430 - 2022 F430 DIY Clutch Job Summary | Page 2 | FerrariChat

430 2022 F430 DIY Clutch Job Summary

Discussion in '360/430' started by JM280z, Aug 21, 2022.

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  1. JM280z

    JM280z Formula Junior

    Aug 22, 2020
    706
    Full Name:
    Jake
    Today took about 4 hours. The hardest part was seized exhaust hardware. I had to sawzall a bolt off. I use Evaporust (found at Home Depot) to clean hardware, awesome stuff. I’ll replace some hardware and isolators during this process too.

    I started by removing the exhaust. I have S Line exhaust and Top Speed Sport Cats so other than one of the nuts/bolts seized it came out real easy.

    I then removed the heat shields surrounding the gear box. Then the throttle bodies. Then the 4 bolts holding the power steering reservoir to the sub frame. Then all 4 corners of the sub frame.

    Nothing difficult but take photos to remember where the sensors and vacuum lines go. I also put some bright blue masking tape on hoses and electrical cords that are easy to lose track of. Write down what you do and organize your hardware in order and write notes next to it; I like using cardboard on the floor or a table for this.

    Next step will be the main bolt/mount of the gearbox, with a Jack underneath. Disconnect the 4 vacuum lines to the intake manifold, and disconnect the half shafts from the gearbox. Then lastly, get a friend to help lift out the sub frame. I’ll drain the engine oil to reduce weight and also good time to change it since the dry sump reservoir is on the gearbox.

    After that, it’s on to the actual gearbox internals.

    I was impressed at how clean my intake manifold is. Never been over filled like many Ferraris! (*cough* my 599 *cough*)

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  2. Greg Larson

    Greg Larson Rookie

    Nov 12, 2018
    24
    oregon
    Full Name:
    Bob the Builder


    While you are in there, replace the trans mount and valve cover gasket's. Its pretty cheap and easy to do. I did it on my when I did my clutch a few years ago. GL
     
  3. Sj_engr

    Sj_engr Formula 3

    Sep 15, 2020
    1,307
    San Jose
    Full Name:
    dc
    Here is the difference with the Scuderia intake ports: (ignore non CF upper intake in background)
    [​IMG]
     
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  4. coinball

    coinball Karting

    Dec 1, 2004
    69
    Raleigh, NC
    Full Name:
    Eric
    Not to hijack this thread, but as I'm beginning to amass parts for my DIY clutch job, would anyone suggest anything else beyond these 3 items from Hill Engineering?

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  5. tstuli

    tstuli Formula Junior

    Jun 12, 2018
    374
    NC
    Curious how the velocity ap clutch is performing? Have you had a chance to drive with it yet?
     
  6. Greg Larson

    Greg Larson Rookie

    Nov 12, 2018
    24
    oregon
    Full Name:
    Bob the Builder
    I thought iIwould chime in on this. I did my clutch on my 430 a few years ago. There is a thread here on Fchat. As for parts needed. The Hill stuff you show there is good. Don't forget about a new pilot bearing and the internal F1 sensor. Also the tool to remove the TOB flange from Hill. And I would do the trans mount and valve cover gaskets. Easy to do while it's all apart. GL
     
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  7. coinball

    coinball Karting

    Dec 1, 2004
    69
    Raleigh, NC
    Full Name:
    Eric
    Good call on the HE tool...trying to place just one order to Hill and assumed Ricambi or Scuderia would be getting the remainder of my money on the other parts. I'll check out your thread too, thanks for the info!
     
  8. JM280z

    JM280z Formula Junior

    Aug 22, 2020
    706
    Full Name:
    Jake
    Look at my invoice on the first post, for more parts to get.

    Velocity AP is the way to go for clutch and flywheel.

    I asked the owner of Velocity AP to clarify his product:

    “Sorry for the slow response. Just getting my legs back under the desk from SEMA. Most of the information about the clutch is contained in the Youtube video I made, but the key points are:



    We did not buy the tooling or rights to the parts from the OEM supplier, we contracted an OEM supplier to make the parts for us and invested in all the tooling etc. to do so.



    Using the OEM friction formula, purchased from Valeo (supplied under one of their other brands)



    Tested the parts for 2 years, across 15 different vehicles for quality & durability prior to release.”



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  9. JM280z

    JM280z Formula Junior

    Aug 22, 2020
    706
    Full Name:
    Jake
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    Hey all,
    I spent another ~4 hours to get this far. I’m at the point where I’m ready to separate the gearbox from the engine and start swapping parts.

