Ethanol Gas not recommended by CIS Flowtech

In a previous post I mentioned my 1980 GTBi was not starting and running very well until warm.
Spitting and choking like a cobra.

Since then I sent off my WUR and Fuel distributor to CIS Flowtech.
They did an amaziing job. The parts are like brand new. See photos.

However! They also included an instruction sheet - See photo.
Please read line two where they emphatically state to use non ethanol fuel.
CIS must be saying it for a reason, and since they are the pro's it is hard not to take their advice.

How many of you actually run non ethanol fuel? (Maybe this only pertians to injected cars)

I have a source for non ethanol fuel here in MA (Sunoco 95 non ethanol Race gas). I am going to run this going forward. Anyone see any problems with that other than it is super expensive. Is it really necessary?

Thanks

 

If you've got cats = it also has to be non-leaded fuel (many "race fuels" are not non-leaded).

 

Thanks Steve, no cats in my case but great point. Will double check about the lead anyway.

 

Ethanol is destructive to the old fuel systems. That and it's mass is not the same as non ethanol fuel so the fuel ratio will be off slightly as CIS is a mass system pre calibrated by the system design.
But mostly the problem is water and corrosion of ethanol. The gov knew this way back when they mandated it.. They don't care. Except for exempting all federal vehicles.
Wish I had access to non ethanol fuel here.

 

Can't you buy non-ethanol at Sammy's Place ?

https://www.pure-gas.org/WA

 

Just posting a data point. In CT we have had 10% ethanol in gas since 2006. I have never used a fuel additive. My cars are stored 6 months out of the year. I have never bothered to top off the tanks. As a matter of fact they are typically stored with less the 1/4 tank of fuel. Yet not once, not ever, have I experienced any fuel related problems with either my 308 (owned since new) or my 355 (11 years), or any other motor vehicle or IC engine powered mower, tractor, snow blower, etc. Never had to service anything with the furl system other than change the filter. Just saying. You results may vary.

 

Here in the UK, 5% and 10% ethanol content unleaded fuel is the norm.
I've been running my 328 for over 20 years on 5% ethanol content fuel. The cold/warm CIS pressure test results are still as they were 20 years.
10% ethanol may be a step to far.

 

Totally agree with JohnK/post #6. Been running "normal" pump gas E10 in my '89 328 since I bought it in '08. Never had ANY issues at all with E10; never use any additives. IMO, much ado about nothing as far as normal operation. StaBil added for storage but I add it to whatever amount of fuel is in the tank at the time. I've never filled a tank for storage purposes.

FWIW re storage. I recently started my Kawasaki Z900RS for the first time in two years.! I didn't intend it to sit for two years but oh well...It had Stabil added at the time to about 1/3 tank of E10 gas - started/ran with no issues at all.

 

Hard to find non-ethanol near where I live. I've been running chevron pump premium with ethanol in my 89 Bentley (which has K-jet) but I add 4 oz of this ethanol treatment when I fill the tank. No issues so far (over 3 years). I'm planning to do the same on my K-jet 308 once it's on the road. Not sure it's necessary per above comments, but it's cheap and makes me feel a little better.
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Sounds like the consensus is no one is running non ethanol gas. Secondly, no one has had a reportable issue with non ethanol gas.

Maybe the CIS instruction is just a CYA?

 

In Canada, non ethanol gas is not longer available through normal gas stations. They say up to 10 percent ethanol, but no oil company that I am aware of discloses the exact percent in their different octane mixes.

The aluminum tanks in my Mondial 3.2 are going to be vulnerable to corrosion, and the internals of the fuel injection, accumulator, pressure regulator and various hoses will also degrade.

Thoughtless government edicts, and end up using land that could grow food be used for fuel. There is nothing environmentally sound about ethanol production, and it is an inferior fuel regarding energy density.

 

Of course any reasonable mechanic will recommend non-ethanol gas because it doesn't have any of the problems ethanol blends do, namely water absorption and phase separation. Plus ethanol gas is harder on hoses and seals of older engines. This is rule of thumb in the marine world as well. But it's impractical advice for most people in the USA now. I'd say most of us have no choice and run ethanol blends whether we want to or not. If you can find pure gas in quantity at a drive-up pump and the price is reasonable, definitely go for it with older car and boat engines, and especially 2-strokes and power equipment.

By the way, ethanol blends have some benefits, they are better solvents and they will clean out contamination and deposits far better than straight gas. It can be a strategic fill up in some scenarios where you need to clean a system out. And in the winter they can absorb unwanted water that condenses inside fuel tanks and be beneficial (remember the old days when people added "dry gas" to their tanks in winter? That was ethanol).

 

Here in the Philippines we have pure gasoline 97-98 octane . It’s marketed by Petron w/c is owned by 1 of the biggest classic car collector in our country . He is also the importer / distributor of Ferrari & BMW . I use this pure gasoline for both my 328 GTS and 3.2 Mondial Cab . I had one time experience a stuck fuel distributor plunger due to stale gasoline ( probably from the previous owner from Japan who uses gasoline w/ ethanol )

 

I'll add my two cents. I've been running E10, mostly Shell 93 octane, since I bought my '87 328GTS in early 1988. I occasionally add fuel injector cleaner when I fill up but that's it. Only thing possibly related to fuel was replacement of the oxygen sensor because the slow down light was coming on. That was over 15 years ago. Only normal maintenance since then.

 

Same as Richard #7 I run my 308QV on E5 here in the UK. Also for the last 20 odd years in my MGB. I’ve yet to hear of a failure of a MGB that can be definitely be caused by ethanol. It may exacerbate a component that is reaching the end of life but not the primary cause.

 

Good to hear since the newest 328 is 35 years old now.

And the oldest is 50

What could possibly go wrong using ethanol fuel now, right?

 

Ethanol gas is the worst, especially if it sits. Here in the Hudson Valley, there are 3 stations within a 5 mile radius that I can get 91 oct ethanol free gas. I also have a 35gal transfer tank I keep filled in the garage.
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This is one of those things like oil threads. No one who believes E10 is harmful to their car is going to change their opinion because someone else's experience indicates it isn't and visa versa. Do what you are comfortable doing!

 

There must be huge mountains of engines destroyed by E10 fuel somewhere.

 

The problem is that there is no option for many. If only the government would let the market dictate outcomes, so much of our live would be better served.

 

I run non-ethanol in my 78 308. There is an app called pure gas to help you find ethanol free gas. I am lucky there are several options in my area. If you must run E10 then I would add Sta-Bal unless you drive the car a lot. That crapy E10 collects water and you get lower gas milage. I try to keep ethanol free gas in all my older cars with a metal gas tank. If all the rubber parts have been changed out your fuel system should be ok.

 

Hey, look at it this way - we used to INTENTIONALLY add alcohol additives to the fuel to eliminate (absorb) water in the fuel system; now the fuel we buy has it included at no extra charge!!!

 

There is no question, ethanol is terrible for fuel systems. Race cars running 100% alcohol have to jump through lots of hoops to take care of the fuel system.
The fact remains there are a lot of CIS cars of many makes running every day on ethanol diluted gas without issue. In a perfect world I'd never use it but thats not the world we live in.

 

Per recommendations here on FChat, I'll be replacing all fuel hoses with SRI hoses ( scuderia rampante .com). I could be wrong, but I don't see anything else in the fuel pathway after the soft lines that could be negatively impacted by 10% ethanol blend fuel.