Hi All, Long time lurker here. Finally bought my first Ferrari last year (2001 F1 Spider). Just having a starting issue after a flat battery (I left the key in the car in the ON position). It's cranking but not starting. I've since: charged the battery (twice) check the voltage of the battery checked the alarm fuse 74 sprayed some degreaser into the air intake to see if it's a fuel pump issue But still not getting anything. Any ideas would be much appreciated. Cheers, Ray
Change the battery in the fob and see if that is the problem. I believe the 360 will crank and not start (like my 575M) if the immobilizer is not disarmed.
Swapped to a new A23 battery, sadly still unchanged. Alarm module seems to be beeping and function normally.
Is the red LED on the dash going out? I saw the video, but you panned away fairly quickly. It's a strange one. Did you try a (car) battery reset?
If all else fails, you could try: Resetting the inertia switch in the passenger* footwell. Checking fuses 37, 42 and 44 as they power a lot of RH engine management stuff. Checking the volts during cranking * at least that's where I think it is on a RHD car.
Hi Ian, It stays solid when I press the fob button. So the process being: putting key in, led flashing, press the button, led turns solid, then I start the car. I haven't done a battery reset per se but did charge the battery whilst car was disconnected from the battery using the OFF switch in the frunk. I'll disconnect now one more time just be extra sure. Voltage was around 12.5 unloaded then dropped to 10ish whilst cranking. Sounded pretty healthy cranking. I'll go check all the fuses and relays and reset the inertia switch next Thank you for the suggestions
It shouldn't go out? I was thinking a flat battery might put a strain on the siren's internal battery, triggering some kind of immobiliser issue. Doesn't sound too bad, and as you say, the cranking sounds good.
Awesome thinking! I've only had experience with my car, so I just assumed it was normal. I've found a photo confirming that it's solid red even whilst driving. But you're right, from what I've been reading it should actually switch off instead of staying on after the key fob is pressed. Which lead me to find the following thread that had similar-ish symptoms of car will crank but not start (except my alarm still chirps) https://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/threads/put-in-new-battery-no-alarm-led-light-at-all-car-cranks-but-wont-start.413523/ Thanks very much for the insight Image Unavailable, Please Login
In the other thread, it says you can still start the car without the siren fitted, but there have been cases of sirens blowing immobiliser fuses. Siren batteries often cause steady red LEDs, so it is likely something is wrong with the battery. Whether it will stop engine start, that might be debatable. Seems there is some confusion in the linked thread about what +30 and +15 mean (when relating to fuses). +30 is live/hot battery power. +15 is key power (explained in the last post) If it's not the siren, we may have to look elsewhere.
By the way, the Immobiliser ECU has 3 sources of power. Live battery power (from the aforementioned fuse), key power (directly from the key) and live battery power from a second fuse in the frunk (F9 - Luggage Light). I haven't heard of this other fuse causing issues, but it's worth a look. Immobiliser issues have also been caused by wiring from the Immo ECU to the RH engine ECU. Let me know if you need a wiring diagram.
Any chance immobiliser has internal battery that went flat , and system needs juice in internal battery to clear block ? If so connect up charger and leave key in on position for a few hours ??
Would a trickle charger be able to keep all the electrics powered with the key on? I know in the old days, it wasn't recommended to leave the ignition on for long periods without starting the car, but I'm not sure about modern cars.
A Ferrari 1 or 2 amp charger struggles with the key off . I think with the old cars it was to do with the coil if memory serves me right. It is odd his probs started after leaving key on, so everything went flat. Hence my question about immob internal battery
Use the search box on here , 360 immobiliser battery, Up comes a big list of 360 immobiliser fixes. Batteries leaking inside the siren and getting on the electronics card is one issue
Hi Ian, I removed the siren this morning, checked all the fuses including F9, also pressed the interia swtich. Unfortunately still nothing. I wanted to believe the alarm siren was the culprit, was worth a shot.
