Somehow I didn't see this thread until now… that's kind of weird considering how much time I spend on here! It didn't seem your question was answered (unless I missed it). The "4" in "GT4" is indeed for 4 seats, not 4 cam. I'm not sure how that rumor ever got started, maybe from people embarrassed to have a Ferrari with four seats? Anyway, I'm certain I've read it was referencing four seats in period magazines (Road & Track, Car and Driver, etc.) when the car was new, but Ferrari's website also notes that fact in no uncertain terms: "As with the 246 Dino, the numbers in the model title referred to the engine total cubic capacity, and number of cylinders, in this case 3 litres and 8 cylinders, with the figure 4 relating to the number of seats." https://www.ferrari.com/en-EN/auto/dino-308-gt4 And for fun, here's mine: 10388 Image Unavailable, Please Login
I’m pretty sure that information is incorrect. If 4 refers to the seating then why add “2+2” to the name? It’s superfluous. Does a 365GTB4 have four seats? By the same token, why doesn’t the 330GT 2+2 have a “4” suffix since it has four seats? The 308GTB and GTS don’t have designators for the number of camshafts ircseats Remember, that information came from the official Ferrari web site….the same outfit whose Classiche department knows less about the cars than many of their customers and enthusiasts, particularly anything built during the Enzo era. I dare say there’s more collective knowledge on this web site than at the factory.
You're probably right about this group having more collective knowledge than the factory, at least concerning the 308 GT4, and in some aspects, but that doesn't mean the folk here always have infallible and accurate information! I mean, come on, Ferrari is anything but consistent with their naming conventions from model to model. A Dino 246 is a 2.4 liter 6 cylinder, but a 308 GT4 is not a 3.0 liter V8 - it's 2.9. And a 365 isn't a 3.6 liter 5 cylinder… anyway, my point being that Ferrari names their cars whatever tickled their fancy at the time they named them. Think about it - you actually proved my point in your response! There's not rhyme or reason to the way they've named their cars from model to model, so it could literally be anything. Ferrari was developing the 308 GTB at the same time, so they couldn't call the 308 GT4 a GTB. And the 308 GTB has the same engine, and they didn't call it a 308 GTB4. So, why not? If you think about it, slapping on a "4" at the end denoting the 4 seat configuration simply makes sense knowing a two seat version with the same engine was coming out. If the "4" stood for the cams, then logic would have dictated naming the 308 GTB with the same nomenclature, thus we should have 308 GTB4 and 308 GTS4. But we don't. I get that Ferrari might… um… fudge a few numbers in publications, or on their own website, when it comes to performance, but it would be pointless to fudge a fact about how the name of the model is derived. Especially for a 50 year old car that was never that popular in the first place. In fact, if they wanted to mislead the public about the meaning of the "4" it would seem they would have said it was a reference to the cams as it would make it "cooler" or "more important" - but they didn't write that. That just makes the whole story seem completely believable. Right now, the only evidence I've seen as to what the "4" designates in the name comes straight from the horse's mouth. And it makes sense. Show me documentation otherwise.
I don’t think they’re “fudging” it for some sort of imaginary gain. I just think they don’t know what they’re talking about. That stuff probably isn't written by some Ferrari history guru in a musty attic office in Maranello. It likely came from a PR firm in Milan or Rome with very little vetting from the factory. The documentation I’d like to see would be from 1973, not something that was written for a web site probably 20 years ago and then forgotten about. Just for comparison I looked at the web site’s entry for the 365GT4 2+2. There’s no explanation at all of the meaning of the 4 but we know that the motor has four overhead camshafts,
Believe what you want to believe my friend, but looking at another model range for a clue as to what the "4" is in "GT4" doesn't really prove your case. Ferrari is obviously inconsistent with model names from model to model, however within a model range they are consistent. You note the "4" in 365GT4 2+2 is for the cams, but the "365" part is not "3.6 liters 5 cylinders" like the 308 is "3.0 liters 8 cylinders" - so they clearly aren't following the same naming convention for the two different model ranges. Being consistent within model range, since the 308 GT4, GTB, and GTS are all part of the same model range and share the same engine, then if the "4" represented the cams, then we should also have a 308 GTB4 and a 308 GTS4. But we don't. That tells me the "4" has nothing to do with cams or anything else related to the engine. I can see why you think that, I honestly do, but think about what Ferrari was in 1970s, and think about the naming conventions logically (meaning independent of each other) and it really just makes sense. I can't account for your distrust and low opinion of Ferrari and their business practices, but something like this is on their website and I see no logical reason it wouldn't be true. Besides, if the "4" is indeed representative of 4 seats as they say, then that's actually worth noting on their site as it was a deviation from what the "4" meant in other cars—such as the 365GT4 2+2 (which is why they wouldn't mention it for that car). Wow, literally every shred of logical thinking points to Ferraris website being correct. I'm no guru or expert myself, but I do spend a lot of time researching and reading about the 308 GT4 specifically, and I know Ferrari's website isn't the first place I've read that. If I ever run across a period article that notes that, I'll be sure to snap a photo and post it for you. But, in this case, the official Ferrari site is good enough for me. That's not to say I can't be convinced the other way, but that would require some sort of evidence or documentation. And, side note, I really enjoy lively discussion like this — keeps my on my toes. Thank you!!
