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166 Inter Touring Coupe 1950

Discussion in 'Vintage (thru 365 GTC4)' started by kare, Nov 16, 2023.

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  1. kare

    kare F1 Rookie
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    #1 kare, Nov 16, 2023
    Been looking into history of 025/S, which must have been a 2nd series Touring Coupe likely completed in the 2nd half of 1949. Separate rear fenders now eliminated and pontoon body had straight flanks. There were six cars - 019/S, 025/S, 027/S, 029/S, 035/S, 039/S. According to Raab's Ferrari Serial Numbers 025/S was destined to "Rizzoli".

    I also have a note it went to Francesco Severi and Giuseppe Santi - both involved with car sales in Rome. Severi was connected to Carlo Ponti and A.T.A. (Artisti Tecnici Associati), later on Ponti & Mambretti would be selling Ferraris in Rome. Santi & C sold numberous special Lancias, Abarths and Ferraris to customers in Rome. Don't know how realiable this note is, date given (May 49) may be too early as 019/S was completed in July and displayed in Paris Salon in October 1949.

    Fast forwards 025/S seems to have lost it's engine by 1970. The car was likely scrapped and it seems to have been lost forever. Does anyone have any solid information about this car? Where did it go, who parted it out and when exactly?

    I attach a photo of 0019/S as a new car, likely taken soon after completion in 1949.

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  2. MBPaki

    MBPaki Formula Junior

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    #2 MBPaki, Nov 16, 2023
    First owner Marzotto.
    Best, Miki-Paki
     
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  3. Marcel Massini

    Marcel Massini Two Time F1 World Champ
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    #3 Marcel Massini, Nov 16, 2023
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  4. kare

    kare F1 Rookie
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    #4 kare, Nov 18, 2023
    I now see that Raab's "Rizzoli" must come out of misreading bad and/or faded hand-writing that really says "Marzotto". I wonder what his source was...
     
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  5. Marcel Massini

    Marcel Massini Two Time F1 World Champ
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    #5 Marcel Massini, Nov 18, 2023
    Manifattura Lana G. Marzotto & Figli SpA bought 025 S 27 September 1949, sold it to Giuseppe Santi 12 September 1950.

    Marcel Massini
     
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  6. kare

    kare F1 Rookie
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    #6 kare, Nov 20, 2023
    One of the interesting mysteries is the 2nd series Touring Coupe raced by Franco Cornacchia in Mille Miglia 1950 (#659). As a result of various factors it might be impossible to determine which car it really was. Basically I cannot eliminate any of the four last cars: 027/S, 029/S, 035/S, 039/S and it would be very interesting to know if anyone have made any progress sorting this one out.
     
  7. Aardy

    Aardy F1 Veteran
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    #7 Aardy, Nov 20, 2023
    The #659 Touring coupe looks like the one at the 1950 Geneva show...
     
  8. PG1964

    PG1964 Formula Junior

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    #8 PG1964, Nov 20, 2023
    019S is at the Louwman museum in Den Haag (NL).
     
  9. kare

    kare F1 Rookie
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    #9 kare, Nov 20, 2023
    I thought so too for a long time, but it really is a different car. The car shown in Geneva had air doors.

    Does anyone have proper photos of 035/S, air doors or not?
     
  10. Aardy

    Aardy F1 Veteran
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    #10 Aardy, Nov 23, 2023
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  11. Marcel Massini

    Marcel Massini Two Time F1 World Champ
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    #11 Marcel Massini, Nov 23, 2023
    I took this pic almost exactly forty years ago, in September 1983, at Autofficina Franco Toni in Maranello.
    It is not 017 S, might it be 027 S or 035 S?

    Marcel Massini

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  12. nico308

    nico308 Formula Junior

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    #12 nico308, Nov 23, 2023
  13. Aardy

    Aardy F1 Veteran
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    #13 Aardy, Nov 24, 2023
    Clearly not 0075S... Too much differences. What is crazy it's the car seems to have disappeared since early 90's.
    Really no one has heard of a Touring coupe in a private collection that the owner doesn't want to show ?
     
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  14. Aardy

    Aardy F1 Veteran
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    #14 Aardy, Nov 24, 2023
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    Too much differences with 027S (shape of the nose especially). I vote for 035S...
     
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  15. Marcel Massini

    Marcel Massini Two Time F1 World Champ
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    #15 Marcel Massini, Nov 24, 2023
    Italian Aldo Cudone, Speedy Cars Srl., sold 035 S in 1994 to the 13th owner, Shiro Kosaka in Japan.
    TTBOMK it is still there.

    Marcel Massini
     
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  16. Marcel Massini

    Marcel Massini Two Time F1 World Champ
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    #16 Marcel Massini, Nov 24, 2023
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  17. Aardy

    Aardy F1 Veteran
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    #17 Aardy, Nov 24, 2023
    Very curious to know what happened to 023S. Was not in the RM auction at Monterey Car Week this summer...
     
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  18. Deemeyere Wim

    Deemeyere Wim Formula Junior

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    #18 Deemeyere Wim, Nov 24, 2023
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  19. Deemeyere Wim

    Deemeyere Wim Formula Junior

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    #19 Deemeyere Wim, Nov 24, 2023
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  20. Aardy

    Aardy F1 Veteran
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    #20 Aardy, Nov 24, 2023
    No way. Marcel's picture shows a Notchback coupe Series 2. 015S is a Serie 1..
     
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  21. Marcel Massini

    Marcel Massini Two Time F1 World Champ
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    #21 Marcel Massini, Nov 24, 2023
    Quite a number of Ferraris owned by WM are still with him.
    Here's 023 S, taken recently.

    Marcel Massini

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  22. Aardy

    Aardy F1 Veteran
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    #22 Aardy, Nov 24, 2023
    So happy to have a rear picture ! Thank you very much Marcel !
     
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  23. kare

    kare F1 Rookie
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    #23 kare, Nov 24, 2023
    Do you have an interior picture to share? Late dashboard design suggests it was pushed aside when Touring was in a hurry preparing 019/S for Paris.
     
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  24. merstheman

    merstheman F1 Rookie

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    #24 merstheman, Nov 24, 2023
    What is the total breakdown of coupés/barchettas?
     
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  25. redfred84

    redfred84 Formula Junior

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    #25 redfred84, Nov 24, 2023
    I hear that this summers RM sale was only the tip of the iceberg for the WM collection; but mostly the cream of the crop. Any word where the '56 410 SA went?
     
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