LaFerrari replacement: v12, no hybrid, less power than SF90stradale?

Picture the F40s rear polycarbonate being painted.

 

Black roof only for the doors and A pillar ?
Central section body colored it seems.

 

Well said!! And correct !! ( imvho) !

 

Like this, I think. Black for A-pillar and roof + the door top scoop that leads to the ‘NACA’ duct and then the ‘air box’/charging port hinged cover… by finger painting on iPhone:

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7 weeks , 3 colors , 1 x V6 , Hybrid ( 2-3 motors ) , > 1200 bhp , < ???…{ please edit } ?? Kg , active multi vector wing , partially exposed rear screen , 8 speed , haptic everything , New challenge type steering - wheel, carbon tub n wheels ,carbon option of body color fade for the real -REAL big boys , certain pop up ( above the pilot) controls , single wiper ( with Dom Perignon Vintage 2012 screen wash . and a really important side pocket space for my Hoyo de Monterey epicure number 1s… Monterey - Ciao /Hola/Hello/Sat Sri Akaal! ❤️

 

F250 will undoubtedly have monster downforce and power figures. The biggest unknown for me is its mass.

Can we expect a (honest) 3,200 lbs curb weight? It should be handily lighter than the LaF with its smaller V6 and advancements in carbon tech, batteries and e-motors over the last 10 years.

 

Yes, I see that the new behemoth from Molsheim uses a proper V-16–a double-long V-8 lump—that just screams ‘compact’ power plant… like so many race-winning cars… oh, wait.

Even if made by Cosworth—suddenly the new go-to for ‘manufacturers’ who can’t make their own engines and need an engine that is the complete opposite of the compact designs Cosworth established their fame with—that car is just big-time showboating. And not even that original since these guys did a V-16 40 years ago:

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Unfortunately this really happened under LDM who over corrected to save the company and turned it into the world’s premier luxury marketing machine. Some of the worst products to roll out the gate were feed to a different clientele who ate them up with a spoon!

The spirit of Enzo (a racers mentality) still lives but it’s harder to see through the romanticism LDM created and the chairman successfully exploited with the IPO.

IMHO in terms of the actual product the post-LDM era, has swung back in a direction more tolerable to Enzo and those who worked many years ago who didn’t cash their checks to keep the company afloat pre-LDM.

The F250 will likely be hard to digest for customers LDM spoon feed but might
appeal to a type of customer Enzo and the old timers might actually enjoy talking to.

Regardless of era, in the end whatever the men and women produce within those gates is a real Ferrari and they can thank Enzo and LDM for that. Probably have to give some credit to the Chairman for listening to the old timers many years ago.


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Bruce and his team at Cosworth had to do something until he retires as the race engine business died off! Still ran a bit like a race engine shop from the 80’s and 90’s.


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Will the F250 have a 900Volt system like the 499P ?

 

Good post, very thought provoking.

 

Which is the difficulty they will have. A race engine and a road engine have to do very different things. Mostly to do with a road engine having no specific engineers to manage it on a day-to-day basis. Every engine needs to be exactly the same, same parts coding, works with the same workshop manuals and warranty systems. From direct experience, racing people building road car engines just struggle with this mindset because you are forced to sacrifice optimal performance for more mundane practical issues which, as it turns out, are very important to customers.

 

I don't think they were as bad as before. The 348 and the Mondial T, for example, were vastly inferior to LDM's Ferraris. That said, today's Ferraris are the best ever, as per Enzo's edict (the best Ferrari is the next one).