Difficult to know where to go from here. The flat battery may have caused some issue, but we can't exclude some random fault. How long was the car not used? I guess we can assume the ignition is not working (because you used the brake cleaner as a fuel substitute). You've checked the Motronic fuses, so we are still looking at the Immobiliser and the Motronic ECU(s) themselves. Could there be a sticky relay somewhere? e.g. the RH Motronic Master (#55). Try pulling a non essential relay and fitting it into this position (e.g. window heat #45). The Motronic relay is 10 amps and I couldn't find any other non-essential 10 amp relays to swap it with., but the window heat is 30amps, so that should be fine. The UK, especially, has issues with radio towers causing interference with the immobilisers, but you're in a garage, so I imagine the signals from any radio tower would be attenuated. There have also been cases of batteries which seem ok on the surface, but they are not providing enough amps for cranking and all the other stuff.
Do you have more than one black key fob? Did you use the same fob as the last time you drove the car? I'm wondering if one of your fobs is cloned. These can get out of sequence with proper fobs. The fob gurus can probably explain it better than I can (and how to get them back in sequence)
I've got all 3 fobs. Yup checked resistance on the fuel pump related relays and those fuses (from your diagram on another post, was super helpful thank you). Will try relay 55. Car wasn't driven for a week. I've been driving it on a weekly basis. Then I turned it on to open the frunk and forgot to turn it back off. I'm in currently sunny Melbourne in Altona so there's not much going on around here
oops.. I don't know why I assumed the UK (other than the fact there would be more RHD cars in the UK than in Aussie)
#45 is a 30A fuse as oppose to a relay. I tested resistance on #55 but I'll put it through a 12 DV power supply to check the gate (just in case) I go to bunnings and get myself el cheapo ozito car battery tester and double check it. I actually called RACV hope they'd have something but they had a multimeter which looked like it was from aliexpress for $2. I'm guessing after that it's the immobilizer control board?
My mistake. Try relay #52 (window heat relay). Weird. I'm sure the NRMA here in NSW had the proper load testing gear. Did you generally only use one fob for the car? Do you know for sure you don't have cloned fobs? If you have a multimeter, I would be doing resistance checks on the immo wiring first. Unfortunately, the wiring goes through the Immo Interface Unit which has nothing but black wires on it and identifying which is which can be a little tricky. To make things more difficult, the numbers on the plug (on the car) may be different from the numbers on the diagram. Also, the components are buried behind other components. There was a gentleman who went through this process (maybe last year) and might have some tips, but it might be difficult to find the thread. Anyway if you look at the bottom/middle of this early coupe diagram... https://www.dropbox.com/t/LqBZx0Vl2yEqhk7x Pin 5 of the top plug (12H) of the Immo ECU goes to a splice (no idea where that is) to pin 4 of the Immo Interface Unit "17H". There are electronics in the unit, so I'm not sure if the wire just loops through or if there is some kind of processing. Anyway the coded signal comes out on pin 5 of the interface unit and goes through inline connector 6G/11G (pin 6) to pin 3 of the upper plug on the RH Motronics ECU. You might be able to work out the numbering system on the Immo Interface Unit by looking at which side of the inteface plug has two wires and which has 4 wires, then go from there. It should look something like this: Image Unavailable, Please Login If in doubt, send a photo of the plug. For any immobiliser work, I can recommend a guy in Canberra who was the first guy to start fixing Ferrari immobilisers. He replaced a chip for me in my Immo ECU. I have his details somewhere. Here's his website: https://immofixer.com/
Ugh... I just realised that the website says he only fixes 355, 456, 550 and 575 Immobilisers. The chip he replaced for me was on a 355. I would still ask him about it, though. The website also says this: in June 2014 I became the first person to successfully read and decrypt the PIN code and re-program the Bosch Immobiliser system fitted to 355, 360, 550 and 575 Ferraris.
Thanks Ian. Might have to call in for some help. I do have a multi-meter but starting to get past the point of my familiarity. Should have paid more attention in digitals systems at uni but lucky I have a few friends who did. I scanned the car and it got error "P1570 Immobilizer Malfunction" which consistent with symptoms. I put in a new battery anyways as the old Yuasa one was from 2006(!), it tested good and had a wonderful run. So it wasn't the battery. I've messaged immofixer too.