    It took two men to remove the subframe, but it wasn’t hard, just super careful. It will take two men to rock the gearbox apart. I have an engine hoist and gear straps to hold it but we could have used a Jack underneath.

    It did get a bit tricky, or rather need to pay attention, when disconnecting many hoses such as radiator reservoir and oil reservoir hoses and some vacuum lines. I use blue painters tape to mark where the go and also to not have them hide from me during reassembly. I had to cut some zip ties, so remembering where the wires and hoses go will be tricky, so I took pics along the way.

    If you can’t read the sequence of what I did, just ask and I can help.

    Overall, it’s still a job for a intermediate wrencher, so far… Beginner would be categorized as oil changes and brake pad only kinda guy.


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  10. LorenzoR

    LorenzoR F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed

    Great idea organizing the bolts like that
     
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  11. Flyingbrick242

    Flyingbrick242 Formula Junior
    Silver Subscribed

    Feb 26, 2017
    605
    Northern AZ.
    Hi Jake,

    Any updates to your project.?
    Thanks..!
     
  12. JM280z

    JM280z Formula Junior

    Aug 22, 2020
    706
    Full Name:
    Jake
    Harbor Freight is where I buy most my tools. You’ll get an immediate ROI on any tool needed for this job. So don’t worry about having to buy a couple hundred dollar hoist or extra jacks, curved wrench sets, or anything.

    I’ll update progress now too.


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  13. milrad

    milrad Karting
    Rossa Subscribed

    Apr 10, 2020
    52
    DFW
    Full Name:
    Jason
    I plan to tackle this job, on a manual, in the next month or two. This thread is really helpful!
     
  14. JM280z

    JM280z Formula Junior

    Aug 22, 2020
    706
    Full Name:
    Jake
    About 30 min of work today. Ended up just talking about life with my friend for a couple hours instead of being productive. That’s the best part of the jobs in my opinion.

    I separated the large oil line from the top of the oil fill tunnel. Started rocking the gearbox back. I had to play with the height of the hoist. Once the gearbox separates, the engine will drop a bit and that’s ok. Just make sure the gearbox pulling straight out from gearbox shaft.

    Once separated, I had to lift the hoist some more so the gearbox would clear the lower cross bar, then i twisted the front of the gearbox to the driver side. Due to some cabinets in my garage, I had to remove the rear driver side wheel to get underneath to access gearbox internals.

    At this point, I remove the 8? allen head screws that hold the clutch on. My impact wrench isn’t enough for the 8 17mm bolts that hold the flywheel on, so waiting on my friends better dewalt one. I also remove the two allen head screws that hold the clutch sensor in the gearbox bell housing. I need to buy some claw foot wrenches for the two pins that hold the throw out bearing on in the gearbox bell housing.

    About another 30 min of disassembly then it’s just assembly!!!!

    I bought my F430 with 8,300 miles and the clutch was slipping, especially when it wasn’t warmed up. Now it has about 15k miles and would barely make it up a hill and take 15 min of warming up for the clutch to engage well. The car has a recorded 0 seconds of clutch overheat and no track time. It’s apparent my clutch was ruined by the previous owner using the F1 system / shifting incorrectly.

    Luckily, this gives me an excuse to put way nicer hardware in like the Velocity AP clutch and flywheel and Hill Engineering throwout bearing.

    You can see the hotspots on my clutch and flywheel.

    Overall, this is a plug and play job. Seems overwhelming but if you organize your hardware in order, take notes and pictures on progress, and do it in a month so you don’t forget stuff (not what I did) then this is a pretty easy job…. It’s not advanced in my opinion. It is a bit daunting but just keep at it and you’ll probably be fine. This job definitely requires organization and attention to detail for reassembly.

    I have not consulted the service manual for the whole job. Not sure if that means I’m missing things, making it harder on myself, or that this is actually easy. I’ll definitely use it for torque specs for assembly.

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  15. clean512

    clean512 Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    Feb 4, 2010
    2,028
    Full Name:
    Josh @jtcarprojects
    Nice project you got going.
     
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  16. JM280z

    JM280z Formula Junior

    Aug 22, 2020
    706
    Full Name:
    Jake
    Hey All,

    Quick update. I hit a few roadblocks ending my progress for two weekends in a row.

    1st, I needed a better impact wrench for the flywheel bolts. Without an impact wrench it will just turn the motor. My battery Ryobi wasn’t enough, who woulda thunk! Harbor freight had a corded hammer drill for $80 that worked great, 1,080 ft/lbs.

