FF Battery questions

ive had the most luck with Interstate. The FF eats batteries and wheels.

 

The Duracell AGM is also a great battery to consider ..diehard platinum as well

 

Just get an interstate from Costco. You'll likely need to replace the battery every 3-4 yrs in an FF so it helps that they're much cheaper. H8 batteries, for the most part, all have the same CCA and Ah. The small variations won't make a difference.

As for the charger, that JMR unit is a generic Chinese private labeled unit. Make of that what you wish.

See it here for yourself.

*OBLIGATORY DISCLAIMER* I also sell adapters. My intent here is to provide facts, not to disparage anyone.

 

Probably worth investing in an upgraded charger/conditioner too.

The CTEK 7002 is updated, and they have a "SEMA Builder Kit #2" that has a lot of accessories for it as well.

https://smartercharger.com/products/sema-builder-kit-2

 

The issue isn't usually the tender or the battery. The issue is the car design. FF's and GTC4 Lusso have their battery sitting in a location that cooks them from the high engine eat. They wrapped the battery in reflective foil but that does nothing for the insanely high ambient temps. As the heat cooks the battery, the tender's ability to do it's job diminishes over time. The battery should be replaced every couple of years and it's expensive to have a shop do it. We relocated the entire battery to the back of the car in my FF for this reason.

 

Hollywood mechanic moves the battery to the trunk

 

Modifying Ferrari electronics is a recipe for disaster. Replace the battery every 3-4 yrs. Big whoop. It’s typical Ferrari design, and it could be a lot worse.

There’s no good way to route heavy-gauge battery cables through the car, secure the battery without mangling the sheet metal, or install a vent tube since the battery is now located in the passenger compartment. Not to mention the fact that your tool kit and inflator now have no place to go if you put the battery under the trunk carpet, and you could replace the battery at least half a dozen times for the labor involved to relocate the battery.

 

You mean well but you’re talking to someone that has already done this. There are already tunnels under the car where the cabling goes and sheet metal has nothing to do with it. The box in back looks factory. The best FF shop in SoCal installs the kit for you or will sell the kit to your local indie. Or you can cook your batteries every 2-3 years and take the car apart each time to get the old one out and the new one in. That’s fine too.

 

How much space does it take up in the trunk. Can you post a pic?

 

you can see it at 4:01 of this video

 

Respectfully, it seems you might not have the full picture and have been influenced by Micah's marketing. Ask 3x8 owners how the high-current cabling from the alternator to the front-mounted battery holds up over time with exposure to the elements. There’s a reason Ferrari switched to routing the cabling through the passenger compartment in the 355.

As for your car, how do you think the cable gets from the front of the engine to the trunk? If it runs under the car, you'd need to drill a hole in the trunk to pass the cable through and to connect it to the battery. Replacing the battery every 3–4 years by removing the windshield cowl isn’t as difficult as it might seem—it’s about 1.5-2 hrs of work with some practice. And as I previously mentioned, you can replace the battery almost half a dozen times for the labor involved to relocate the battery.

 

It’s funny. The topic has come up. I am doing a preemptory replacement of my interstate AGM battery next week. The prior exact same type of battery is about three years old. And the last couple of weeks, if the car sits for more than two days, and I started up, the electrical Issue light go to dealership has come on. The car operates just fine after this. This is basically my car telling me it’s probably time to swap out the battery. These scars do talk to you, you just need to listen. I’m sure I could stretch out another seven or eight months on the battery, but better safe than sorry. FYI, I typically only use my battery tender if the car is not going to be driven for four or more days, and I have a Cytek battery tender Specified for AGM battery

 

Just changed my battery today in 30 minutes. No need to remove the windscreen cowl and the battery cost $200. Has to be one of cheapest DIY fixes on a Ferrari!

 

"you can replace the battery almost half a dozen times for the labor involved to relocate the battery."