 

It’s lighter than 400V but I doubt Ferrari use 900V for road car

 

The last time I was able to talk to LCDM was at Cavallari. He was there informally, in relaxation mode with his little dog.
His concern was to respect the spirit of Enzo, it was very clear in his words, he did not want to make any car just to sell it. He was viscerally attached to Ferrari and his knowledge was enormous. One of his favorite models was the 456, and he saw a road-going Ferrari with elegance and adequate engine.
Let's be clear, Marchionne gave him the exit door for 2 reasons, the first is that he refused the IPO, and the second because he embodied Ferrari post Enzo.
Objectively, today, we have... the opposite.
The new clientele doesn't care, they buy the badge. This is also the case of a clientele of enthusiasts present here (I don't judge) who seek to legitimize new cars by all means and to extract a link with the past, because it is impossible to detach oneself from it.
But "objectively", let's be clear, Ferrari is another brand, and the only tangible link is the badge.
Everyone has the right to do what they want, it's neither good nor bad, but let's avoid telling ourselves stories and let's face reality.
With the exception of the 12C, the current cars could carry another badge, they no longer represent the original identity. Not at the level of the ^performers of course since the whole strategy is focused on it, but at the level of emotion. It has completely disappeared. Where is the emotion and pleasure of the senses characteristic of Ferrari in a 296, SF90, PS, and the EVs to come??? If we consider a Ferrari as a whole dedicated to the pleasure of the senses, it is now absent. So there remains this mythical badge for the greatest pleasure of shareholders.
Everyone has the right to do what they want, it's neither good nor bad, but let's avoid telling ourselves stories and let's face reality.
With the exception of the 12C, the current cars could carry another badge, they no longer represent the original identity. Not at the level of the ^performers of course since the whole strategy is focused on it, but at the level of emotion. It has completely disappeared. Where is the emotion and pleasure of the senses characteristic of Ferrari in a 296, SF90, PS, and the EVs to come??? If we consider a Ferrari as a whole dedicated to the pleasure of the senses, it is now absent. So there remains this mythical badge for the greatest pleasure of shareholders.

 

Whatever they claim it weighs, add 400-500 pounds.

 

There’s a lot here, some almost verbatim repeated. It’s all opinion (except
for the personal anecdote). The 296, to me, has more Ferrari in its DNA than the SF90. Certainly in design language. The SF90 was definitely a departure from anything Ferrari has done. But that doesn’t make it “not” a Ferrari.

Both cars elicit emotion and I believe Ferraris elicit a special “Ferrari” feeling while driving them beyond the badge. Far beyond the badge. I use special deliberately. I don’t mean better by special.

 

I’ll never understand that - or why they release renders of a launched vehicle with enlarged wheels and shrunken fender gaps. We have eyes.

 

I drove the Roma and wasn't overly impressed with it in general. It wasn't a bad car, but it didn't really excite me. I don't like ****loads of tech, so that was probably a big part of it. To your point though, turbo lag was minimal.

My point was not to say that all turbos are laggy. Technology has gotten way better. My point was that NA engines of the same peak power generally have more low end power. They don't need the turbos to spool up.

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LDM never wanted to go public with an IPO, that is in fact why he was ousted. Going public was Elkan and Marchionne in Elkan’s effort to strangle the golden goose for all its worth to finance the rest of Fiat.

 

Really? What's not emotional about the cars you mentioned?

Actually it is the opposite. Turbocharged engines have more power lower down in the rev range. You are mistaking power for responsiveness.

 

I redid my research and stand corrected.

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I have raced both NA and TT. I cannot say one is better than the other, they are different and you ring out the throttle on the NA, not necessary on the TT. The TT is more efficient relative to power to weight and does have more torque at mid RPM. Turbo lag is a thing in the past compared to my 20 year old Turbo911. The only possible way to evaluate these cars is on the track at full chat. As they are developing the F250, I am sure they are considering the XX version they will make and in that car you will be able to fully experience what Ferrari is all about.


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You have said it all.

 

As much as I wish this weren’t true, it’s not possible to cling to the past. Whether that be from a business model, or a design approach. The new cars will never be able to match the feeling and experience of the old, not because there isn’t a desire to, but because of global mandate and change. Enzo’s blood still flows through the company, but there has to be a realistic and viable balance between the past, and the now.