    2nd, the dang guide pins for the throwout bearing in the gearbox… yes, the $180 tool on Ricambi would have saved me time and stress. However, we made our own, pic below. The crowfoot wrench set did work on the lower pin but the top pin is much more enclosed by the bell housing.

    More parts:
    I damaged the plastic bracket that holds the f1 sensor onto the throwout bearing so I have to order a new one. I didn’t realize the new sensors didn’t have it so I was manhandling that bracket trying to get the top guide pin off.

    I also ordered new engine mounts and gearbox mount.

    More tools:
    -higher power hammer drill ($80 harbor freight)
    -seal puller for rear main seal (AutoZone loaner)
    -bearing puller for the little crankshaft bearing (AutoZone loaner)
    -bushing tool to remove gearbox mount ($100 from Scuderia parts)

    So far, it’s really not that bad of a job…. Organize your bolts and order of tasks. Then be really meticulous putting everything back. Sometimes little vacuum lines or electrical lines can be easy to miss or not put back to where they below so they can rub on exhaust parts and such.

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  17. JM280z

    JM280z Formula Junior

    Aug 22, 2020
    706
    Full Name:
    Jake
    Finally, some progress. Work has been busy!

    Next steps:
    Tap the roller pin out of the throwout bearing to swap over the f1 sensor position guide. New pin was in my parts order. Pics below.

    Press out the crankshaft bearing with some bread and press it in with the clutch alignment tool. Sounds goofy, but bread works great as it lets air bypass and compressed hard. Grease didn’t allow air to bypass and didn’t work. Tap the new one in by using the old one as a buffer between new one and light hammer taps. The bearing sticks out 1/5th of an inch or so.

    This is also what took me 2 weeks to update this thread…. The crankshaft seal / rear main seal… because my clutch and flywheel had hotspots, I assume that seal hardened from heat. I couldn’t get out out for the life of me! I finally got it out with a slide hammer by drilling a screw into it. There’s a metal ring inside the seal it latches in to. All other tools failed, pics below. Make sure not to damage the mating surface of the seal to the housing, that’s why the screw tool with two hooks that pressed to the bearing is my favorite, but the hooks just bent. So I risked drilling a screw into it, pre drilled it first, and super careful so it doesn’t go in sideways or walk into the wall that the seal mates to. Be very careful if yours is stuck… Amazon had all the tools. Slide hammer specific for removing seals with a cap that holds the screw is what got it out for me.

    On a side note, part 201160 needed to be ordered too. It’s the mount that the throwout bearing rides in to and f1 sensor mounts to. Mine had wear on it on inner guides. I strongly recommend replacing it as the wear could cause inconsistent travel or hang ups and mess up the sensors readings. It’s plastic so seems like an easy cheap thing to replace while you’re at this. Conventional Ferrari parts stores were out of stock everywhere and I found it on eBay. Pics below. Image Unavailable, Please Login

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  18. nando5

    nando5 Rookie

    Oct 28, 2021
    19
    Victoria BC Canada
    Full Name:
    Fernando
    Love the progress, I’m planning on getting the clutch done on my 07 430 this year. I’m glad I stumbled across this thread as I hadn’t heard of AP before. Unfortunately living in Victoria BC, my only option to get the work done locally is get the work done at Maserati Victoria, then trailer the car over to Ferrari of Vancouver to do the clutch re-learn etc. would love to hear how the new clutch works out when work is all complete.

    keep up the good work
     
  19. Sj_engr

    Sj_engr Formula 3

    Sep 15, 2020
    1,307
    San Jose
    Full Name:
    dc
    Wow nice work. Lots involved and makes me glad I just lucked out with my car having 91% clutch life when I got it.
     
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  20. JM280z

    JM280z Formula Junior

    Aug 22, 2020
    706
    Full Name:
    Jake
    Dude, I hear you but buying the equipment to do it yourself is worth it imo. I recently got quoted $1700 for corner balance and alignment. $2k bought be laser alignment equipment and corner scales. Quality stuff for racing. Now I’ll be profitable on it after considering my savings and getting paid to do it for friends. My friend has the iPad with the OBD hookup cable and software to do all the relearn, programming, diagnostics, etc. I don’t think it’s that expensive either… Where I live, none of the “professional” shops even have it for who knows why…

    But, we are all in different financial positions and some enjoy such work and others don’t. To each their own. Do what makes you happy!


