F12 TDF or 275 GTB?

May I point you to the second part of the sentence, sir? Our friend said that it feels and also is really fast.

 

Let me clarify….. 100 mph feels and is fast in a 50+ year old car while it’s dawdling along in a 2015-built 700 hp speed demon. Hope you can grasp that perspective.

 

The old adage…
“I’d rather drive a slow car fast, than a fast car slow”
(I see your point)


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No argument there, sir. That's my gripe with classics. My E Type feels sketchy at 100 mph. In the meantime a 2018 diesel Mercedes taxi is rock solid at that speed. I don't even want to discuss brakes...

 

If that’s the choice, then it’s hard to imagine passing on the 275 when you could just go get a C8 Z06 if you simply wanted the sensation of a car you could only reasonable drive at 5 or 6th 10ths…

 

I’m gonna get blasted here… haven’t driven a 275, but the oldest F car I’ve owned was an F40 and I just didn’t jive with that car’s driving experience. The older style clutch, brakes, gear shift etc were just not something I could get used to. Thus, a 275 I’m sure would not be a driver’s car for me, although it is achingly beautiful.
The TDF on the other hand is a bucking stallion that takes measured respect to drive. It is a rare car that I have to throttle modulate, as even the electrical nannies can’t save a driver from excess power oversteer. It is really at the end of an era where rawness is not bastardized by electrical inputs.
I also think it has a timeless design when perhaps, 50 years from now, it will be looked upon as we now admire the 275.
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Great question and I lost count but looks like the 275 is winning

With that said I’m all in on The 275
she is of a elegance unlike anything made today

Driving experience that is unmatched, —- it’s like great intimacy with a beautiful woman—

these are 2 different beauties and each deserves accolades for what they are

 

you can get as similar sensation in other ferraris (esp the pista and 296) if you fully turn the traction control off, it's pretty scary!

 

Eddie you would love driving the 275. In some ways its more modern feeling than the F40. It feels less body flex, the engine is more instantly responsive (nothing shy of the 458 has that initial throttle response of carbs), the whole car feels like a bit of an old school E36 or 46 M3. Very friendly / natural handling.

My own opinion is they didnt make a better overall handling front engine car until the F12. They really knew what they were doing back then.

Anyway the choice here is tough because they are both in the best of each school category- best of old school or best of new school. Its really what lines up best with your own preferences.

You also have to consider with a 275 youre likely to have more maintenance involvement, the TDF is relatively bullet proof. All of this goes into the total ownership experience.

I love both but in the end Im a little bit more in the new school, if I have to choose.

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I would take the 275 for the exact reasons many here have spelled out. What confuses me is the better part of your recent engagements with me has been denigrating anything modern Ferrari offers yet here prefer the computer with floppies. Mind you nothing wrong with liking the newer cars, (which has been my point yeah?)

This comment is just not congruent when you argued with me the newer cars are objectively worse in every conversation I’ve had with you. The same exact reasons you stated why the older cars are better are repeated here in favor of the 275 over the tDf, so I’m admittedly perplexed.

Which is it? Did I change your mind?

 

I believe the F12tdf is the perfect mix of crazy and elegant, but my choice can vary if you were to offer a 250 swb instead.

 

You can just stare at in in your garage and be in awe of what men created by hand.

 

Depends on where you are in life. The problem with driving a perfect 275 GTB is it is perfect 275 GTB. You are throwing dollars out the window, if you want to keep it perfect. While anybody who owns a $3 million car probably is not worried about rock chips, most, if not all these cars are destined to end up in collections.

Brian has already alluded to the problem with a F12 TDF, where do you drive it? Drive a car like this at 9/10s on public roads is like playing hot potato after pulling the pin on a hand grenade. Sooner or later, something bad is going to happen. I can see someone buying this car and cruising around the hood with an occasional track to see what it can really do.

Edit: Jon Shirley regularly drives his real TDF on rallies and such, which is great. It's kinda funny. There is always somebody watching the car. I'm sure it gets expense cleaning up the car after a rally, but with his net worth, that's chump change.

 

Said no real car guy/gal EVER !

 

That’s how I feel (& have always felt) of just about any “high performance” car built in past half a century or so.
Heck, even a Daytona is difficult to enjoy even at or above 1/2 of its “as intended” capabilities on public roads.
OTOH, most people buy/collect/own them mainly for bragging rights, rather than actual driving/usage enjoyment.

 

If I had lottery winnings of 900 million in the bank then maybe… but why take the chance of having someone in 2020 Dodge Challenger hellcat with no insurance and a 450 credit score trying to race you and ramming your ass? Now your out millions

 

It would have to be a 275 gtb4 as the short nose 2 cam didn't really impress me behind the wheel. A Daytona was more fun. They are however more beautiful for sure than a F12 tdf.

A 275 gtb4 in dark red would be hard to beat.

 

Id probably insure it.
Not sure where you drive but I have never really had that trouble. Even if I did they can be fixed you know. A couple of years ago a GTO had a bad wreck on a road in France and now you would never know it happened. The TDF would probably still be laid up for parts.

We had a lot boy crash a brand new 575 rather badly. It sat for a year waiting for parts.

 

No doubt I would drive it, but again, would be afraid to all the time. I could replace a TDF.
Also, if I had that kind of money to buy a multi million dollar iconic Ferrari it wouldn’t matter if it was wrecked or damaged.
At this moment, I would be petrified lol

 

When I found out there are no Mulligans in life I got over allowing allowing fear to dictate.
I'm 67 and still ride motorcycles. Been doing it for 52 years. If I denied myself lifes pleasures I'd just eat a bullet and get it over with.

 

Well said

 

I love SCUBA diving and have always told my wife, if I die in a diving accident, just know I died loving life. I have an F12, not a TDF, but told my sales associate when I picked it up, “I didn’t buy it to look at it.” Before I bought it I had to get my head around the fact that it is a car that was made to be driven. 275 GTB or TDF, doesn’t matter as long as you drive it. As they say, you only live once, and it’s only money that you can’t take with you.


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I have had many clients with large very valuable collections. What do you mean they dont drive them? Of all the collectors I know, some very well known only one does not drive them. My other half got a ride with Jon Shirley in his 250 TR an hour or so before the transmission took a dump. Where do all the cars at Colorado Grand, California Mille and similar events all over the country come from. Trust me, they do not think of it as throwing money out the window. A long time client with a very nice yet eclectic collection told me "I don't mind a patina but it need to be my patina". He had prewar supercharged Alfa, Duesenberg race car. D Jag, 300SL I could go on and on but he drove them all. He transports them all over the world driving in events. He stores an old Alfa race car in Italy so he can do Mille Miglia etc. Brings it home every 2 or 3 years to get it made all good again and ready for another few years. David McNeil has a pretty incredible collection. He, his son and his daughter drive them every chance they get. She drove his TDF (A real one) in the Colorado Grand a year or two ago and somebody I know that was there said she knew how to stand on the gas.

 

I applaud those who drive. Sadly, there are some who don't. Their money, their choice.

 

Not to be a sourpuss, but my legs still hurt from hip surgery because I’m trying to find the balance between pain and hiccups, another problem with the old bangers is parts, but more importantly mechanics who know what they are doing. How many Brians are out there who know anything about these cars? A good friend of mine had the transmission in a Daytona rebuilt by people you know. It works, but it ain’t right.

Of course, I’m not the situation in a F12 TDF is any better. Any chimp can hook up a reader. But what do you do from there?




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