I’ll be back up WGI in Sept, last time (May) I ran with a fella in a C8 Z06 and a few C7 Z06s. And of course a bunch of GT3s and 4s. The C8 Z06 runs hard, but is heavy and has to brake far sooner than the 458 Ch (not unexpectedly) and fades after a few fast laps (I think it’s heat from tires). I’ve had two more encounters (same driver) with C8 Z06s at Barber and Road Atlanta, but the poor guy has had tranny issues from the get go. Hopefully an aberration. I agree about turbo modulation, it’s counterintuitive to be hitting throttle before an apex to counter the lag. And to my surprise, the 488 Ch is faster, but not so much so that it justifies the significant track support required trackside compared to the 458. Me personally, I’m just gonna track the 458 Ch, these new cars (including the C8z) have far too much that can go wrong. The 458 Ch is a winner, I applaud Ferrari for what they’ve done. And WGI is a great track, certainly one of my favorites!
Good to hear from you here again. Apart from the tranny issues(which hopefully they sort) I fear the C8z is in the mold of a few other cars, 5 really fast laps and then the weight does it in, which would make it not a Gt3 or Gt4 competitor. But lets see how it goes on some hoosiers. Cant imagine the c8z is much more complex than a 458, but maybe its not developed by such experienced hands and maybe the bean counters enforced more compromise, maybe it just needs a few years to be fully sorted. They certainly seem to improve vettes with each year of experience, year 1 is clearly not the best. That being said i had to stop a c7 Gs driver from telling me his list of woes with that car. While a pcar costs a lot more upfront, its possible that if you run on track the net cost after a few years is going to be little different if the vette breaks more often. Yeah turbos, its not just lag, but also precision, the ability to modulate and accurately feed in power as you unwind lock off an apex. yes modern systems will intervene and not let the car overdo it so you can just flatten the pedal and let the coputer meet out the power, and thats certainly faster with all that turbo power, but unless youre racing for $ its not you doing the job. Felt that acutely when driving maclren 570Gt4 on track, fast yes, way less fun/skill etc. But in full on pro hands certainly faster in a race. From what i hear the 458 ch is the sweetspot because as you say from 488 onwards complexity went way up and the support necessary to run it is a whole different ballgame. 488 ch Not exactly a put it on open trailer and tow it to some tracks sort of car. Ive also found that if youre drivign something way faster than everyne else not so much fun, cause its fun to joust and play with someone more evenly matched. Was contemplating adding power to the car this year, then my guru pointed out the car would certainly be faster, laptimes undoubtedly quicker but I would not necessarily be faster driver, and so gotten quicker this year with same car and power by having to do better. . Congrats on the 458 Ch, thats living the dream esp as you travel to so many tracks, plus we're on a Ferrari site so well done on flying the flag. Will be at the Glen sept 20 21 would be nice to meet up if youre there then
Yes, that’s my feeling about the big Z - it’s more of a halo car. Great few laps, then it falls off. I have much more fun with consistency of laps and mixing it up with the other drivers. The 458 Ch is a hoot because you can literally get away with murder - very late braking and very, very good in technical turns - throttle response is superb and quite linear. Coming from the street version, the learning curve was less steep, and I can generally run with T/C off which livens up the car and greatly enhances its pull out of turns. I do want to note that extensively tracking the spider (more than 40 days on track) was a major learning experience. It helped me decide where I should go with my track car purchase, I know it’s been the right decision for me, and I’ve never looked back. Can’t ever go wrong with a Pcar. And the vettes typically do take a while to sort out.
These Dealers are Charging Some of the Highest Markups for the C8 Corvette Z06 https://www.corvetteblogger.com/2023/07/20/hall-of-shame-these-dealers-are-charging-the-highest-markups-for-the-c8-corvette-z06/ no need to pay $140k adm or even $20k $140k adm = HELL no ...... but $10k (I want it now) ... hmmm .
We were lucky and got it at MSRP as someone backed out last minute and our dealer had a very short period of time to find someone who was willing to spec and commit or risk losing the allocation. Dealer said he would make up the lost ADM on one of the Camaro Panther ZL1's he just got an allocation for.
