V-12 Engine into 308 Build, over on Grassroots

I do have valves in the exhaust to hopefully quite lower power.....like under 250-300hp, i need to hook them up. Its loud. I ran over the the gas station and picked up a neighbor(ish) who wanted a ride, "you said you were on your way and I heard something on 82 and thought it can't be him I'm hearing from way over there? Then it was on my road and them my driveway". I really should make it quieter.....he loved the ride though.

I'm back to having no faith in my O2 readings. I'm trying to use the ECUs internal controller....and 1 might be right but they don't match and I had trouble with channel 2 when I was setting it up so I kind of assume that is the wrong one....not sure though. I'm thinking its time to look at some plugs and to order at least 1 external controller, preferably 2 but budget.

Today I tried to get a log but the laptop shut down for whatever reason just after I pulled out of the development and before I put my foot into it to get some higher throttle/MAP data. Cold start and drive it was crisp and nice, but by the time I got home and things were pretty warm it just wasn't .... sure would be nice to have the log even if I don't trust the O2 numbers, at least I'd know what direction they moved. I thought I noticed this yesterday and today I'm certain.

I should get the USB log setup too. When the laptop is plugged it it logs anything I have a plot setup for because the PC memory is big, on a usb stick I'll need to be a bit more picky and but would be better than a laptop top the usually works fine.

And I need to sort what ever is going on with the column switches....right turn signal gets me horn, lifting up on the steering wheel gets me horn.

The oil leaks is an issue.....oil appears to be getting onto the axle maybe and is being thrown onto the rear header so it smokes and that is embarrassing. So I need to find and fix the leak.... or add a heat (aka oil) shield to keep it off the exhaust.

I did a kind of rough TB sync the other day and they are pretty good but the rear bank is different from the front and I can't reach that adjuster with the passenger side air duct in place. I need to pop that off and sort the sync. By 15-20% throttle the error is pretty much gone but I'd like it fixed.

Quite a punch list.

On the plus side it started nice cold again today. Then it start nice hot at the gas station twice because there was a line, only 2 pumps. I am so scared of heading out and then it not starting but it was fine. Leaving the gas station my neighbor called my attention to the the guys at the small shop across the street kind of looking in confused disbelief....the sounds it made starting made them look over but the sounds/acceleration leaving caused a bit of a jaw-drop and stare moment.

 

Where I am finding oil is confusing to me but I really suspect the oil feeds to both heads are leaking. That is a heads off repair so I will focus on remediation....because the engine isn't coming out and the heads are not coming off....I'm just not really clear about what the remediation looks like other than a wash every time it runs.

I am also learning wheel wells are important and I should have them because I'm finding the gravel they put on my road everywhere. Something to add to the list.

while cleaning the oil I noticed the front 2-1 collector doesn't fit all the great to one of the headers and is almost certainly leaking air, which could(would) make O2 sensor read leans. I'll try to seal it up with heat temp RTV and I did ordered 2 external WBO2 controllers

 

I've decided I'm almost certain the oil leak is the pressure feed to the front head which is bad(ish) news. My plan for today is to get as much access to the corner of the head where the feed pin is and silicone the bajesus out of it. Its pressure oil so I don't think this will work because its a pressure feed, but maybe. If it fails, the backup plan is silicone on a tube going to a catch can and silicone is about 100% effective at containing 0 pressure oil leaks, its just adding ugliness so backup plan.

The silicone will need a full day to dry so no driving today so after the silicone is on I'll get started on the rest of the punch list.

 

Aw dang. how does one get to it

 

What does the oil fitting going into the head look like?

 

It looks like this....a pin in the corner that the head gasket is suppose to seal and you get to it be removing the head. I'm going to make an silicone L 3-4" around the corner, extra thick in the actual corner and hope. Or, I'm going to do something similar with a hose barb buried in the silicon to let me collect the oil. One way or the other it will get sorted until the next rebuild many years from now and someone, hopefully not me will be wonder WTF is going on will the silicone everywhere
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Be careful if you keep saying your not taking the motor out and heads off you are dooming yourself to having to do it.LOL!

