1979 Ferrari 308 factory performance upgrade car | Page 3 | FerrariChat

1979 Ferrari 308 factory performance upgrade car

Discussion in '308/328' started by doggydoggen, May 1, 2023.

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  1. doggydoggen

    doggydoggen Karting

    Apr 25, 2023
    120
    Sweden Umea
    Full Name:
    Doger Karlstrom
    #51 doggydoggen, May 7, 2023
    Last edited: May 7, 2023
    i'm still investigating, it seams like Ferrari didn't mount any factory "Sprint package" also found the word "LeMans Package", Can it be 2 different packages?
    it seams that it was the dealers that did the fitting of the packages, also the claim that it was black valve covers, that i believe is not true, the GTB seams to have black covers on early models(1975 with engine code BB?) and red covers on later models?, i have seen photos of one car that have documents that it is sprint pack installed, and that car have aluminium normal valve covers, or maby some was painted black and other not, customer maby wanted aluminium?, i get some info here and there.

    Anyway, can be this shop that made the engine build on my car.

    https://www.menudeimotori.eu/english/sport-auto-modena-the-historical-service-for-classic-ferrari/

    Don't know if that is good or bad?, but it seams like both marinello and dealer in modena used this shop for engine rebuilds tuning and other stuff, Know that the head chef of the mechanic(dont know the name in english) name was/is Gianni or Gianini
    This mechanic worked on shop? in Modena and he told former seller of my car what was done with the engine, it was high comp pistons and race camshafts for one thing.
    any bells ringing from someone, when the name Gianni or Gianini, and what kind of shop is this SportAuto in Modena? i will not stop until i know the story..=)
     
  2. doggydoggen

    doggydoggen Karting

    Apr 25, 2023
    120
    Sweden Umea
    Full Name:
    Doger Karlstrom
    #52 doggydoggen, May 7, 2023
    Last edited: May 7, 2023
    i Quote myself, think i found the shop and guy ho did my engine, his name is
    Gianni Diena's "Autofficina Sport Auto", Modena
    they made racecars and prototypes

    http://www.barchetta.cc/english/all.ferraris/detail/12467.365gtb4.comp.conv.htm

    also found this info, but can it really be this guys shop, seams unbelievable

    i have taken this text.
    Sport Auto is still there with the sons of Aldo Silingardi sen. and Gianni Diena sen. They came from Ferrari and worked from 1963-66 at Automobili Serenissima/Sasamotors (and Garage Camellini) in Via Malmusi (down town Modena just around the corner of Assitenza Clienti). After 1966 they formed Sport Auto and moved to the former premises of Carrozzeria Gransport in via Toscanini, where - among many other projects - the Cobra Daytonas' and the first two Serenissimas' bodies were made. 1974-80 they were commissioned by the factory to build several Ferrari 312P(B) from left over parts and restore F1 cars. And serious rumor goes that Gianni Diena was an illegitimate son of Enzo Ferrari. However, they were well connected to Ferrari and the works. About building chassis and P4 drawings I have no information.
     
  3. Ferraripilot

    Ferraripilot F1 World Champ
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    May 10, 2006
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    John!
    Same package, different name depending on who you ask. The P6 cams are often referred to by some old school Ferrari mechanics as 'Lemans' cams as the P6 grind was, as I understand it, designed for either the Daytona engine or 275GTB 4 cam engine for Lemans.
     
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  4. doggydoggen

    doggydoggen Karting

    Apr 25, 2023
    120
    Sweden Umea
    Full Name:
    Doger Karlstrom
    But my cams seams to be something different then P6?, the car arrives in the end of this month, then i can take the valve covers of and be sure.

    Today i found the Gmail address for this SportAuto company, so i have made a looong mail with all the info i have, talking to Gustaf Dieden for example.
    i hope i get a answer.=)
     
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  5. sltillim

    sltillim Formula 3
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    Nov 22, 2009
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    San Diego
    Wouldn't be surprised. They were probably in the GT4 LM car. It also had a Daytona clutch. I know a couple Gt4 owners have done this clutch as a performance upgrade.
     