Good analysis, Chris, but I’ll stubbornly stick to mine until we see some in-period documentation from someone in the company who was involved at that time or knowledgeable about matters that occurred then. . For sure, model designations were consistently inconsistent through the decades. Some were even incomprehensible to all except the most informed persons. My distrust…I think skepticism is probably a fairer characterization.…of some of Ferrari’s business practices are born mostly of the changes in the way business is done in general over the past 50 years. Although this is more about their lack of interest in the Enzo era cars and their heritage except as a way to make money from them. I don’t believe they intentionally mislead about matters as inconsequential as the one we’re discussing. I simply doubt the amount of effort and research that goes into something that has no effect on the bottom line. Their interest is in selling new cars, as it should be for a public company. We don’t know who wrote the blurbs about the individual models on their web site, who vetted them before publication, etc. I just take them with a grain of salt as to their accuracy. But I’d love it if we found out beyond doubt, either way. Apologies to Shawn for derailing the thread.
Ferrari these days is certainly a far cry from what it was in the Enzo era, no doubt, you'll get no argument from me on that. It's very "corporate" now in the way things are run. And, working for a large corporate entity myself, I can guarantee you my company would never let an incorrect information out. And if something incorrect did get out, it would be corrected ASAP and the person responsible would be held accountable (believe me, I've had to "fix" a lot of things in my time that I didn't "break"). And I *think* those classic sites were created for the 75th anniversary, I could be wrong about that? But at Casa Ferrari Pebble Beach that year, the nameplates in front of our cars had QR codes on them that went to the website for each car. So an audience of Ferrari's best clients, and some of the richest people in the world were scanning barcodes and ready the history of vintage Ferraris right there on the field. Just knowing how large, profitable, international corporations work in general (especially ones that are protect their image with a vengeance… like my company and Ferrari), I feel pretty confident they wouldn't let anything out that they weren't absolutely certain about—yes, even that trivial. I think a lot of effort and research went into it (simply because it does where I work). Maybe that gives you some insight into why I'm likely to trust/believe Ferrari in this case. I may work for a different company, but the high profile aspect of it and the work I do is very similar to what we're discussing. I'll put it this way, if I had put out some incorrect info on my company's website (even if I thought it was correct), and even if it was just a small thing of no consequence, I probably wouldn't be working there anymore. But I also do have plenty of skepticism when it comes to corporate things as well, just not in this particular area. Image Unavailable, Please Login
I admit that this is totally anecdotal because it is based on my personal experience in the early '70s talking to other Ferrari owners. When I bought my Dino in '74 the 308 GT4 was in the dealer showroom's. The design appeared to come out of left field after the organic lines of the 246 and it generated a lot of discussion among Ferrari owners. While some liked it, some hated it, and some assumed that it could/would grow on you, everyone referred to it as the Dino four-seater. Perhaps because Dinos were not considered "real" Ferraris, no one I spoke to posited that the GT4 designated four cams as on the 12-cylinder cars. It was just considered an oddball 4-seater Dino.
Another interesting tidbit I just ran across… I was looking in some period magazines at the reviews for the 308 GT4 in 1974 and 1975. I didn't find any mention as to why it was named what it was named, but one article from 1974 mentioned the "upcoming two seater" (308 GTB), which was kind of cool. However, a lot of the articles actually referred to the car as "Dino 308 GT 2+2" (note the absence of "4" altogether). These were magazines reviewing the latest, newest car out of Maranello. Maybe Ferrari just decided to solve the math problem at the end of its name and that's where the "4" came from. Anyway, I just thought that was interesting. Even the first prototype had the "Dino 308gt4" badge on the trunk, so you would think all the reviewers could have got the name right in their articles.
