For Sale F430 Spyder F1 w/issues need sale pricing help/advice

Nice looking car. GLWS!

 

Are you willing to share the latest info from the Ferrari dealer that your reference in your latest post where you reduced the asking price As a potentially interested buyer it would be good to know what the dealer said based on their inspection of the car.

 

I haven’t seen one sell anywhere near these prices since summer

 

According to the Hagerty "valuation report" that you posted, a F430 in "fair" condition is worth 151k. With your "asking" price of 105K, are you saying that your F430 is much worse than "fair condition"?

 

Those Hagerty numbers are way high.
Just looked through all the BaT sales and they were nowhere near even $151k for super low mileage examples. 08/09s fetch more, but barely.
Only thing even close to those valuations are 6 speeds.

 

VCGs normally won’t leak to the point of you seeing it on the floor. But the undertray would be collecting all the drops anyway so not seeing it doesn’t mean much.

If you really want a fair market value put it on BaT.

 

To the OP your issues are tip of the iceberg.
Anyone with experience with Ferraris knows deferred maintenance and problems are the entry. Once the mechanics are in the phone call occurs. Why don’t you come down and I’ll show you some things …

These are expensive conversations. And they escalate quickly. The offers you are getting are low to offset this risk. At 80 k you said you would keep the car. I would. But be prepared.when you start driving things become apparent and they add up.

You have a car which I would politely say has “stories.”
And those cars have diminished value compared to the average well maintained or at least documented car.

So you can bring it up and use it or sell it. Or sell it as is and take the highest of the low offers. Most people who make these offers will do it themselves and save the difference but cannot have the confidence in the condition of the car.

Good luck.


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Zero effort gets you 80Kish cash on a "free" car (which I still don't believe) or grasping for a rube who doesn't know 20K is 1/4+ market over?
No detailed MPI from a dealer? I don't believe that either. Even my indy Toyota shop bombards me with electronic communications begging for work.
Out of country car and you used the words wiring and dash? Stories are just the beginning.
It's a parts or disposable project at best here in the US. Someone tried to do something cheap and pull one over. Long been proven impossible with these cars.

 

I can't add much to what BigTex and others have said, and I'm no longer in the market for an F430. But the prospective buyer of a Ferrari probably isn't a DIY guy, and wants a near perfect car. Zip ties on a side mirror suggest an owner who couldn't be bothered to maintain the car. I remember paying express shipping to buy the little metal trim insert on the passenger side mirror of my 328, and I suspect a lot of Ferrari enthusiasts would similarly be on top of even minor items like that.

You've listed it at $105K, so let the market speak to the value.

 

I hate to say this, but I think you may have "burned" the car on here. I think there's enough on this thread to scare any of the guys willing to pay $100k or more on this car. I mean I wish you luck, truly. I just think the guys who are willing to work on this car are going to follow the thought process of a lot of the responses your are seeing. The slightly more "naive" (for lack of better word) first time buyer looking for a deal may get all the way to writing the check, but not sure if they will sign it. Naive is not an insult btw, I will be the first one to say I was naive to what comes with the ownership experience when I got into the Ferrari world.

I'd expand more on the middle east ownership. Are you saying this car was built and sent directly to the middle east to an owner there? Which country? How many years did it reside there? What mileage period? Was the owner an American living abroad, or owned by a local national.

Another potential piece of advice, and I'm not sure how mods would advise to do this, but I'd create a new thread to sell this car with just the facts and price. This thread says you want advice, while you're simultaneously selling the car. So everyone is going to chime in as to why it's priced incorrectly. A formal sales post, will limit the responses to those interested in the car at the price. Currently, a prospective buyer is going to have read through all the reasons they shouldn't buy this car at your price. I haven't seen a single response saying the car is priced fairly, which should tell you something. Keep in mind you're on a site full of veteran Ferrari owners, it may suit you better to find a marketplace with less knowledgeable potential buyers.

 

@mjposner - The bottom line is this: If you try and sell a car with problems, you're going to be taking a beating on price. If you solve every problem on the car so it's a "no stories" vehicle, then you can start to get what the car is worth. Until then, you've got a car with stories and nobody wants to hear any of them. If I was in your position, I would fix everything, including the mirror, and then try again without all the nonsense.

It doesn't matter if you're selling a house, car, boat, or aircraft. If it has problems, you're going to take a beating.

 

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For historical purposes

 

Those Hagerty values are laughable. BAT is where it's at..

 

Seriously. Everyone and their mother should take out an agreed value policy at those numbers.

#2 and 3 represent nearly a 70-80% premium on top of actual selling prices.

 

I think he is confused, those are the factory 6-speed prices, not F1. If I could have gotten $282,000 for my 2009 430 which some of you guys have seen is loaded and looks like it rolled out the factory showroom with my wallet open for anything it needs, I would have sold it and bought a 512TR.