In an earlier post you said you were thinking of getting a USB logger. I would highly recommend it. I still plunge in my laptop when I am road tuning, there is no one with a good dyno in my town. The nice thing about a logger is its logging anytime the car is running. If you go on a drive and something happens you have a log to look at and find the problem. This has happened to me, the log was great to have.

all that said I only know my ECU and software. It was a steep learning curve

 

Actually found the oil leak and it way less than I was thinking....just a bad fitting that is hard to get to and impossible to see until the intake is off.
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New fitting coming tomorrow but it will be Monday or Tuesday before its all back together and ready to drive again.

 

I don't need to get anything, the ECU has a place to plug in a USB drive and they included one with the ECU. I need to add a switch to tell the ECU to run a log....I think. I could try just telling it to always log and see what happens but I'm not sure it can talk to the PC and the USB stick at the same time so that could be a problem...I could try though I guess.

 

$15 and 10 minutes with the grinder got me a tool to remove the hose
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I got the coolant stuff back on and added a bottle of water wetter and 1 gal of green coolant and rust should now be in check and I have almost an extra 10F before boiling. Tomorrow I'll see what's up with the column switches while I wait for the oil fitting

 

This will make you happy. It turned out setting up the USB drive logging so I don't need the laptop was trivial...just add a line to the model that says logging on so now if the USB stick is plugged in it should be records. It worked in the shop anyway. Not sure what happens if the stick is full, probably stops I suppose.

Its pretty capable:

I turned on about 15 channel at the default 20hz for now.

The cluster switches were also pretty straight forward to correct. One issue was I assembled it with the front bit that rotates with the steering wheel clocked wrong, that should fit the turn signals. And the headlight switch was missing a piece, don't know how I didn't see it before, but I made a new one from a nylon body clip thing and the lights work again....I wondered why it was so sloppy, now it click on/off nicely.
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I noticed the slow down and brake lights that are supposed to be malfunction and shift respectively were always lit. There was a typo in 1 of the malfunction conditions so that should be fixed now. And the shift light stuff it looks like I planned to add it and wired the light but never added the function to the ecu so that is also fixed I believe.

During the 9k burnout you can hear the engine bouncing off the rev limiter, the only problem is I realized I have a soft limit set so there should be no bouncing on anything. In the log I posted you can see the throttle opening and closing, that is what caused the sound and should not have been happening. The best I can tell I tuned the throttle actuator on battery voltage, but running is higher voltage so it moves faster and my tuning values were too aggressive and allowed it be become unstable when I hit the throttle quick. I cut the tuning values by 20% which should fix it but I'll need to confirm when its running.

 

Good to hear. On my ECU 11hours is about 1 GBh.

 

How many channels at what rate?

 

Oil fitting replaced and cranking at 56psi it doesn't leak.

The intake manifolds are on and the fuel system leak checked.

The plugs are all black so its pig rich when its warm and I wasn't imagining it losing pedal response as it got warm. Hopefully the new WBO2 controllers give me more helpful readings. There is still a hint of oil on #6....maybe? but I suspect with the mixture fixed it will be fine.
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Also there's oil on the plug bodies of 9&10....leaking cam cover I guess. I'll put some silicone on it until its apart again.

Tomorrow clean plugs in and get the TBs synced. Then re-assemble the air box and such.

 

It’s capable of 200 channels at 25Hz. They say the average data rate allows to record about 11 hours per 1GB of memory card space. But the manual says for my ECU 1 GB is 35 hours. I am not running 200 channels. I will look tomorrow and see if I can see how many channels I am running. My last drive was 40 minutes long the log from it was 13 Mb. I have a 2ZZ Toyota motor with a TVS 900 SC. I have added fuel pressure and IAT. Everything runs through the ECU including fly by wire.

I know that’s a kind of a none answer.
I don’t mean to be a pest, just trying to help

 

The push to get it setup and running I'm sure will be very helpful to me. I added a few more channels to the log list last night, 19 now? All still at 20hz but each channel can be at it's own rate is I so choose but for now all 20hz

I was playing with the throttle setup, battery charger connected and had not problem getting the actuator to oscillate which is bad, so I worked on that a bit. Its kind of a tough game to keep it stable but also responsive and also settle at EXACTLY the set point so idle will be repeatable. Its a PID and I end up cranking up the I term way past where the basic "how to tune PID" formulas suggest......but it seems good now and ready for a real test tonight.

 

Tonight did not go exactly as planned
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Its just water but I do not see from where exactly. Driver's side I think....maybe damaged a hose moving things out of the way? Clamp not right? I don't see it. Tomorrow I will fire it back up with the wheel off and try and get a good look.