As much as I like the Z06, I just can't picture myself spending more than it would cost me to get a 458 HTC. The way I see it, if I'm spending $200k+ I'll get the Ferrari. For $160k or less, the Z06. The only thing that I really enjoy about the Z06 that would sway me if all else is equal price wise; is the ability to customize it exactly as I wanted (versus settling for whatever 458 is on the market), and the tech (CarPlay, 360 cameras, prox sensors, front lift w/ gps memory).
As bad as I think the C8 exterior looks including the Z06, that interior in lip stick red is a real killer. Why could they not have done that with the C6 ZR1 I will never understand.
Comedy of delays. I’m sitting at 400+ miles. Need to get to 1200+ by Saturday AM. Pick up this afternoon/evening. Have a road trip planned to spec a Roma tomorrow… For those interested: Image Unavailable, Please Login
Well, barely got it broken in - hit 1300 miles at security gate. Quick thoughts (working on uploading some PDR to youtube). VIR full, club day. I was not interested in breaking my shiny new toy, so was careful. First time driving something this heavy with this much power (generally don't ever track anything with this much power). Track conditions were not ideal - hot and sunny. Turned some low 2:02s - passed everything out there, except a radical and a race prepped C6. Even passed a Camaro ZL with 700+HP and big aero. All nannies off* Prep: like regular C8, needs added transmission fluid, should have a GM "track alignment" which is more aggressive street, not track. Consumables: tires(Cup 2R)- held up for 2 days (8 sessions on track) in less than ideal conditions - hot (95+), no real track alignment. I would guess, maybe 4+ track days before replacing? CCBs never had fade, not sure how much pad remains. Gas- 5 mpg on track, lots of refueling Motor: a monster, only thing that is like it, that I have driven - 600LT. Hit 140 at the end of the bridge straight by Sunday afternoon. Hitting upper 150s at the end of the back straight. Hit 150 end of the front straight. Again, not the conditions for power too. Chassis- really good, neutral, controllable. Built confidence over each session. Sub 2:00 should not be a problem (8/10). Braking- very stable, confidence inspiring. Front straight, braking at the 6, back straight braking at the 5 (uphill helps) - earlier than needed. Tires- they do get hot, like every other tire, the best laps are 2 and 3. Not all that much drop off, but its there. They are not reasonable in rain - on the street hydroplaning at 45-50 mph, not kidding. Heat management- I took the center section out of the bumper after the first session, but never came close to overheating in about the worst conditions for heat - hot, humid. I took the center section out, because the green gear symbol appeared (never went into limp mode, all seemed to act normal). Frankly, I was waiting for limp mode / grenade, but it never came. Generally speaking- it is an absolute pleasure, total beast. Frankly, probably a bit better than I hoped. People sought me out in the paddock, good drivers in quality machines - all blown away. *driving home the front TPMS were not working, went on an exit ramp and the car activated some nanny that was more trying to kill me rather than help me. Freaked me out for a second. So, I personally would never, ever drive this thing on track with the nannies turned "on." edit: first video link
Thanks for the detailed report. Generally sounds good. Have heard about the PTMS and nannies in the vette forum, one of those glaring things from Gm in a supposedly "track" capable car.
Eh- just turn them off. And, I would say more than good. To my mind- get a Miata, BMW, Lotus beater. Next level, $ wise- Cayman/boxster beater. If you want to give a few less point bys- gonna have to step it up. Then Porsche GT, even more $. The Z06 is faster than all that stuff. Not as visceral/raw, but a truly capable track car. Not as easy on the street as the base C8 (softest setting is more like “sport”), tires grip every tiny road groove- better drive with both hands.
