812 Replacement Rumors

In many parts of the US the fastest lane is the right lane as the left lane huggers are oblivious to the the rules of the road- it use to be Volvo drivers but now it’s the EV crowd-Pious er I mean Prius drivers being the worst offenders


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Anecdotally, I see more accidents on the M4 section in the U.K. that has 50mph limit with average speed enforcement cameras the whole length. Predominany near the exits. Remove the average speed cameras. Get rid of the arbitrary low speed limit (it is three and sometimes four lane wide motorway) and allow folks to use their judgment. With greater variation in speed it will be easier and safer to filter between traffic and change lanes. When everyone sticks rigidly to 51mph and tail gates because it so slow, more accidents happen when folks won’t slow to let others cross lanes to get to the exit.

Adding these systems to cars will make it worse. If there comes a point where the car actually limits speed to the speed limit, people will just drive around with the pedal all the way down. All the time. Remove discretion and judgment and that’s how people will drive. Resulting in more accidents.

 

Any more updates on 812 replacement.

 

I would agree with you if they gave us no choice. Since we have a choice though, it's no big chore to push a couple of buttons. It's the same with the ESP settings, isn't it? Now, imagine aeroplane pilots who have to push hundreds of buttons before they even take off... It's part of the game.

I don't know how things are in the States, but in Europe it's certainly not a suggestion, and depending on the country/region, they are strictly enforced. I am the first to admit that I break them regularly, but if I said to a traffic police officer that I regard them as mere suggestions, I would get the maximum fine and/or a court indictment...

I agree with you, I also hate the car telling me what to do. But as long as the system is defeatable, I am fine with it.
PS: There is also an easy way to defeat it. just put a sticker on the camera lens that reads the traffic signs. Problem solved, Alexander the Great style (the Gordian Knot and all. ).

 

Suggestive in terms that something has to be posted for a safe set of standards and are enforceable but no one abides by them. You can drive swift and safe as the data showed that even without enforcement at all during COVID crashes went down. Less congestion despite a higher speed yield safer results. Its no seatbelts and all the alcohol and dope smoking that made the roads more dangerous when accidents did happen according to the report I read.

Thinking that speed limits can also be known from GPS/SATCOM navigation and a database. Also, certainly V2X radios will alert road speed 24/7. Cameras are handy on new roads and construction zones but are useless in bad weather.

 

I get the feeling (reinforced by current line up and capital markets day presentation)that the 812 replacement may be positioned as more of a GT car than the 812.Without opening the old debate about what the 812 is does anyone have any info or thoughts on how Ferrari will position the new model ?

 

I'm thinking its going to look like a Roma in the front, the 812 Omologata in the back, and like a 250 GTO from the side. It's going to be very slightly more compact than the 812 and will probably have a V12 with some sort of mild battery assistance, but purists can hold out for a NA V12 (hopefully). Sounds like no more V12 after. I think it will be positioned similar to prior V12s, "GT when you want it, but beast mode when you feel the urge."

 

https://www.topgear.com/car-news/supercars/european-supercar-makers-have-been-given-reprieve-their-switch-electrification

Fingers crossed this helps the odds that the 812 gets a proper V12 NA replacement...

 

Unfortunately Ferrari are currently producing at the rate of 13000 cars per year so this probably won't apply (and is another example of faulty & unquestioning journalism)

 

The total production number is irrelevant. What matters is how many units are sold in the EU. That 10,000 units limit refers to EU sales.

 

If my understanding is correct that just refers to how such manufacturers will manage their emission reduction until the 2035 deadline after which ICE won’t be allowed in the EU anyways. So that already means there won’t be anymore ICE in the EU after 2035. My feeling is at best we will see another V12 GT production series car as a replacement to the 812 and after that NA12 / V12 hybrids will be available only as Iconas or special limited series which will be priced at several millions

 

Not really. The decision they made last week allows for carbon neutral synthetic fuels and/or hydrogen. Thus, ICEs may survive beyond 2035 if such fuels become commercially available.