I did sync the TBs but I was struggling with idle right from startup. Perhaps because synced it just idles better or maybe linkage isn't exactly as it should be after having it apart? I extended the link from the actuator to the TBs which should make sure the TBs can fully close. Tomorrow I'll see if its better.

Also I forgot to plug in the air temp sensor. It mounts to the duct now and I just forgot so it was pretty rich thinking the air temp was -20C...so about 14% extra fuel going in I guess.

I don't really see much oil, a couple drops that's good I guess.

 

Tonight on the way home from work I stopped at autozone and grabbed a loaner radiator pressure test kit...i had no idea that was a thing. You pay them for it as a deposit, use it , return it and t5hey refund the money so its free to use.
Quickly found a poorly positioned coupler hose leaking under the car and got it fixed. Then plugged in the air temp sensor and fired it up, had a look and it was dry. re-checked the sync, pulled some fuel out and it was running pretty good so I pulled it in ....and there was a small puddle, water.....and realized it was now leaking a lot. Lost about 1/2-1 gal on the shop floor. Looks like the real problem was the coolant manifold that lives under the intake leaks badly when its hot and under pressure.
I start pulling the intake but just don't like burning my fingers....tomorrow.

 

Progress is being made.

 

I got the shipping notice from 10point7 on the new WBO2 controllers but looking through logs while I ate breakfast I think a big part of my WBO2 sensor issues has been the sensors trying to tell me I had mechanical issues in the engine. Bank 2 has pretty much always read about 15% leaner than bank 1 but 2 years ago cylinder 12 was dead so that was the correct reading. A couple weeks ago plug 7 was white, it almost certainly wasn't running so again that was the correct reading best I can tell. Yesterday when I started I had this
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0-5% error between the banks, but rich. The rich I think it realated to the stoic change I made from 14.7 to 14.13 for the E10 I'm using. I had tan not black plugs, and I'm pretty sure this is the cause. Also note the purple coolant Temp correction going from 30% to 15% and lambda staying nearly flat. I changed the coolant correction after last weeks drives to get mixed stable with temp and so that is pretty close to as good as it can be I think.

When I went to check the TB sync I saw the 10 for cylinder 10 had popped off its MAP sensor so that was getting WAY extra fuel
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Near shutdown it looks like a cylinder in the front bank was dropping out at idle and back on with higher RPM
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...hopefully later today I'll find #10 is fuel fouled and don't need to hunt for another cause.

 

Wednesday I got the coolant stuff back together.

Thursday day and all were pretty black but a couple looked like they they shouldn't fire, so cleaned again. #6 was oily ans I found and (I think) fixed another leak in the port. Intake back on. It was past I can start it time but still early so I decided to hook up the vacuum valves on the mufflers. The vacuum hose off cylinder 10 was a little shorter than the others which is why it popped off the MAP the other day, so I added a T and a short bit of hose to fix its length. Off the T another short bit of hose to a check valve, the back to a solenoid valve, then the actuators. .

Today I took 1/2 a day to run out to copart to un-suspend my account, my son made a deposit to place a bid but his name was not on it...BAD!!!!. Got home and added code to the ECU to open the exhaust valves at about 300hp and close them when it drops top about 280hp. I was all out low/high GPIO outputs but the 2 throttle controllers were available and I realized I could use them as 4 highside, yay! Fired it up and immediately noticed the difference in sound level....hard to hear on a phone video maybe but:
https://youtube.com/shorts/iS-fNTynbXI?feature=share

I let it get good and hot and no leaks. As it run it was clear the tuning was buggered by the mufflers so I worked on that a bit and the front bank lambda was I think reporting gibberish....I'm certain they were wall lit yet it was about 20% leaner than the rear bank, decided to ignore it. TB sync looked fine so I shut down and reinstalled the air box and off for a drive. The other mufflers are definitely a lot less hash, much more appropriate for general driving.


