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488 Odd Battery Issues

Discussion in '458 Italia/488/F8' started by Hopeful, Sep 8, 2022.

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  1. Hopeful

    Hopeful Karting

    May 31, 2019
    153
    Vero Beach, FL
    Full Name:
    Tony M.
    #1 Hopeful, Sep 8, 2022
    Had a 4 month old battery (Interstate MTX-48) that wouldn't start my 488 even though its on the tender 24/7. Thought my tender might be shot so I bought a new tender. No difference. So I figured it must be the battery so I installed a new one. No difference.

    This appears to have started right after my last Annual Service/Brake Recall Fix which was a couple of weeks after I had installed the 4 month old battery. The 4 month old battery was working fine when it went in for service and since Ferrari had the car for 2 weeks it should have reared its head while they had it if it was a problem at that point but they did not note any issues.

    The alternator charges the battery fine when driving and the car will restart the next day or two but the voltage will gradually drop down over a few days even though its on the tender (as if the tender is not connected and the parasitics are dragging it down). When this happens, I can get the car restarted if I leave the tender connected and hit the reset button so it puts out a heavier load of juice. Otherwise, the voltage will gradually drop over time as far as 11.9.

    Any clue as to what the problem might be? Could the brake recall software update possibly have caused this? Any fuse in the path that might be blown? Could a disconnect/reconnect on the battery fix it? I would suspect that a short somewhere would kill the battery quicker and more thoroughly.
     
  2. PMiranda

    PMiranda Formula Junior

    Jul 23, 2004
    635
    Austin, TX
    #2 PMiranda, Sep 8, 2022
    I'd check that the terminal connections are fully seated and tight. Maybe they disconnected the battery for the service and didn't get it tightened correctly after?
     
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  3. Shermanator

    Shermanator Karting

    Aug 31, 2018
    82
    SoCal, Colorado
    Full Name:
    Sherman Gregory
    #3 Shermanator, Sep 8, 2022
    It sounds like some electrical load is being left on. Something that is pulling more than the 4 amps that the tender can put out. What lights are on on the tender after you have left it connected for several hours or longer? Still just three lights or less, or are they all lit up? Do you have an aftermarket audio system or other aftermarket electrical equipment? Have you examined the car in the dark for any lights that are on? Have you listened carefully for any blower fan or other motor running? There are also a couple of unusual failure modes of the alternator that could cause it to pull current the engine is off, yet charge when it is running.
     
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  4. Sargepug

    Sargepug Formula Junior

    Mar 23, 2020
    888
    NYC
    #4 Sargepug, Sep 8, 2022
    Agreed on above, your tender is not the issue, you most likely have a short somewhere in the system....
     
  5. Extreme1

    Extreme1 Formula 3

    Jun 27, 2017
    1,388
    Santa Clarita, CA
    #5 Extreme1, Sep 8, 2022
    Do a load test on the battery.

    Amazon sells nice load testers for $35. You may have a cell or two going bad.


    Sent from my iPhone using FerrariChat
     
    Boiler Inspector likes this.
  6. Shermanator

    Shermanator Karting

    Aug 31, 2018
    82
    SoCal, Colorado
    Full Name:
    Sherman Gregory
    #6 Shermanator, Sep 8, 2022
    He said he already replaced the battery and it made no difference.
     
  7. Hopeful

    Hopeful Karting

    May 31, 2019
    153
    Vero Beach, FL
    Full Name:
    Tony M.
    #7 Hopeful, Sep 9, 2022
    The battery that I thought might be bad was thoroughly tested by an Interstate rep after I removed it and it was found to be AOK. I can't find any lights or accessories on unless its like the refrigerator light (can't tell its on until you open the door and then it is on) and I don't hear any noises. Both the old and the new tender indicate the battery is full after short while (all lights lit). A short may be the answer. How the heck does one confirm or trouble shoot that?
     
  8. mike32

    mike32 F1 Veteran

    May 13, 2016
    5,927
    Isle of man- uk
    #8 mike32, Sep 9, 2022
    Pull fuses out for things not used when car parked overnight. Do a few each day until problem sorted
     
  9. Shermanator

    Shermanator Karting

    Aug 31, 2018
    82
    SoCal, Colorado
    Full Name:
    Sherman Gregory
    #9 Shermanator, Sep 9, 2022
    If all of the lights are on on the tender, the tender is able to keep the Battery up to float voltage (about 13.8V). I don't see how you could be at a voltage of 11.9 volts if the tender had all of the lights on. If the tender can keep the float voltage up (as indicated by all lights on) you do not have something drawing down the battery as I suggested earlier. (lets not use the word "short" here)
    What reset button are you hitting in order to get the car to start? How do you start it with the tender plugged in? My 458 will not let me try to start it with the tender plugged in. The standard tenders only provide about 4A maximum, so are insignificant for starting the car.
     
