SF 90 XX

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There is even SF90 with winter tires

 

Thank you. So we’re sure the SF90 AF original Fiorano test lap was done on Cup 2s?

 

The Cup2R is an option you can specify. There were so many discussions about it when the car came out.

https://www.roadandtrack.com/reviews/a36967594/2021-ferrari-sf90-stradale-assetto-fiorano-track-review/

https://www.pistonheads.com/news/ph-driven/ferrari-sf90-assetto-fiorano--ph-review/44839

https://www.dupontregistry.com/autos/listing/2021/ferrari/sf90--stradale/219009

 

Sure? No. Not really- but my recollection is they used the R tires.

 

117.3 easily achieved at Fiorano SF90 XX street tires - similar time to full race 599XX
2 seconds behind FXX with race tires and race prep etc.

Put on race tires / race prep etc -reduce time 2.5 - 3 seconds beating FXX

Someone stated XX was too slow and it was scrapped and sent to Ferrari road cars -
Day ... mic is all yours Sir!

 

1) The Speciale was on different tyres to the Italia, unlike the two SF90s.
2) The law of diminishing returns in play.

Both times were set on Cup 2 R.

 

Add hybrid AWD easy to drive and a ton of new body panels.
Ferrari could have dialed it up - we all know that.
DAY stated wasn't fast enough to be a track XX -
Reality XX street car is dialed back

 

I must say, I find this press test very interesting. It seems they are not too worried about the exact lap time. They used a non-AF suspension car and obviously did a lap for each press day (a US magazine reported 1.17.5 and the two UK ones a 1.17.3). The lap was the first flying lap out of the box, not even two or three attempts to see which is the fastest. Maybe they don’t really care because all the cars are sold and they simply know it is an order of magnitude faster than the standard car.

I think the multimatic suspension car must be quicker - we have both a multimatic and a magnetorheological car. No doubt the magneto car is more absorbent but the multimatic car has slightly better body control. Even if it were not faster at Fiorano, both UK reviewers commented that the car felt softer than they expected. They also both seemed to compare the car against XX track-only machinery. On reflection, I find that quite naive for such well known journalists. They must surely know that any road car, even one with an XX badge, has to make accommodation for the fact that its use case will be very different to the track only cars.

The video showed them both marvelling at the car, its pace, the new chassis developments, the overboost function, its playfulness, its appearance, the sheer enormity of the achievement. But their conclusion was that it was not as sharp as an XX track car. You only have to spend a short time in a track car to understand that no road car could ever be like a dedicated track car. We’ve heard it from owners and users on this forum many many times. It’s truly perplexing that such experienced guys didn’t seem to understand that. In fact, I can’t believe they didn’t. So my conclusion is that they must have had something of a conclusion in mind before the test. Is that even a thing in automotive journalism? The video reel seemed at complete odds with the conclusion on both tests. I don’t believe in country bias - trying to support UK brands etc. People who say that don’t really know the British mindset. In those two tests though, there seems to be a strange confusion about what the car is supposed to be.

 

It's like they'd decided to slightly slap Ferrari on the face for calling it XX when it's just a road car.

 

it's always a balance but the scope for just how focused you can make a road legal track car is still very high (Mclaren P1 LM / Valk / Ultima RS) etc
the comprimise is usually of ride quality and comfort, I think the journalists were prehaps just a little suprised that it didn't appear to be as track focused as expected yet they weren't allowed to drive it on the road to experience what the result of making it more road friendly felt like

 

Journalists always have to have something to say as in theory journalists feel they are compelled to put something out which is their job.

In this case they had to say the contrary to get some sort of agreement with the crowd. Most journalist will have very positive views about the car but these guys already pre-decided to put something a bit of a controversial statement out to spike some discussion.

Most viewers will never have the chance to drive one of these machine let alone own one. So most will take their word as a final analysis not knowing it’s solely their opinion and it’s based on the very limited number of minutes they were with the car driving. So driving impressions from them goes out of the window in my opinion whether it’s positive or negative.

To truly experience the drive and the car one must spend weeks and months to understand how the car behaves on multiple drives and occasion.

I’ll base my own opinion after my own experience with this machine. Not based on what these journalists say and most of them will not even own one.