I brought my son along for his 1st real ride, I need to train him to be a better ride a long tuner. It was looking and acting pretty rich, mufflers and I'm thinking I may need to have quiet/loud VE tables. I set the gopro up horribly so the interesting stuff doesn't show, a pickup seemed to truly believed he could hang behind near the start and a vette thought he'd walk away near the end, both were mistaken, I need to check the log but I don't think the mufflers even opened. By the time we got back it was smoking again, oil tank maybe? Don't know but it wasn't too bad and burned off quickly once I stopped so I decided to let my son take a spin around the block. We practiced stalling at the stop sign a few times and he seems to have that down pretty well now then finish without incident other than it was clear I really need to fix the power steering.

Tomorrow see if I can find the oil leak.

 

Just fantastic. Looks like it potters around town no problem.

 

It really does. I was terrified it would be like an on/off switch and just not run to drive slow but it is very well mannered. Its a little surgy coming off idle because I'm pulling back timing to make it idle, I want to play with that a bit more and I think that is what was causing my son issues at the stop sign. I just move the tach to about 2k to be out of the idle setting zone and go but some improvement is in order.

Hot starting is very good....the gas fouled looking plugs is partly me forgetting the air temp sensor but also I think I was way over fueling hot starts. So I've been moving fuel from the VE table to the cranking table and some to the coolant correction table so cold its getting enough but I'm still looking for the its not enough hot. I kind of knew to get hot start right first, but I can't do hot starts until it cold starts.......but yesterday at the stop sign we started it 3 or 4 times boom, boom, boom, and each was fine.

Hopefully the new WBO2 controllers come while the weather is still good so I can be certain if its my controller code being flaky or I still drop cylinder.....the exhaust pipes feel right, hot low velocity, when a cylinder drops the temp drops and velocity picks up, both bank feel the same so I really want to believe its the O2 sensors. Yesterday idling I decided not even look and do the mixture screw method...add until rpm drops, pull out until rpm drops, kind of put it in the middle and it ended up right were I started by trusting the rear bank sensor, around 0.95 lambda. But then out on the road you can hear me comment in the video then the sensor is saying rich going down hill so no load and in the cells I thought I tuned in the driveway before heading out...its confusing me a little so I'm wanting known good sensor setups.

I was hoping for a highway run this weekend.....got to find the oil problem. I think I'm going to drop the oil level. I was doing 14qts, I'm going to take 2 out, 12 is plenty...10 is plenty and give it more room to de-foam. There is for sure oil making out the vent hose. I had it going to a catch bottle in the trunk but never saw anything so when I add the deck lid I just coiled it on the engine bay thinking I'd add it to the passenger side air duct...but maybe back into t a catch can to see.

 

Figured I'd start with removing oil

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Then dry it off a little.....hmmm....this could explain why low power was wrong after I just tuned it....then had to pull the fuel regulator to install the air box and clearly got distracted. That log data is worthless.

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I found the oil tank cap was not sealing, fixed that but still not the oil leak causing the headers to smoke so the hunt continues.

I did break down today 3 or 4 miles from home, a strong pull to about 6k then dead! Checked all the fuses....hmmm. I had the laptop logging so I looked and eventually noticed the TPS was 120% so the throttle actuator was working 100% to close the throttle. I have a second sensor and I reprogrammed the actuator to use the other and got the throttle working but it was still dead, injection time 0msec....RIGHT! I have a flood clear setting so it TPS is greater than 90% during cranking it kills fuel to clear a flood. I disabled that and got it running and home. yay!

The issue was the clip locking the connector to the sensor is not locking still not sure why because at about that moment a work/autocross buddy stopped by to see it so chatted a bit and out for a ride. The ride left him really confused. 1st how can this car pull harder than his V10 pickup at 2k and then keep pulling to past 6k where I rolled out and it was obviously just coming onto the cam?...he just kept looking over at the tach in confusion as we cruised in 4 or 5th and accelerated whenever we chose and then if I down shifted! 2nd was how can a naturally aspirated engine pull like that at any rpm? He finally commented he'd been in cars this fast and certainly in cars that cruise as nice but just couldn't understand how 1 car could do both with near instant throttle response. I've said its hard to put this experience into words.....and its not just me.

Oh, something a little odd with the brakes, the front right is first to lock....it happened twice, just the front right. so pads not bedded? alignment weird? road pitch? Butt dyno said pretty high g force....I need to look into it.

Tomorrow I'll load the tune I just made based on the last logs. I had pulled out a LOT of fuel and now have it lean (if the O2 sensors are to be trusted) so slowly adding fuel back in and it is feeling better and better so everything seems to be going in the right direction.