 

I thought manufacturers had until 2026 to prove to the Commission that these can be viable and acceptable. Even if that is the case given how fast V12 are disappearing and the pace of electrification V12 will become a lot rarer, more exclusive, R&D for new hydrogen/synthetic fuels will be a lengthy process and require a lot of investment and therefore NA engines if still produced in the future will be ultra exclusive in a world of mostly hybrid and EV’s and will cost an absolute fortune. We’re already seeing for how much money Monzas ( which were not that successful at launch) and Daytona SP3 are selling for.

 

I am more concerned about where all that electricity will come from.

 

By 2035 it will be clear to the general population EVs will have no effect on climate change and rolling blackouts will confirm how unreliable wind and solar is.
This will not be the case with our fearless leaders who will continue to gaslight the population and vilify the climate change deniers ( I don’t deny it, it’s just foolish to think we mere humans who have been on earth for a minuscule speck of time can alter the course of climate change)
The geopolitical upheavals, and wars fought over energy resources will become more frequent and the earth will be a less safe place.
And for a little dystopian fun- Ferrari V12s and V8s will be hunted down by EVs and the engine blocks melted down and the cars stuffed and placed in the Natural History Museums on display as extinct creatures from earths past…


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This is really off topic, but it is a fact that climate changes have been constant on the planet, even before the existence of the human kind. Short of an asteroid falling on earth changing the climate dramatically though, these changes had happened over the course of thousands of years. What we are seeing in the last 250 years though (since the beginning of the industrial revolution) is way too quick for us not to be part of it. Is it by coincidence that the temperature started rising so quickly since we started pumping out CO2 and destroying the ozone layer? Of course rare sportscars have a minuscule effect, but for political reasons (equality and all that) they cannot be exempted. If carbon neutral fuels can save the ICE, I am all for it; hope that the politicians will also agree.

 

I thought the ozone layer was fixed?

 

Yes I agree it’s way off topic but relevant to what the 812 replacement (and other future Ferraris) will be. Unless we go all in on nuclear there is no way solar and wind can do the job of getting us carbon neutral without the second coming of the Dark Ages.
Also the world is already way overpopulated with CO2 producing humans ( yes we exhale a lot of CO2 and other noxious fumes from the tail end)to be carbon neutral and the last I checked the human race continues to get bigger and our earth and technology is not keeping pace with it. Also the western world already is far closer to being carbon neutral than the Asia Pacific and 3rd world countries who continue to use carbon production energy sources to catch up to the west and it is virtue signaling and folly to think the west can afford to help them compete with us.
I personally don’t think we can “flatten the curve” of climate change with the current (and projected) population of the earth. Does that mean we shouldn’t try? Of course not . But our governments should be assisting private enterprises to explore all promising technologies and then get out of the way as opposed to it dictated by a few bureaucrats who know little about everything but want to control as they personally invest in the technology they have chosen. In essence it is no longer survival of the fittest or best but survival of the politically connected.
Whew…time for a nap… or better yet a drive



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Agreed.

Human bred cattle are by far the worst offenders in that regard.

 

actually, there is absolutely no point in 'trying', it will make absolutely zero difference...

when you consider the earth's weakening magnetic shield and how that affects climate to the recent temperature history of the past 10,000 years, it is obvious there is nothing we can do, we are simply along for the ride

Start at 52second mark:


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Remember this hole in the ozone layer was fixed by stopping the use of a few chemicals in spray cans - "p*gs arse". Same as acid rain that was going to WIPE OUT the Black Forest (when last I drove through there in an F12 it looked quite fine to me).

Same narrative same BS expect this time we have social media and a connected world and hence a level of BS we have not been exposed to before.

Big yawn the whole thing - now where are the keys to the 812?

 

Please stop.

 

We’re done for so let’s enjoy our toys while we can!


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Yes exactly! I have no idea why people keep comparing it to the Daytona.
I think the car that PF tried to make a modern interpretation of the Daytona was the 599, especially the rear design cues.