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  21. yelcab

    yelcab F1 World Champ
    Consultant

    Nov 29, 2001
    12,662
    San Carlos, CA
    Full Name:
    Mitchell Le
    Jake, so it's not yet all back together and no feedback on the clutch package?
     
  22. JM280z

    JM280z Formula Junior

    Aug 22, 2020
    706
    Full Name:
    Jake
    Hey All,

    Sorry for the delay; work is just so busy!

    Progress today was a couple hours. I was going to pull the brass plug on the crankshaft and reseal it with Loctite 518, as recommended from other FChatters. However, it’s not leaking now with only 12k miles so I think I’m going to leave it.

    As always, I cleaned up everything I can see and any threads get cleaned with a brass wire brush.

    I gently tapped the crankshaft bearing in with a rubber mallet. Next is the flywheel. There’s two teeth rings on the flywheel, the smaller diameter tooth ring faces forward. There’s a spacer plate that goes on the aft side facing the gearbox, between the bolt heads and flywheel. The x8 17mm bolts we put on hand tight. Then I got a wrench on them firmly, criss crossing. Then torque wrench to 68 ft/lbs. (plz double check torque specs during reassembly… plenty of workshop manuals available online and from fchat users). Torquing the flywheel was a two man job; I had to hold a crowbar against a bolt and flywheel teeth while my friend torqued it (pics below).

    Now for the clutch… oh great, my clutch alignment tool doesn’t fit in the clutch spindles, but does on the old one. So I test fitted the clutch onto the gearbox shaft and it works, despite the spindles on the new clutch being ever so slightly different than the original. So i ordered an amazon universal clutch alignment kit (TOMMARS 11 pc… link below)

    I went to the gearbox now. I put on the new throwout bearing. Make sure to put the throwout bearing on WITH that black plastic F1 sensor magnet guide thing installed on it; it will shake and rattle but have it on. The black seals of the throwout bearing press against the housing, plus just think how those hook bracket things mate to the guide pins. Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login I also bought new guide pin springs, and don’t forget the brass or bronze caps that hold the spring from the gearbox end. The springs mount directly into the throwout bearing, with the caps on the other side mating to the gearbox. This is a balancing act… first use some ATF fluid to lube the seals in the throwout bearing and the shaft it rides on. Then press it on. Slide it forward a bit then put the springs in place, and don’t forget the little caps on the aft side of the spring. Then push the bearing aft enough to hold the springs in place. Make sure it’s aligned so the magnet is facing passenger side (that the f1 sensor mates to) and mind the brackets for the guide pins. At this point, I used blue loctite on the guide pins. Getting them threaded was tricky and took two hands but it eventually happened. Then I used my home made tool to torque them pretty firmly.

    Now I slipped the f1 sensor into the housing from the passenger side port. I did some cleaning at this point too again. Now you have to take the two aluminum bolts, with blue loctite, and mate the F1 sensor to that guide that the throwout bearing magnet goes into. You can get a long allen wrench into those bolts from the pax side port on housing. Then torque it firmly. Now get the slightly larger, but still small, other two aluminum bolts, with blue locktite, and mount that black plastic bracket to the gearbox.

    Summarized order: throwout bearing into place, springs, guide pins torqued down, f1 sensor to black bracket, black bracket to housing. Image Unavailable, Please Login


    TOMMARS 11 Pc Universal Clutch Alignment Tool Kit for Centering of Clutch Disc White https://a.co/d/ezUh3Kp


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    Attached Files:

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  23. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

    Apr 29, 2004
    34,075
    Austin TX
    Full Name:
    Brian Crall
    #48 Rifledriver, Apr 29, 2023
    Last edited: Apr 29, 2023
    Generally speaking power tools are not needed to remove flywheel. I just use a screw driver to hold flywheel an a 17mm end wrench to remove bolts.

    Did you use bushing mount locktite on the TO bearing sensor where it plugs into the hole in the bearing housing?

    Aluminum bolts on the sensor? Never seen that.
     
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  24. JM280z

    JM280z Formula Junior

    Aug 22, 2020
    706
    Full Name:
    Jake
    I used locktite on all 4 screws that hold the sensor to the bracket, and the bracket to the TO bearing. Plus, locktite on the TO bearing guide pins. Is this what you’re asking?


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  25. JM280z

    JM280z Formula Junior

    Aug 22, 2020
    706
    Full Name:
    Jake
    Forgot to add, one of the flywheel bolts is slightly off center from the others. You have to spot which one that is, and get that spacer plate and flywheel aligned accordingly. I got it on the first try! If not, you just have to rotate the pieces until all bolt holes align.


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