The fact remains, the OP wants to sell a non-USA car in the USA with indications that it needs some TLC. In the Ferrari world, this is a Red flag as everyone has indicated. These cars get up there in price for any fixes that require parts or involved labor and typically cars that are not maintained with an open wallet or an open schedule (for those DIYs) have depressed prices because of the unknowns. If you need an engine rebuild because of something hidden, it could be the cost of a new Kia or Hyundai. People expect a discount based on the risk. The better the car's condition, the more likely it was cared for and will not have a major issue.

Now I'm surprised he hasn't used the "It's worth more because the car is from Dubai and won't beep at you when you turn the key" (Reference to that other thread in the F430 question on how to lower the beep volume).

We are not trying to be jerks about this with the OP, just trying to get him to understand why he is getting the offers he is getting and how he can get more for his sale if he fixes all the issues with documentation about the repairs. He doesn't seem to be listening and is trying to convince experienced Ferrari owners/buyers that we are wrong. This is very similar to the Corvette owner's attitude when they sell their cars. For some reason, every corvette is a 1-of-1, and no matter what you tell them you can't convince them of the true value of their car based on real world comps.

OK, enough of my semi-rant here...

 

See my comments in Red
"I think he is confused, those are the factory 6-speed prices, not F1." Not saying Hagerty is right, but I did state that value was for F1 cars. Perhaps I should haved added this:


"The fact remains, the OP wants to sell a non-USA car in the USA with indications that it needs some TLC" Its a US spec car (and beeps turning on and off) that just got sent overseas for a short time. It could not be imported legally to US otherwise. In your original post, you show the Arabic plate on the car and say the car was originally imported into the Middle East.

"hese cars get up there in price for any fixes that require parts or involved labor and typically cars that are not maintained with an open wallet or an open schedule (for those DIYs) have depressed prices because of the unknowns." The car has been maintained with an open wallet, did you read the service history? If the car was maintained with an open wallet, you wouldn't have the issues you have. They would have been taken care of. Don't let Ferrari service and repair sticker shock on a few things imply that all the needed work has been done, it obviously hasn't or the car would have no issues.

"People expect a discount based on the risk." Agreed, that is why the car is being sold for less. I only posted $105,000, as I stated, because I was required to by the moderator. I agree its not worth that much. If that is true, post your value and say it's firm.

Now I'm surprised he hasn't used the "It's worth more because the car is from Dubai and won't beep at you when you turn the key" Nope see above, but nice try at humor. You haven't heard anything yet, I have a whole book of Dad jokes.

"He doesn't seem to be listening and is trying to convince experienced Ferrari owners/buyers that we are wrong." I am listening. I thought this board was more a hands on group that was willing to service their own Ferrari, not run to the dealer at $329 an hour for all their service. I guess I was wrong. Many people here with cars out of warranty use independents for major work which are less than $329 an hour. I just dropped about 14k on my own F430 for a clutch, misc transmission maintenance and manifolds with an independent and consider that just normal major maintenance for these cars, not even repairs on my 13+ year old car. Some here do enjoy doing general maintenance like oil changes themselves, but very few would tackle a clutch or AC repair on a car. I appreciate and enjoy the more DIY repair stories people post, but they are not the majority here who tend to have the means and just want to enjoy driving a Ferrari.

Yes I got some silly low ball offers ($70k and 80k), but I have also received plenty of offers north of $90k as well, so while this F430 may not be for you and some of the members here, it will be sold for a fair and decent price. Good luck then, I am not saying you won't get a good value, just not top value for a car that needs work. I think the point everyone is making to you is that you should sort the car out and you will get more than you invested in sorting as it is less risky for the buyer. Don't sort it and expect that buyers will factor in the risk and repairs. Also don't expect a DIYer to not value their time. Just because a repair is a $500 part, don't expect them to only want $500 off the value of the car for it. They will want close to what it would cost to sort at an independent because time is money. Even if they enjoy doing the repair, they could be fixing something else. no one's time is free. Plenty of plumbers don't fix their own toilets because they would rather be doing something else and just pay another plumber, their free time is more valuable.

 

Congratulations on the sale. I look forward to the new owner posting in the 360/430 section here.


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I resemble these quotes! To your point, I had originally planned on trying to do the coolant thermostat and accessory belt myself. Purchased both for a total of about $160 USD. Was going to get around to it, but got too busy with other things and didn't want to lose a day trying to get it sorted. So now I'm dishing out $1,700 in labor for Ferrari of Austin to install them. I'm still questioning my decision, but I didn't want to have the car sitting around longer waiting to install, especially when I currently have my car on the market.


@mjposner - I'm truly happy for you man, it's tough as nails to sell a Ferrari privately, much less one with the background you presented. I'm sure it's a weight off your back. Curious as to what the final sales price was; I'll throw in my best guess that of low $90's? I'd say the big things you had going for you is convertible, and color combo. I can see 70's and 80's for the investors/flippers/price testers, and a true long term holder coming in at $10k over that after you posted more of the service history.