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  10. Hopeful

    Hopeful Karting

    May 31, 2019
    153
    Vero Beach, FL
    Full Name:
    Tony M.
    #10 Hopeful, Sep 9, 2022
    Below is a pic of the tender. You can see all lights are on and on the left side of the tender is a reset button which starts the charging cycle over (all lights go out and start coming back on sequentially). On the 488, the tender attaches externally to the rear bumper. Car does not seem to know/care whether it is attached or not when you go to start it. When I try to start the car with all lights lit on the tender (assuming the car hasn't been driven for 4 or 5 days), it will not start. It also will not start if I disconnect the tender. If I call up the voltage display in the car, it indicates anywhere from 12.4V to 11.9V depending on how many days the car has not been driven. However, if I hit reset on the tender and try to start the car, it will start.

    It led me to believe there was something wrong with the tender but, like I said earlier, I bought a new tender and the results were the same.


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  11. Shermanator

    Shermanator Karting

    Aug 31, 2018
    82
    SoCal, Colorado
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    Sherman Gregory
    #11 Shermanator, Sep 10, 2022
    This is getting very interesting. My 458 Speciale disables the start button if the tender is plugged in. It puts a warning on the left TFT display to remind you to unplug the tender. This is a nice feature to prevent one from driving away with the tender plugged in. I am surprised the 488 does not do something similar. Is it possible to drive a 488 away with the tender plugged in?
    The fully lit up tender indicates that the tender thinks it is connected to a battery at well above 13V. When the car won't start it is showing less than 12V. My first step in diagnosis would be to measure the voltage on the battery with a multimeter with and without the tender plugged in.
    I believe there is a fuse between the tender connector and the battery. Maybe that fuse is blown. If that is the case, I don't understand how the tender would light up at all. I would think that it would act as if it was not connected. It is worth finding that fuse and checking it though.
    It is strange that pressing the reset button on the tender enables the car to start. As I mentioned, the 4 Amps that the tender puts out is nowhere near enough current to start the car. When it does not start, does it try to crank over slowly, or does it make no sound? Do the displays go dim? Is it trying to start?
     
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  12. Hopeful

    Hopeful Karting

    May 31, 2019
    153
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    Tony M.
    #12 Hopeful, Sep 10, 2022
    Thanks, I'll have to try and figure out where that fuse might be. Sounds like a possible candidate. I don't know if I can drive away with the tender attached. I've never tried but I will. Certainly there are no indications put up while the car is still in Park. Depending on how many days the car has been sitting on the tender without being started or driven, the car will make some noise but not crank over if the voltage is up around 12.4 and just dim out the displays if it is lower.

    I'll let the car sit for a couple of days so the voltage is low and check the battery voltage with and without the tender on. I'll also check it with the reset button pushed.
     
  13. MANDALAY

    MANDALAY F1 World Champ
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    May 23, 2013
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    ANGELO
    #13 MANDALAY, Sep 10, 2022
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2022
    Your tender is OK. Never start the car with the tender connected. IIRC you actually cant.

    Your battery is TOAST thats it. You can still have a dead battery ( some of the cells damaged ) with the tender showing all the lights on.

    Change the battery.

    A simple test would be use a starter to start the car. If she starts its the battery and its either dead or on its way out. The only time a starter wont work is when there are too many dead cells.

    I have this one

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    Back in 2018 I was the first to point out the 488 GTB had parasitic loss. One day going into the garage I noticed that the 3rd brake light the LED's were slightly lit. I complained to Ferrari but you know nothing

    Always have the tender on. IMO 2 weeks at Ferrari has damaged your cells.
     
  14. MANDALAY

    MANDALAY F1 World Champ
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    #14 MANDALAY, Sep 11, 2022
    At night this is what you will see.

    The top LED is the alarm

    The bottom row is the third brake lights. Whether the alarm is on or of the 3RD brake LED's will be lit. The is always current happening in the Ferrari.

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  15. Mafiaboy1975

    Mafiaboy1975 Formula Junior

    Aug 10, 2019
    261
    South Africa
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    Mick
    #15 Mafiaboy1975, Sep 11, 2022
    For what it’s worth my 458 sucks power if the mirrors are folded in, the radio and navigation controls stay slightly light up. You can only see it it a dark gararge.

    When the mirrors are in the normal position there is no problem and everything is off.




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  16. mike32

    mike32 F1 Veteran

    May 13, 2016
    5,927
    Isle of man- uk
    #16 mike32, Sep 11, 2022
    Have a look on amazon or e bay for a volt meter that plugs into your power socket- then hit the starter and see how far the volts drop to. If its a battery problem the volts will drop right off under the starter load. The volt meter will have a connection say like a sat nav
     
  17. Shermanator

    Shermanator Karting

    Aug 31, 2018
    82
    SoCal, Colorado
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    Sherman Gregory
    #17 Shermanator, Sep 11, 2022
    He has done this twice already.
     
  18. cre8fun

    cre8fun Rookie

    Nov 2, 2015
    20
    #18 cre8fun, Sep 30, 2022
    Damn, just went in the garage, my LEDs look the same. never knew that.
     
  19. LagunaSecaMike

    LagunaSecaMike Rookie

    Dec 27, 2014
    31
    California
    Full Name:
    Mike
    #19 LagunaSecaMike, Sep 30, 2022
    Yep. My 2016 488GTB center mount brakes lights are dimly lit.


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