I disagree. The dealer (which is the reality for most people) charges over 1,000 labor to change the battery, and you pay it because your car is already in for your major/minor service. The Interstate costs close to $300 and will reliably last 2 years, after which you are on borrowed time. So that's $1,500 a pop every 2-3 years, about the same as Hollywood's rear battery kit which includes all the parts. Yes you have about 3hrs labor to fit the kit, which is mostly removing the undertrays to access the (existing) channel, so that's$1K, give or take. So, 2 battery changes and after 4 years, you're saving $1K every time. Definitely not 6x..., and any exotic service shop with decent fab skills can replicate the kit components for less that Hollywood sells them. I have done relo kits on 3 of my cars (M5, C6 Vette (non-Z06), and the FF) and it's really not rocket science. Your battery (and your wallet) will thank you in the long run.

Also, the wires run in an existing plastic oem channel and are completely shielded by the undertray, so damage concern is zero. I am still on the same battery I did with the relo, 5 years ago. It's nice to no longer have faults. The key to success is the cabling, which has to be 1AWG multistrand pure copper (e.g. MTU/UL 1284) and clean soldering at the terminal ends. And you must of course originate and terminate at the terminal block (floating GND).

Finally, AGMs do not need to be ventilated. That's the whole point of them.

 

An Interstate H8 AGM from Costco is $170 before any state fees. If your battery only last two years, you're doing something wrong. Use the tender like the battery's life depends on it (because it does). The original Fiam battery lasted 3yrs in my Lusso and over 3yrs in my FF. Interstate in the Lusso is nearly 3yrs old and tests at ~95% health.

No dealer is interested in installing after market battery relocation kits. It's a DIY or indy job, hence my statement that you can replace the battery many times for cost involved to relocate the battery. Comparing dealer labor costs to DIY projects is also dumb. Any competent indy (even a non-Ferrari specialist) can replace a 12V battery.

Wrong. They still off-gas, they just don't release corrosive acid in liquid form. They need to be ventilated when in the passenger cabin. Ferrari themselves even vent the AGM batteries installed in the footwell of the mid engine cars.

 

"An Interstate H8 AGM from Costco is $170 before any state fees." Good, then even more savings. The interstates are $275 or so.

" If your battery only last two years, you're doing something wrong. Use the tender like the battery's life depends on it (because it does). "
Do you really think that we don't all already know to use tenders? Like, as soon as the ignition is off?! We're not doing anything wrong. It's just a poor design. Why do you think Mercedes AMG, Corvette, and Ferrari's mid-engine V8 cars have all relocated the battery away from the engine? Tubular headers operate at 1,500F and you can't insulate them without them cracking. So the battery gets cooked.

"No dealer is interested in installing after market battery relocation kits."

Who said anything about dealers doing this kit? Of course they won't. Less batteries and less labor to sell.

" hence my statement that you can replace the battery many times for cost involved to relocate the battery."

Your math doesn't add up. Most owners hear abou the battery failing a load test when the car is in for annual service. At that point you say yes and its gets done for $1,500. That's the reality.

"Comparing dealer labor costs to DIY projects is also dumb."

Never said anything about DIY or dealer costs. How about reading more carefully.

'They still off-gas, they just don't release corrosive acid in liquid form. They need to be ventilated when in the passenger cabin.". Wrong, this is nonsense. Please educate yourself. Do you think Ferrari (458), Crovette (all, in trunk), Mercedes AMG (also in trunk) would use AGMs in that location if they needed to be vented and out-gassed.

"Ferrari themselves even vent the AGM batteries installed in the footwell of the mid engine cars."

Wrong, they do not. My 458 has the battery in a non-vented box in the passenger footwell. Good lord.

 

Packaging and weight distribution play a bigger role than serviceability and longevity, especially at Ferrari. Should Ferrari have shielded the battery from heat in the FF/Lusso better? Yes. Does that make it an inherently bad decision to put the battery where they did? No, there are far more factors than just longevity.

I'll disregard the ignorant comments on metallurgy and header construction.

