812 Replacement Rumors

Nannies for nanny!


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that, or nanny could just drive good in straight line

 

This guy was lapidary

 

Completely wrong conclusion about the SF90. Driven by similar drivers, the SF90 is quicker in slow corners, fast corners and on the straight. F12 disappears in the rear view mirror on every part of the track. SF90 is also not soulless. For example…

 

There is no chance you’d be getting close to the SF90 in a front-mid v12. Not even in the same realm of performance. I agree I like the sound of the B12 much more, but I took an SF Nanny up to the canyons and was blown away by how tightly you can turn in. And of course, the speed exiting turns was almost useless because it’s so fast.

 

A recent picture of a 12 C in Maranello still using the light camouflage.

After the considerations that were made here about the SF 90 Stradale and the new generation of soulless hybrids with increasingly more power, the 12 C, whether we appreciate its aesthetics or not, is without any doubt in terms of the purity of its NA engine probably the last of the Mohicans. Therefore, and for all of those who don't like some of the lines of the 12 C, it seems to me that the only positive approach is to apply Enzo's old maxim "You pay for the engine and I'll provide the coach for free".
In this logic in which what Ferrari is truly selling is a rare and precious engine, we have to accept with a smile what is given wholesale for free. The only drawback is that this exceptional engine has an exorbitant price when compared to others that already exist and which are almost equivalent.





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Agree with everything you said, thus I opine that 812 GTS is just very special with the looks much more universally enjoy and unchallenged as the 12c.

 

we heard this story before "this v12 is the last of them",

812 will be the last
purosangue will be the last
12C will be the last.

Then ferrari announcing that they will keep building V12s until it is no longer possible.

Porsche abandoning their EV 2030 target due to decline in EV sales.

I see the world shifting in the next couple of years so we might expect another V12.

 

If the present EU policy is applied that will ban sales of new CO2-emitting cars in 2035, sales of new combustion engine vehicles running on traditional petrol and diesel will end. However, the biggest EU lawmaker group recently elected on EU elections wants to revise this fundamentalist ban but is yet uncertain what will be the outcome. Even if the 2035 ban is not postponed, E-fuels are what could keep combustion engine cars on the road in the EU past the 2035 deadline. Because these fuels are carbon neutral, everything indicates that they will be the future and the way to once and for all silence the fallacy of the electric car.

I agree with you, this V12 wont be the last from Ferrari and will continue to be produced as long as there are buyers. When I mentioned previously that the V12 would probably be the last of the Mohicans, I didn't mean that it would end, but rather that there is practically nothing equivalent.

 

Unfortunately this won’t be the last of the rumors this is the last of the last of the last of V12. I do hope as the EU EV clouds dissipate the Ferrari powers that be will do the brave thing and develop a new V12 instead of rehashing the current with minimal improvements in power etc(yeah I know, this V12 is perfect- so how do you improve on perfection- maybe ask Gordon Murray)


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Murray? Is he an engine builder? I was under the impression that he commissioned the V12 to Cosworth...

 

Ferrari kicked their engine guy to the curb; now Michael Leiters has a nicer office at McLaren. As for Murray he is like a master chef who creates tasty treats and knows that power is only one ingredient. He also brings together other ingredients that Ferrari won't use...

 

I think the GMA recipe is just about perfect other than (a) the styling and (b) the price, which is beyond my reach.

The latter makes the comparison to the 12C a bit of a stretch. But do I wish Ferrari would do more to emulate Murray's philosophy? For sure, at least in one or two of its model lines.

 

You thing that Ferrari had just one engine guy? That is funny! Leiters is not even an engine engineer...

Regarding GMA, any manufacturer that doesn't build engines, is not a real manufacturer as far as I am concerned.

 

Not that a Pagani is less desirable for not building their own engines.
Aston Martin is quite a contender for the 12C too and uses Mercedes engines
Oh, McLaren doesn't do bad with Ricardo's either

I think that watches and cars are two different worlds.

 

Then I guess Aston Martin is becoming less of a manufacturer now that it is using MB Engines? Same for Pagani? Same for Rimac and Tesla since they technically don’t use any engine, which I think you mean by definition is an ICE?
Murray may not be a master engine manufacturer but he is a master car manufacturer who knows how to get the most performance out of each component he chooses and/or designs.
Don’t get me wrong, Ferrari has been a master at ICE manufacturing for decades and has appeared to have hit a plateau for its NA engines. Unless they pull a Cosworth and develop an all new NA V8 and V12, we have already seen the best Ferrari is willing to offer without forced induction or hybrid assist. That is ok by me but to charge $500K for a rehashed (albeit wonderful) V12(remember the car, a real porker, is thrown in for free) is a bit beyond the pale.


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Michael Leiters in the good old days...

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B E.

 

The best road car out of Maranello in the modern era, largely because of that engine and its placement within the chassis.

 

The engine is virtually the same of the 12 C, the only slight difference I can spot is more 19 Nm of Maximum Torque at 7250 rpm. Perhaps the placement of the engine within the chassis and also the SP3 lower dry weight , 75 Kg less than the 12C coupé, represent an advantage for the SP3.
Ferrari never revealed a lap time for the SP3 at Fiorano and probably never will. I suspect the same is going to happen with the 12 C.

 

Vanquish III will have the continuation AM 12 TT, not an AMG 12.

Saw a quickie peak on the configurator on my drive up to see my son- quite nice if you like Astons. Full car behind curtains next week.

 

Saw it as well
If I were tempted to get an AM- this would be it


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I admire the simplicity of a non turbocharged engine; having less complexity it's far more capable of remaining trouble-free than turbocharged ones.

Those with experience in this engine in its previous incarnations, how is it in terms of durability and reliability? major problems anyone?

 

Durable and reliable and it sounds FANTASTIC!
The only issue is battery issues as seen on this website although I personally have had none.


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Unfortunately yes, regarding AM. Paganis always used MB engines, an anathema to their supposed italianess.