Should Ferrari Listen?

Market cap… had an interesting discussion with a friend on RACE market cap ( currently 75 billion ) . Would the value of ALL cars produced be worth more ?
Like 300,000 units x 150k avg ?


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Total production so far is 309'000.

Marcel Massini

 

The stock market doesn't think like that. It is forward looking. People are placing bets on what might happen six months to a year from now.

 

Any idea as to current production levels? 15,000? 20,000?

 

13,663 cars last year.

 

Thx!

 

I'm quite certain there is. The thing is, it's presumably less profitable than the alternative, which is to (a) not invest in developing an entirely different drivetrain, (b) still sell every car they can build, and (c) not take on whatever new liabilities they'd introduce with a manual.

But of course there's a market. Offer, say, modern Ferrari styling, a modern, high-revving, NA V12, modern suspension, modern fit and finish, modern interior, modern reliability and a third pedal and you'll have buyers.

Still, as much as I wish they'd build that car, I know they won't. But hey, at least for now, they're still building some amazing cars. Your steak to my lobster. And I'm thankful for that. Surf 'n turf, baby. Two of each please.

 

Hopefully, Ferrari will slow down its EV plans and make room for more ICE cars.

 

ICE will return for all manufacturers


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Let's hope! I like steak and lobster, but not tofu.

 

+1. You put your Badge on the car you are responsible for all of the car Gm outsourcing stands at approximately 72% but it is still all GM

 

driven one on track, but only to 159mph... it seemed rock solid to me, and the brakes - wow. that was the most impressive thing to me.

I agree 145MPH is way to fast on the street... the crazy thing is getting to that speed in an 812 - not very hard or long.

 

Looks like Porsche has upped the ante!

https://www.cnn.com/2024/03/11/business/porsche-reveals-its-most-powerful-car-ever/index.html

Porsche unveils one of the fastest road cars in the world, featuring a 1,000-horsepower ‘launch control’ button

 

Ugh, just trying to add more tofu to our diet…..no thanks, I already have a souped up toaster oven.

 

Porsche still offers both, no?

What are their sales of a 911 model split by manual vs. DCT or whatever they offer?

I still recall Ferrari offering both and few ordering the gated shifty thingies.

 

Not sure about Porsche. As for Ferrari, manual orders were low on the 430 and exceptionally low on the 599.

Still, the weak demand could be misleading for a few reasons I can imagine:

1. It could have been a case of not knowing what you've got until it's gone.
2. Paddles still had some novelty at that point (most cars still had three pedals or automatics).
3. As someone pointed out earlier, dealers were incentivized to order and sell F1s, so the numbers may not truly reflect end consumer preferences.

My guess (worth very little) is that if Ferrari reintroduced manuals, they'd sell more than they did with 430s and 599s, but still a small minority. But, who knows? And, for better or worse, I don't think we'll ever find out.

 

On the GT3 front, after 5 years of the re-introduced manual transmission, the take rate is still around 50% and you STILL need to be “somebody” to get one anywhere near MSRP, a shame since it would be the only top end car I could afford to buy new…..can’t justify a $50-75k markup.

And you know, even if Ferrari produced one, it would be extremely limited so even 99% of the wealthy around here wouldn’t get one. So all the poor schlubs like myself would have are bitter feelings.

 

Well said. i do think the low 3 pedal orders on those cars is misleading.

 

It is simpler than that. Dealers, who wrote the orders, made more money specing F1 transmissions because it was a pricey option. Follow the money.

 

Mr. Massini, may I ask how do you count total production?
I know that VINs are in ...309xxx range, however to count total production I always thought like this: from 001 S up to 75 000, 37 500 Ferraris for the road were made (at the beginning they only used odd-numbered serial numbers). Since serial number 75000 all the way up to serial number 309000 (more or less highest serial number known right now), 234000 Ferraris were made. So, 234000 + 37500 = 271500. Add in 6739 Dinos (206s, 246s and 308 GT4s) and you've got about 278 239 Ferraris. Even if you add circa 475 even-numbered competition cars, you've got 278 714. Am I missing something here?

 

I meant to write that the current highest chassis numbers are in the 309XXX range.
Nevertheless, the number of Dinos is higher than you indicated. Plus you can also add all the single seaters, plus all the special project and one off cars and all the XX and challenge cars with four digit chassis numbers as well.

Marcel Massini

 

I had a 430 manual. Couldn't give it away when I tried to sell it. Now, it's popular. Go figure.

 

Ah, these old ***s are so stubborn that I guess at some point Ferrari will make a manual again. But the market is what it is, the old ***s are a minority, and the manual Ferrari will be some sort of limited edition. With the electric Ferrari already lurking, I think the manual gearbox debate is little more than a footnote.

 

Man, I wish I'd had the money then.

 

So do I. It was panic city at the time. Not a single person was interested. Everyone wanted the F1 trans. My, my.