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  6. JAM1

    JAM1 F1 Veteran
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    Oct 22, 2004
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    I own one of the 11 Michelotto group iv cars and you are correct. Outside of the block, heads, and starter there is nothing factory in the engine and even the heads were heavily reworked. My car came from Padova with two spare sets of sleeves, two spare sets of pistons, spare rods, alternate gear sets, alternate transmission gears, and alternate cams which are still with the car today. The majority of components that were factory made 308 were also modified/altered so much so that a side by side comparison with a factory 308 shows virtually no part on these cars exists without Michelotto fingerprints on it.
     
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  7. smg2

    smg2 F1 World Champ
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    Apr 1, 2004
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    8yrs ago we got a spare engine in. Casting date code from '74. GT4. It was rather unique. So during the rebuild I sent the cams out to get profiled... The part numbers are listed as Leman cams and they are indeed different from the P6 variant. It was a rather unique engine from top to bottom. I don't have the folder on it so I can't quote off the various numbers.
    It's still sitting in the engine room wrapped up. Replaced the pistons with modern, valve seals.. basic redo.

    The cams were what caught my attention, drilled pin holes all the way round and the lobe profile was very aggressive and FAT.
     
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  8. Ferraripilot

    Ferraripilot F1 World Champ
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    thank you for posting! I would really enjoy seeing the various bits (cams pistons etc). Unicorn level items. None of that stuff is published!
     
  9. doggydoggen

    doggydoggen Karting

    Apr 25, 2023
    120
    Sweden Umea
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    Doger Karlstrom
    Here is some better photos on the car, and the 16 wheels same as in brochure
    and it also have the koni shocks, damn it, need to get documents on the engine....everything else check.
    also photo from a reportage in Sportscar magazine 1985, they tested the car on the Track, and they called it LeMans edition and they claimed that 0-100 was 5 sec and 280km top speed, the magazine is in swedish but maby i translate the stuff that matters later, i also have another magazine with a reportage about the car.=)
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  10. Grim Reaper tr

    Grim Reaper tr Karting

    Oct 6, 2014
    128

    The black and white brochure is from Maranello UK showing the "Sprint pack " options. I have several in my collection.

    There is a road test of a UK 308 GTS with the full "Sprint pack " in AutoSport Magazine in the October 25 , 1979 Edition which I also have.

    Your car is missing the rear spoiler and driving lights that were part of the full UK market "Sprint pack".

    Grim
     
  11. doggydoggen

    doggydoggen Karting

    Apr 25, 2023
    120
    Sweden Umea
    Full Name:
    Doger Karlstrom
    #61 doggydoggen, May 9, 2023
    Last edited: May 9, 2023
    The brochure is only for compare the brochure wheels with the wheels on my car,
    i don't have that brochure.

    Don't think spoiler or driving lights had anything to do with the "Sprint Pack", you probably could check a box what you wanted, thes add ons was strictly cosmetic for what i can read, because my car was intended and build for racing for Gustaf Dieden, he probably didn't want the extra weight with spoiler and driving lights fitted, or for some other reason?, im gonna talk to him about this.=)

    Also my car had the kit mounted in Modena Italy(Not sure ho did it yet), But im excited today, because Michelotto Engineering answered me today and wanted to help me found out ho did my engine, all this companys like Michelotto, Dienna on Autosport and Ferrari had a close corporation on those days,
    for what i have read on documents, Uk cars had the Spring Pack kit mounted by a Uk dealer named Maranello Concessionaires limited and not in Italy?
     
  12. doggydoggen

    doggydoggen Karting

    Apr 25, 2023
    120
    Sweden Umea
    Full Name:
    Doger Karlstrom
    Today the 308 arrived, i have taking it for a spinn, when it is not warmed upp it was not easy to drive, but after warm upp, wow!!??, the engine spins so nice on idle, didn't expect that?, it spins like a honda engine and when you put your finger on the engine it is almost no vibrations, also when you drive you can have a high gear and with low rpm with no problems, everything is smoot, i have read about ppl telling that it was not easy to drive on low rpm so the first thing i was thinking, it cant be the P6 cams in this engine, im fooled!!, then i checked what numbers it was on cams, and this number is on the exhaust cam 107189 P6
    i don't know why my experience is so different from some other ppl, maby engine is also ported or something, i did read from documents that they have had the engine to a Swedish weber specialist and they have changed jettings, recipe of nozzles and tuned the engine.
    will make a driving movie and a movie when engine idle later, now i need to calm my nerves.
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  13. doggydoggen

    doggydoggen Karting

    Apr 25, 2023
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    can this be one thing that make things different, in Sweden we only have quality 95E10 and 98E5 octan.
     
