918 vs CGT/Enzo/675LT/Tesla/Veyron

That really doesn't surprise me at all.
Since when was "involvement" completely about performance?

 

I was at Canepa's yesterday and Bruce told me his latest 959 with the new Motec ECU was now running about 830 HP.

 

Nice review


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Why would it do that ?!?

Who says they need to have less power ?!?
Given the advancements in technology, they can make "rudimentary" cars (as you call them) with way more HP.

The 90s produced the most iconic supercars of all times: F50, Diablo, F1 etc.
For me, to this day, the F50 remains the best supercar ever made.
**** progress !!! At least **** your definition of it. For me progress means an analog supercar with way more HP. That way you still get maximum driver involvement and connection between man and car.

 

Great post.

 

Because back then cars had slower steering and turn in, in order to be driveable without driving aids. They also had half the power.

You defeat your own point, admitting that cars need more technology to be driveable with this kind of power.

That's just your opinion. Others would say that the '80s, or the '00s, or whatever decade produced the most iconic cars. You just prefer the '90s and I guess that's because you were a child growing up during that decade and those were your poster cars. By the way, the LaFerrari has been voted the fans' favourite Ferrari of all times: https://www.ferrari.com/en-EN/magazine/articles/fan-favourites-the-ferrari-hall-of-fame

 

The f50gt had 850hp didn’t it ?

there is no way the la Ferrari is the fans fave if you polled a large enough sample size imo

 

720 CV actually, but the F50GT was a race car on slick tyres, meant to be driven by professional racers on closed circuits. Irrelevant in this discussion.
The LaFerrari was voted as their favourite by 794,000 fans. Not large enough of a sample?

 

fair point about the gt

the la Ferrari got 290k votes, 794k was for the decade

to me at least this poll isn’t definitive

 

Originally, they had about 750 HP. But F50 GT 01 was crashed and rebuilt and now boast around 950 HP.
And it looks freaking amazing.

 

So, they can simply give it a faster steering and turn in, problem solved.

I never said/implied such a thing. Weak / poor / bad drivers need more technology to drive them, good drivers don't.

It's not necessarily that, it's about the fact that you were the one actually controlling the car instead of a stupid computer. I hate all the **** electronics they have now. Plus how heavy they are.

I don't care how "fans" voted. The LaFerrari is indeed a beautiful car, but it's a ****ing porker, way too heavy. A proper driver's car should weigh no more than 1300-1400 kg. Around 1000 kg would be ideal.

 

That's the point. If they gave them faster turn im. it would unbalance a chassis taht doesn;t have the safety net of the electronics. That's wht F1 cars have a wheelbase of more than 3.5 metres!!!

Not true. Even F1 drivers are quicker with the systems turned on!

The computers make you faster and allow for more friendly handling.

I guess they don't care either about how you feel... The figures you quote are just arbitrary.

 

They might be quicker, but they can also drive damn fast without those electronics.

I don't want more friendly driving, I wanna wrestle/fight the car, you get more enjoyment that way.

Of course they don't care how I feel, they are money driven like all companies. It's better to make 1000 cars and sell them to poor/clueless drivers than to make 100 and sell them to purists/proper car enthusiasts.

 

Holy thread revival Batman the last post before yours was 5 years ago!

 

That just your opinion. Most people disagree, hence cars are becoming more driveable. Even racing drivers will tell you that they prefer a friendlier handling car and that such a car is ultimately not only more enjoyable, but quicker too.

I wasn't talking about the companies. I was talking about the fans that voted against what you prefer.

 

Pretty much agree with these statements here. Gone are the days with modern cars where you, the driver, are actually driving without assistance from the nannies.
These is definitely more appreciation when you have to work at controlling the car.


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“Video game”… no bueno
…need engaging


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this.

the problem is if ferrari shipped a car without these devices then many people would crash them.

 

Ferrari can't ship any new (road) car without these systems. They are mandatory by Law for a number of years now. Anyway, anyone who feels like taming a 600-700-800-1000 HP car without traction control can always switch it off. You must be a better driver than an F1 champion who tried the same thing though (at 0:38)...

 

I actually didn't know all of the systems were required by law tbh

what is true though is the f12 tdf was universally praised and loved for being hard to drive and relatively easy to lose control of

 

And the CGT even moreso… the TC on it is laughable.


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for sure, I've never owned one but I know people who've had close calls in theirs.

not quite on the level of the 996 gt2 though, I know 2 people who were killed in theirs (RIP) within the first two years of owning them, both experienced drivers (this was when they were first released)

 

A car that tries to kill you is a bad car, no matter how you cut it.

 

Most people disagree cause they are not great drivers, hence they need driving aids.

It's irrelevant what the fans voted. 99.9% of them have never driven a single Ferrari flag car, let alone all of them to be able to compare.
Also, most likely those who voted are kids who simply pick the car they think looks best.

 

So what if people would crash them ?!?