Upgraded syncros for 360s? | FerrariChat

Upgraded syncros for 360s?

Discussion in '360/430' started by collegeboy, Apr 29, 2025 at 2:45 PM.

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  1. collegeboy

    collegeboy Formula 3
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    Mikey
    With a transmission rebuild looming in my future, I have been looking at options. Obviously I was planning on just all original parts, however someone mentioned to me that they think you can pout F430 syncros in the 360 transmission and that it is an upgrade. That doesn't really sound correct to me, but I wanted to ask here. is that possible?
     
  2. GogglesPisano

    GogglesPisano F1 Rookie
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    Too bad there isn't a company that makes good carbon fiber synchros for our cars.
     
  3. tazandjan

    tazandjan Three Time F1 World Champ
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    Jul 19, 2008
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    Those would probably last about 20 minutes.
     
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  4. clean512

    clean512 Formula 3

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    Over thinking again
     
  5. collegeboy

    collegeboy Formula 3
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    #5 collegeboy, Apr 30, 2025 at 3:28 AM
    Last edited: Apr 30, 2025 at 3:36 AM
    Not at all. The syncros are a known weak point in 360 transmissions. My transmission needs a rebuild soon, so if there are options other than OEM, I'd like to know about them. You don't know if you don't look around, and/or ask questions.

    If a good upgrade was known and readily available in our cars, people would install them during transmission rebuilds. Including you.
     
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  6. vrsurgeon

    vrsurgeon F1 World Champ
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    Umm.. my car has over 70k miles, 15 years of ownership.. original syncros. They're fine if you don't abuse the car. Now if the shift mechanism alignment is off with a manual conversion, that's another story.
     
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  7. clean512

    clean512 Formula 3

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    The thing is I would be looking or asking the bigger companies like getreg, quafie transmission people that do aftermarket hy performance transmission. And truly a fresh oem syco set and fresh rebuild of the diff would be the way to go. Whether you have low miles or high miles transmission parts can react differently on each person car. One car can go 100k miles or the next one can be gear whine or synco out at 16k. Hand built stuff and quality control in the early 2000s .
     
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  8. DiSomma6

    DiSomma6 Karting

    Nov 27, 2023
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    Erik
    I have to chime in on this just in case it helps one of you out.

    When I got my car, it harshly grinded every gear, going in and going out. Upshifts, downshifts, it all crunched LOUD and was very embarrassing. I tried changing and flushing and nothing.

    Flash32 recommended trying Redline NS with friction modifier. I tried it. Now the car shifts like new! I now have 20K miles on the change and it runs great. There is slight tick going into third only if I go in at high speed and let off the gas at the wrong time during a shift, but that's it.

    So, before drawing the conclusion of having to invest in a rebuild, try this fluid first. Many of the dealerships are defaulting to Mobil 1 LSD and that simply doesn't work with the brass syncros in the 360. The 599/612's are fine, not the 360.
     
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  9. flash32

    flash32 F1 Veteran

    Aug 22, 2008
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    IMHO and some limited experience the key to keeping the transmission syncros longer is proper fluid and proper fluid changes

    If you get it rebuilt use a quality fluid made for these types of transmission..like Ravenol vsg..make sure to change based on your driving and environment
    Keep all perfectly aligned and hope for no more hear exchanger issues
     
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  10. GogglesPisano

    GogglesPisano F1 Rookie
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    I have a similar experience as Mikey on my conversion and can tell you it's not the fluid or adjustments. I've turned the turnbuckles every which way in 1/4 turn increments and have found the dead center of the gears. If his is anything like mine, almost all the gears are smooth like butter, it's just that the 1-2 shift you get a slight detent feel. Obviously much harder when cold, but it never fully smooths out like the others unless you double clutch or shift slowly. You're not able to slam through the gears quickly as you are going up from 2. There are times when it is perfectly fine, but those are not the majority. I've gone through OEM, Redline, and Ravenol fluids just in case. It's not something that seems harsh or wrong, just subtle enough to notice that it's different and detracts for a perfect experience. My thinking is that 2nd gear synchro was hammered long enough with the F1 system that it's maybe noticeably worn when you switch to a full manual. I'm far from an expert here though.
     
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  11. collegeboy

    collegeboy Formula 3
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    For what it's worth, I have always believed that my synchros were bad due to the lack of oil I found in my transmission when I bought it.

    A few days after I acquired the car I decided to do my own fluid changes on it. When I went to drain the transmission fluid, I found about 1/2 to 1 quart of dark brown/black oil came out, and that was it. Lots of gold color in it too. This was I guess now about 2.5 years ago? Anyways, after that I always ran Ravenol VSG (per flash32s recommendation) in the car, and as an F1, which perfectly rev matches during shifts, it all seemed to be fine.

    Once I did the manual swap though where I am not as good as a computer, shifting from 1 to 2 grinds, and shifting from 2 to 3 grinds. Down shifts do not grind. This is a rare occurrence, but it does happen. And if it does, it's just when I try and shift fast, but not fast enough to perfectly rev match. If I shift super fast, it won't, and if I shift super slow it won't. Again, it's a rare occurrence now that I've learned how to drive with it like this, but it's present and obviously not how the car should be. I can pretty much now drive an entire day without it grinding now that I've learned, but again, not how it should be. I would like to be able to shift however I want. I also now run Redline Lightweight Shockproof in the car, and it hides it a ton.

    Anyways, I've accepted the future $10,000-$20,000 bill for me to remove the transmission myself and mail it off to be rebuilt. No huge deal honestly, and I'm excited about having a "new" transmission in the car then. With the time that takes to do, and the obvious cost though, I figured if there was an upgrade, then I want to do it at that time.

    Anyways, with all that said, I posted here to ask the question, reached out to 2 manufacturers to have custom gear sets made, and emailed Rifedriver. The consensus is that if the transmission synchros really aren't that bad at all, and if it is rebuilt and then properly maintained as a manual (Which I would do), it will last a very long time with many manual cars with over 100,000 miles and their original transmissions.

    For now, that is good enough for me, and my plan. I appreciate it everyone.

    Thanks,
    Mike
     

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