  14. doggydoggen

    doggydoggen Karting

    Apr 25, 2023
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    the cold idle.
     
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  15. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

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    Michelotto was under contract with Ferrari until recently but not exclusively. They did lots of outside work. Except for F1 they did most of the Ferrari racing work. In the case of the 333 Dallara also built them so I assume while Michelotto was their primary contractor there were others.
     
  16. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

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    All it does in make the clutch pedal heavier. It improves nothing. Have driven a lot of them.
     
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  17. Ferraripilot

    Ferraripilot F1 World Champ
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    Really happy it is running well for you! I am wondering if Michelotto used much higher compression pistons in your engine than the factory Borgo pistons, which are only 9.8:1 or thereabouts in a stock engine. P6 cams have just far too much duration to work with such a low static compression. Intake valve closing with P6 cams and Borgo pistons puts dynamic compression in the 6:1 range. Needs at least 10.5 or 11:1, then I could see them being somewhat street friendly.
     
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  18. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

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    Not disagreeing but 11: 1 would be awfully high for any Ferrari engine of the period. I have had a few race motors of the period open and do not recall ever seeing compression that high. They always seemed to shy away from high ratios. F1 motors maybe but never had an early F1 apart.

    Factory stated compression ratio in early 308 is 8.8
     
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  19. sltillim

    sltillim Formula 3
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    OHHHH Shes a baaaad girl! Sounds deep and can definitely hear the cammed out lopey idle.
     
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  20. doggydoggen

    doggydoggen Karting

    Apr 25, 2023
    120
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    Doger Karlstrom
    Im Happy to, i was worried the first time i was gonna drive it, thinking this will be a nightmare, was going in to town, it is absolutely no problem cruising on 1500rpm, BUT, it doesent like to make hefty changes, with that said, if you take it easy like you do when you drive in town with moderat revs and easy on the throttle it is smooth like a normal car, but if you try to hit it from low revs, then you feel that the engine is made for high revs and you have low torque and it struggles like engines do with race camshaft, i have a Ultima GTR with a race engine with high lift flat tappet cam and this is a car that it is impossible to drive under 2000rpm, anyway the 308 have never stalled and the idle is always 800rpm,have as you can suspect tried this over and over again with a eagle eye on the revs, so the engine comes alive in about 2800rpm and pulls strong upp to about 4000rpm, then the next breath comes and it pulls very good indeed upp to 8000rpm,
    i will try to make a youtube movie when i drive in town so you can see how it behaves.
    will also take a camera and film inside engine and intake, to see pistons and if it is ported.
     
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  21. Ferraripilot

    Ferraripilot F1 World Champ
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    here’s a video sprint pack engine I set up 12 years ago (gosh has of been that long???). But compression is slightly higher at 10.5:1. This car made a little more than 220 hp at the rear wheels. I want to say it was 223-224hp. A strong early stock engine makes 190-200 at the wheels and a strong 328 will make 215-220.

    It was not that terrible to drive as long as you are gentle with the throttle at low rpm. Sitting in traffic would be much worse.


     
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  22. doggydoggen

    doggydoggen Karting

    Apr 25, 2023
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    Doger Karlstrom
    sitting in traffic seams to be the main difference you dont think it can be ignition timing in combination with jetting?, setting up webers on this kind of engine take time and lot of testing, welding in a 02-sensor in exhaust will make it easier, you also have the change in atmosphere changes and altitudes, that make it even harder, it should be so much easier to have modern injection, tune and you are done.=)
    but it seams like the adjustment of my weber was a lucky one, sitting in traffic and start is no problem, i can even start in second gear and don't need to rev like crazy, it is very smooth, i now it sounds weird, and i exculty think it is weird, but that is how it is.:) i feel like i must make a video pretty soon, must buy this kind of fancy movie cameras, hard to hold a phone and drive smooth..=)
     
  23. Ferraripilot

    Ferraripilot F1 World Champ
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    John!

    That was AFTER setting it up with a wideband O2 sensor. Jetting was absolutely correct as it could be. The issue is reversion at lower rpm caused by the massive amount of overlap the cams have.
     
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