more than good is great. Happy to hear about tire and brake wear because those are real practical data points. already have a dedicated track car, small light fast and supremely viceral. But as we have all noticed the latest street/track stuff has really moved the game on, and there is appeal in a use on street and occasionally drive to the track car for a more casual day here and there, even if the experience is a little more numb. For a pure track car, my general experience is its a day to load up the tools tires wheels truck/trailer etc, a day to drive to some great tracks(you could do both these in 1 really full day) unload, then 2 days on track, load up at the end, a day driving back and a day of unpacking cleanup. Going the distance to track for one day, the time before and after does not alter much, car/truck still needs loading, cleaning unpacking etc . When I take a road car to the track, then its pretty much start in the morning drive an hr ot two to track, run that day come home, and maybe part of a day doing cleanup afterwards, maybe after 3 or so days part of another day for tires pads oil change etc. In short there is a lot of appeal in a car one can use on road a few times per week, and on occasion take to the track, either a local track for the day, or comfy enough to recee new tracks further out. That can then expand the number of days per year on track, providing on occasion for more casualy acessable track days and easy exploration of some new tracks. Its not a replacement for a pure track car, rather an additional trackable car with its own other virtues. Addeed to that its a car that can live in Fl where I dont currently go to tracks cause track car in Ne for summer. plus yeah 670 hp can be its own fun every now and again, even though i come from the more light is right school. to date the only recent out the box road cars(sub 300K and excess $ to run) ive seen that really work on track are eliges, 4c,(both out of prod) Camros zl1 1lt and the Porche gt cars. Without going into debate as to why others are lacking, imo they are. Good to hear the corvette can do it, thanks for the writeup, it is really appreciated especially as your use on track is the type of cycle that more "real" than how magazines/youtube report. The camber settings were interesting -2 in the front, not surprised on road its hunting about. Looks like maybe ford has made a really sterling effort with the dark horse, will be inetresting to see/hear about. As an aside, really liking this car. https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-video/spartan-video-review-460bhp-track-toy-driven
Update- after 2 track days at VIR I have 50% factory brake pad remaining. So, I would say 3 days is the limit with comfort factor built-in. Will likely try some non-factory options when the time comes again. (Zero fade with factory, total confidence in braking ability, just wondering about durability with a more purposeful track pad)
Yes A part of me thinks about the AP racing brake option- fits in 18” wheel. Then get lightest alloy wheel possible, combined with more tire options- maybe close to factory 20” and 21” CF wheel/CCB combo. (Wanted that suspension calibration that comes with that package)
AP Racing brake kits are fantastic! I pulled the PCCB's off of my 991.2 GT3 and ran the AP Racing (steel) kit. I ran a 19" for the reasons you mentioned (more options with wheels/tires, less cost for tires...etc.). My AP steel kit was within 1 pound (per corner) of the OEM PCCB's. I was all set to add extra cooling with ducts/hoses but AP actually said that added cooling would keep the pads from reaching their operating temperature. I used to make-up so much time on other cars on track by out-braking them. AP's aren't cheap but they're the best in the bizz.
Makes sense factory pads are going to be softer to work on road without temp, still not too bad considering weight and hp.. Ive always liked a ferodo 2500 for street/track, thy take very little temp to work, and are good on track. For pure track pads like cobalt, oter like carbo tech, pagid rs14s also work and will work cold, but rs14s will eat rotors on street unless up to temp. as you know ap racing rotors and calipers are hard to beat, .
This makes a lot of sense of one is going to be doing some tracking, also really easy to change pads with ap calipers. Pretty easy to swap on track whells/tires and pads for going to the track and have street/wheels tires and pads for the rest.
Update #2- that green gear symbol that worried me…. Just some stupid light to tell you that you are driving sporty. Did some reading in the manual- there is a temperature specific warning light for transmission. So, no issue with center radiator covered up in really hot conditions. I would guess overheating will be a non issue. (I did run a SE46 at COTA when ambient temps were at 105+, my BMW barely made it through racing with marginal temps every lap from mid race on. So, maybe in those conditions, but VA in 95+, no problem)
Another small tidbit. Manual recommends setting cold tire pressure at 38 psi… for on track. That seems really high, but the car is really heavy (street tire sidewalks are not as stiff as racing tires, guess they need more pressure to hold them up). I was aiming for 35 hot. Will try a bit more pressure next time out- 38? Much more than that seems nuts, but what do I know?
Yeah thta seems really high for track. 38 psi cold may mean +10 psi when really hot. 35 hot makes some sense.I guess you just have to feel it out and look at where they wear.
Finally got my build date of 8/28 so delivery should be mid-September. Got my fingers crossed for an updated DCT throttle body.
