, as it’s getting warmer and my knowledge of the car, it’s handling characteristics, my skills and and tire management has increased. I also did some alignment set up changes per the recommendation of @Il Co-Pilota. I have since backed off a little because the tires were wearing a bit more on the inside. At the end, it’s all a compromise anyway, Next up are Novitec springs and Surface Transforms rotors.
You have a few options. The Lusso set works well. That's K1 in 245/35R20 and 295/35R20. Then there's the generic setup in 245/35 and 305/35. You can also run the Porsche set. Personally I like the Lusso set the most as the 458 really responds well to a wider front. None of these sizes require any changes and are a direct fit. It is also important to stress that K spec has ZERO bearing on quality. Sent from my SM-G930F using FerrariChat.com mobile app
I did the switch below as recommended by Co-Pilota. Had to wait 9 months because of the rear’s were on back order. 245/35/20 305/35/20 The wait was worth it. I’m happy with the recommendation… Ray
Thank you Ray, that really helps! I'm glad it works and it is worth waiting for. I'm going to order tomorrow!
I’m also a fan of the Kumho PS91. Just as good on track as the P-Zero and MPS but for half the cost and they seem to be more durable and last longer. My favorite “guilt free” 458 tire. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