Sent from my iPhone using FerrariChat

 

For me, the journalists seemed very honest and clear.

They never questioned the capabilities of the SF90 XX. On the contrary, they praised it by saying that it is "outrageously fast" (Autocar) with a lot of downforce.

What was said in the reviews is the lack of viscerality, of exciting spirit and behaviour, for a Ferrari that carries the XX nomenclature.

I see this very positively because the specialized media is not applauding everything that Ferrari does, and this makes the brand have to rethink some strategies.

Much of it is due to the F154 behavior and the car weight. In fact, Autocar states that "the turbo V8 sounds angrier and less soulful than some supercar engines" and "Four-wheel drive hybrid powertrain erodes the purity of the handling". It is impossible to say that this is not true.

It is incoherent to say, in terms of the car merits, that "it's an XX!", and in terms of its demerits, to say that "it's not really an XX, just a street car, don't be so critical".

And the specialized media have nothing against Ferrari. I remember that the last special release, 812 Competizione, was widely praised and acclaimed by the same journalists, in every way.

In terms of design, IMO the XX looks very beautiful. Infinitely superior to regular SF90.

 

I saw that too and thought it was a mistake or a typo by the US magazine. Ferrari state 1' 17.309''. Where it gets really weird is that in the same press release they claim that this time is 1.4'' quicker than the SF90 Stradale AF, whereas the stated time for that car is 1' 19''!!! Go figure...

Could it be that the journalists drove non AF cars, whereas Rafael set the time with an AF car? It makes no sense to use the regular suspended car for such an effort.

Some reports state the exact opposite.

 

Ferrari driver I know very well told me 1.16.9 back in April, says the simulators have this car at 1.16.65/1.16.7.. bizarre, as someone said above, they kind of weren’t bothered by the time, kind of sandbagging..

 

The faster the lap the more performance needed for the F250 to smash it to keep people happy

 

Personally I feel that the journalists never really got the SF90 to begin with. The Italian SF90 XX YouTube reviews seemed to do a better job. I suspect this is one of those cases where unless you really spend enough time in both the SF90 and SF90 XX you can't do a proper review.

Also interesting that there are two suspension options - I recall hearing that at the launch, then hearing at pebble that there's only a single suspension option, but now it looks like there are two (including the bumpy road mode icon on the manettino).

 

The F250 will need to be head and shoulders above any other Ferrari road car.

 

I reckon the added aero will be a big part of it.

 

It could also be lighter.

 

Well the V6 will be lighter than the V12

 

True, but chassis and power to weight will also have to play a big role. You sir, are best positioned to inform us, since you are in line to get one.

One would think so, but when Newey was developing the Valkyrie, said that the difference is not that great.

 

That would be nice but I don’t know if it’s correct. Hopefully so!

 

The XX designation is a marketing name for a road car... there isn't much left of the XX specifics, and if you look at the body roll of the car, the suspension travel, the load on the rear... you will deduce that it is very far from an XX car. It should also be noted that contrary to what many people think, an XX is very far from a GT2/GT3 type racing car and I had a long discussion with R. Arnoux on this subject... It should also be noted that contrary to what many people think, an XX is very far from a GT2/GT3 type racing car and I had a long discussion with R. Arnoux on this subject... Suspensions on the XX series are much softer and more consensual than the trim of a GT2/GT3 LM, as the car must remain considerate and forgiving, as owners have very different levels of driving. A GT2/GT3 only responds to driving gestures and is absolutely unforgiving, while pushing the limits (downforce, traction, change of attitude, etc.). So the almost 2-ton SF 90 XX is not a racing car, and neither are the XX versions to a different extent , they are just perfect fun trackdays cars with friends !

 

I don't disagree, but the SF90 XX Stradale will be much quicker than a Senna around a circuit (even the base car is), and yet it will be liveable (kind of), as a road car. If you don't see that as an achievement, we have different view of what makes a great car.

Regarding the XXs, there is no doubt that Ferrari could have made the FXX-K a lot quicker. But that's not the purpose of the XX programme, as you said yourself.

 

I’m not sure what I just read, so I’m going to give myself another vaccine booster in hopes this makes more sense…