I Predicted!!! Manual Conversions < F1

The overarching problem is the F1 transmission was a failed experiment. It worked great in race cars, not so great in street cars. In a race car, you hammer it and pull shifts as fast as you can. There is no worry about smooth clutch engagements. BAM, BAM, BAM, BAM. This doesn't work well in street cars. You have to slow shifts down to make them smoother, which leads to higher clutch wear. Frankly, I'd be embarrassed if I only got 25k miles on a standard transmission and clutch. The solution in F1 street cars appears to be short shifting. Upshifts at lower revs puts less stress on the clutch. Finally, race cars don't need no stinkin reverse.

That said, there must be thousands of F1 cars on the streets. When those F1 transmissions need to be redone, and apparently this happens sooner than later, would those owners like to have the option of converting to a standard? There is no question the F1 works well on the track. It was a hoot driving my Stradale on the track. But motoring around on back country roads? I'd rather go with a standard.

 

As a 599 owner, I cant really imagine using a manual box in that car. Its hard enough with the F1 box to shift gears when you are going fast... there is no way a manual gear box is going to make that car better ... certainly harder to drive for sure. the f1 box around town is fine - only in stop and go traffic does it get tedious... but the same would be true with a manual box. the 599 and the cars after that have so much power and torque it overwhelm you ... the paddles are the only way to drive smooth and safely. If i had to rev match on a down shift in the 599 on track coming down from 160 mph, to 70... that would be a nightmare, and an overrev paradise.

 

Check this auction out. Hey Ferrari, are you listening? A 17-year old Ferrari trading at more than MSRP?

https://bringatrailer.com/listing/2006-ferrari-f430-spider-51/

Probably not.

 

unless you got a full blown sequential........ stick shifts are too dangerous in high horsepower cars. too much loading and unloading between shifts.

ya'll would kill yourselves

 

I can tell you that on the street, a gated 599 is proper fun and to this Fchatter, far more enjoyable than it's F1 counterpart.

 

Memo to self - avoid high horsepower cars...

 

This is actually how I feel with modern cars. I feel like I have to play 20 questions with the car before it does what I want. Turn off Auto start stop, change drive mode, put in manual mode, turn off lane change and brake assist, etc..

I like the simplicity of cars where you get in and go and just shift to the gear you want. No other electronics to mess with other than the radio.

 

Part of the problem is the factory manual cars are so much more expensive. So great to say you would pay extra for a factory car, but if it is 2x the price, can you afford to? I would be down for a manual conversion.

I sorta get the argument over originality, but didn't they build over 15K 430's? They aren't exactly rare. It's not like you are modifying an F-50.

 

The Stradale is a bit jerky on initial takeoff around town and is more raw and racy, but the 355 F1 is bliss around town. They both work just fine.
Both great on country roads.
The key to the 355 is you have to manually blip the throttle on downshifts which is unique and engaging

 

That's the F1 for you. You should watch the Challenge and GT cars. You take off like a bat outta hell or bog down. Not much in-between.

I find blipping or easing like you would for a manual helps with all F1s.

 

The F1 transmissions have long since proven themselves to have greater longevity than the DCTs. Its the DCTs that people are getting rich repairing with few miles.

 

If you are talking about the race cars thats because they never wrote software for the race clutches.
If you are talking about street cars maybe drive one that works correctly.

 

Sad. The Porsche DCT works great.

 

You had a lot of issues with your 550 too. Its hardly the cars fault you relied on complete morons to maintain your cars.

 

Like I said, I found if you mimic a standard a F1 works better. I haven't driven a F1 thousands of miles, but I'm guessing short shifting will help with clutch life.

 

Whoa. I had issues at FOH, but I later used a good independent. One thing about a 550, shifting is not a problem. In fact, it is one of the major joys of driving one. That big clutch and big transmission work great. Nailing second to third is worth the price of admission. It is all the other ****, like plenum hoses and AC, that drove me crazy.

 

I know nothing of the Porsche DCT. Mercedes uses essentially the same unit as Ferrari. They rejected it during long term durability testing and forced some changes. One was slowing shift speed. Ferrari had a throbbing purple hard on for minimum shift speed. Be careful what you ask for. They are more than happy to make Kleenex cars (use it once, throw it away) with 5 figure consumables if thats what you want. Just don't complain later if thats what they give you.

 

The Porsche DCT is great. I had one of the first street ones in 2009 in a Cayman. When I took it to the track, I couldn't stop laughing. It was that good. Don't use the paddles. The machine is better than you. Just drive it. The harder you whip it, the better it likes it. Damn Germans.

 

Kleenex cars. That's a good un. It sums up Ferrari.

 

I am still sorry Ferrari bailed on the F1 and went to DCT. F1 was still in development phase was was getting better by leaps and bounds at every new generation. With F1 it made complete sense to continue to offer both manual and F1. It was brain dead easy to make both models side by side. DCT had a faster shift speed Ferrari wanted. God knows how much better a car is when it can shift .05 seconds faster. Problem is its so different car cannot really be designed to have either. And then there is all the DCTs self destructing in a very expensive fashion. Never had that with F1's but hey, they can shift .05 seconds faster and thats worth 50 grand right?

 

Yes. That’s why some of us drive classic cars. Lane change assist consists of a couple of mirrors and windows.

What’s funny (or sad) is that so many drivers don’t understand or use much of the sophisticated technology anyway. I remember taking my ex-Audi TT daily driver in for service maybe 10 years ago and noting one of the DSG shift paddles didn’t feel right. The service manager said most owners didn’t even know they were there. (And this was a proper dual-clutch box, much improved over F1…)



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Anecdotally… I know of two Macans that had DCT failures, although they were higher mileage cars. I wouldn’t call them bulletproof. I suspect an automatic would suit most SUV drivers and be more robust.


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A DCT is bound to fail much earlier than a conventional manual or conventional automatic. The fluid itself is caustic to rubber,and according to our local Ferrari dealer..if not changed regularly it becomes so full of small metal particals, it becomes almost magnetic..which screws with the internal electrical.

How true that is..I have no idea.. but he is the one who pressed on us to change the gearbox fluid every other oil change..so that's what we now do.

 

Funny the Audi Pre-Sense crash avoidance on my A4 has come closer to causing an accident than avoiding one on multiple occasions. I hate it but you can't default it to off. Have to turn it off every time.

Late 90s to early 00s are the sweet spot in some ways. Still pretty modern in terms of design and reliability but pretty mechanical and without too many driver aides.

 

i may be one of the rare people who drive my cars as much as i can.
when the 456mgt was my daily, i drove it for 36k km, and did have to change the clutch at about 25k miles....i dont think i am a bad driver, or particularly hard on clutches (and the car only had 1k miles on it when i bought it so it was not the previous owner), but nevertheless, i had to replace the clutch.

fwiw, i also had to replace the clutch on the 430 at about 23k miles...(i only had put 6k miles on this one at that time).

so you get what you get.