You did

Here's my math on relocation versus more frequent replacement. As you said, three hours of labor to relocate at, let’s say, $200/hour at an indy, so $600. Parts are $1,500, so that totals $2,100. If you pay an indy to replace the battery, say, 2 hours of labor at $200/hour, so $400 plus $350 for the battery because it’s marked up, that’s $750. That's nearly three full battery replacements (about 9 years) before you earn a return on your investment. If you DIY the relocation, your cost is only $1,500 in parts, and a replacement Interstate is roughly $200. That’s seven full battery replacements (21 years!) before you earn a return on your investment. None of this takes into account the fact that you’re modifying a system that’s hyper-sensitive to voltage and resistance fluctuations by adding multiple feet of extra cable that was never designed to be there.

Okay.....

I suggest you look at some parts diagrams before you tell someone to go educate themselves next time.

Here's a non-Ferrari example from an F10 M5 that came factory equipped with an H8 or H9 AGM under the trunk floor. See that little thing there? That's a vent tube.

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Lol. I've spent more time in the footwell of a 458 dealing with that annoyingly short vent tube than I care to admit. Look at a darn parts diagram before you go on the internet and spread falsehoods and start arguments.

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And for amusement here's the vent tube on an F430 (diagram largely applicable to 360 as well).
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LOL, didn't bring BMW into this, you did, but since you did... do you think that tiny tube is there to prevent [non existent] "battery gas" from escaping when you have a huge, poorly sealed carpeted cover with large surface area that vents directly to the trunk? Do you think that little tube in the 458 is there to vent "dangerous gases" when the battery cover into the passenger compartment is literally a loose carpet-covered panel with a flimsy velcro closure and a pull tab? Please stop with the silly arguing. Those little tubes are there to reduce moisture buildup, not vent the "dangerous gases" you claim [sealed] AGM batteries produce (good grief). I think you've been reading too many U-boat novels or something... So please... just... stop.

We get it. You don't think FF batteries should be relocated. Good for you, just keep on replacing batteries in the engine area right next to a header. The rest of us think otherwise, and are perfectly fine with our setups (as has already been politely pointed out to you by another poster). And, the question was asking about available relo kits, not your opinion or rant on whether or not they should be done, which is neither here nor there as far as this thread is concerned. Perhaps, start your own thread "the horrible, terrible, no good evils of battery relocation in an FF according to me" or similar. Cheers.

 

Regarding headers...please dazzle me with all your mettalurgical savoire-faire. Be sure to explain in detail why it's a bad idea to wrap headers, as anyone knows. Maybe you can explain to the guys at Jet-Hot why we don't need them because we can just wrap-em like Texas brisket.

 

I think it would be wise to end this discussion and respect everyone's opinion/vision.
We have the choice to move the battery or leave it in its regular place. Everyone can make their own decision.
By the way, I choose to leave the battery in the place that was made for it.
My battery has been around for more than 4 years and has not shown any wear (now let's hope it stays that way for a while ).

 

I agree. The thread was fine until sfguy felt the need to attack and belittle a poster he disagreed with. It is never OK to attack another poster or try to belittle them with derogatory language such as "ignorant", "silly" etc. because that discourages posters and this is after all a discussion board, not a consensus-building echo chamber run by school bullies.

Also, his information is wrong. AGM batteries do not gas because they are sealed battery design. It is perfectly safe to mount them in a passenger area and many manufacturers including Ferrari do just that. It is also a fact that, as sf guy has pointed out, a relocation could create more problems in an electrically sensitive vehicle such as the FF, if not executed correctly. It is also true, though not really discussed here, that Ferrari buyers do not generally like mods (and Ferrari generally hate them), so one may want to take that into consideration as well. And finally, it is also true that a number of us have done this mod on their FF, including me, and are very happy with it, just as there are many who haven't and seem satisfied with that too.

This discussion was for those who are thinking about a solution to a perceived problem and were looking for some answers.