430 Ah the fun of a convertible..

So my top just randomly stopped working. I took it to my Indy mechanic who is phenomenal with Ferraris and even he was unable to fix it or figure out the cause. My roof won’t go up or down. It failed in transit last weekend. He was able to get the roof back up and locked, but we can’t figure the problem out.
Micro switches are all checked good. He can’t get to the motor for the top. The fluid in the reservoir is good, any help would be appreciated. I have a launch to look at system stuff but that top has perplexed me.

 

You caught my attention with "Indy" as I thought you were perhaps in Indianapolis where my retired F1 mechanic who works on my 430 Spider is. He may be able to help for a price/consulting fee if you want to have your mechanic call him. His name is Brian Stewart and he can be reached at the Car Vault in Indianapolis, (317) 939-0144.

 

Can you add some info?...

Do you hear any noise at all when it activates?
Does the tonneau cover open/close?
Have you check the fuses?
Have you checked for power to the pump when activated?

 

I don’t hear the motor running. I did at first but I’ve been out of town this week for work and will check once I get back.

The tonneau doesn’t move now.

where are the fuses for the top? I didn’t have my shop manual on me when it broke and I’m still out of town.

I’ll have to ask Steve if he checked the voltage. I have not personally checked it.


Stupid question, but could a dying battery not provide the voltage necessary to activate the motor for the pump? I know these cars get weird with that.

 

Basically, I want to lower the top and the fabric portion didn’t fully stow. I brought the top back up and tried again. Once it was mostly down it stopped working and then nothing would happen. No tonneau cover movement, no fabric top movement, the car was running bit I couldn’t hear the pump running at all. From there it does and wouldn’t do anything.

 

Died*

 

Ok, I just spoke my my mech. He said all the fuses are good, the battery appears to be in good health and the car starts fine, all the micro switches are good. I couldn’t see any wet spots or hydraulic leaks, and Steve didn’t say anything about them either. He suspects it could be a computer controller issue. The pump is NOT running with switch activation. Maybe the switch or its connection went bad? Again any help on it is greatly appreciated before I plunk down big dollars at a dealership.

 

Disconnect and reconnect battery ..crazy yes but sometimes it resets some computers

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Dominick, using the cutoff in the frunk, or disconnect the terminal from the post in the passenger footwell?

 

Frunk should be good

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If it’s stopping when the capote lid is open and the fabric is folded in place, it could be that your elastic straps are worn out. The fabric bunches and it won’t complete the cycle.

You can fix it at an upholstery shop for $300-500. In the meantime if you push the rod that runs along the width of the headliner towards the back of the car, that will help make sure it folds properly.

I am not sure if the problem I had is your problem but my symptoms were similar.


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Ahh electrical issues.

Start with the fuse. Pull it out and look at it. If its good then check the electricity at the pump. If the pump isn't working with electricty.. well... then it could be the module. Would be interesting if took another module and it worked well. Question is why it would have gone bad. Cylinder seals will go with age, that will alter the timing of the top.

 

According to the diagnostic table, the pump should run whenever you move the roof switch.

There are two fuses (live battery power and ignition power). Is the switch backlighting illuminating? That should tell you if the smaller fuse is working.

Make sure you have battery power at the pump relay behind the right hand seat from the large fuse. Power should be on pin 2 or it may be labelled "87".

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I suppose you could jumper the relay to prove that the pump works.

Also see if the Roof ECU is sending a voltage to the relay socket (pin 6) = relay pin 86 i.e. when you push/pull the switch.

 

Ian, what are we gonna do when you decide to no longer post here?

 

I almost bought a manual spider, given the roof problems i see here i am glad i passed on it

 

What am I going to do when you guys no longer correct my numerous mistakes

 

I owned a convertible once in my life; cured me for it forever.

 

ah it's not so bad. I was skeptical to but I pulled the trigger on it. Then i couldn't help myself so i made a manual shift out of it. My girlfriend loves it so we both enjoy it

 

I've had a number of convertibles:

1969 Olds 442
1972 Triumph Spitfire
2001 Mercedes SKL320 stick
2017 Mercedes SL63 AMG
2001 Ferrari 360 Spider gated

I just have a bad habit. Admitting it is half the battle and I'm satisfied with that.

 

I have had two convertibles: 84 Carrera and 96 355 Spider. I found that I am no longer a convertible person. It's coupes now.

 

https://www.media.stellantis.com/uk-en/fiat/press/scientific-proof-drivers-happiest-when-behind-the-wheel-of-a-convertible-new-study-finds?adobe_mc_ref=

20% happier when driving with the top down
50% happier when it's a Ferrari (my own research )

I'm sorry you coupe drivers just don't want to be happy, lol.

 

So my indy guy, thinks it COULD be the ECU for the top. Anyone know where to source one of those? I have some troubleshooting to do myself, just trying to avoid a 2 hour drive to a dealership and then dealer prices. Thanks!

 

I'd get a second opinion.

 

@DrivnXcitment : Have you tried asking ChatGP? Guy used ChatGP to diagnose his sick dog when the vet couldn't figure it out. Who knows ChatGP maybe your future virtual Ferrari mechanic.

 

More information required.

How did your indy come to this conclusion? Does he have a scanner which tells him switch status at each stage of roof opening/closing? Did he use the manual procedure to close the roof?

Because the motor is difficult to get to, all you can really do is look at the voltages at the pump relay. That will tell you if the ECU is outputting a signal to the motor and if power is available for the motor. I guess you could also check the relay itself with a battery and a voltmeter. It would be great if a new relay fixed the problem (but that's wishful thinking)

If you jumper the pump relay just to hear the pump run, just do it briefly. I'm not sure what position the hydraulic solenoids default to. The pump may fight against a locked roof or it may unlock the roof (hopefully not... that would be a bad design). If the roof starts to unlock, stop immediately. The manual closing procedure looks quite complicated.

If you know the pump is ok and the microswitches are ok, but the roof neither goes up or down with the roof switches, I suppose it could be an ECU issue. The ECU controls the solenoids which control things like roof direction and unlocking.