290 MM ch. #0628 | FerrariChat

290 MM ch. #0628

Discussion in 'Vintage (thru 365 GTC4)' started by teegeefla, Jul 16, 2004.

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  1. teegeefla

    teegeefla Formula Junior
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    Apr 26, 2004
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    Tom Gee
    I am trying to find out some detailed history on this car; it was a factory car for much of 1956-57, then went to private hands and then became a NART entry in 1958. Moss won in it at Nassau in 1957, and Gurney finished 2nd in late 1958 at Watkins Glen. It was originally red, but I cannot find photos from that era to figure out when/if it was changed from red to blue (the usual NART colors?). I would really like to find something that shows how it looked when Gurney drove it. I have found some current photos and it is painted blue. Any help would be most welcome...
     
  2. Miltonian

    Miltonian F1 Veteran

    Dec 11, 2002
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    #0628 belongs to Jon Shirley in Medina, Washington, and it was restored by Butch Dennison (I was working for him at the time). It was blue when Jon bought it, but it's red now, as it appeared at Sebring. Picture taken by me at the grand opening event of Dennison International, 7/26/03, Jon at the wheel. He drove it to the event.
     
  3. teegeefla

    teegeefla Formula Junior
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    Thanks. Do you or Butch or Jon have any info on when it went from red to blue, and which color was on the car when Gurney drove it in Sept. 1958?
     
  4. Miltonian

    Miltonian F1 Veteran

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    Gosh, when I was working for Butch we had a big scrapbook with all of the details of the history of the car, but I don't have access to it right now. Most of my own pictures of the car were sent away, and I've forgotten many of the specifics. Sorry I can't be of more help. Perhaps others would know.
     
  5. teegeefla

    teegeefla Formula Junior
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    Do you have an e-mail address or phone number for Dennison? Is it still in business? Thanks.
     
  6. Miltonian

    Miltonian F1 Veteran

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    I will send you a PM on this subject. Others feel free to contribute information.
     
  7. bigodino

    bigodino F1 World Champ
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    Hi,

    I think it looked better in blue (a pale metallic blue with white stripe) rather than the common red it wears now. Also the pontoon-like nose is gone. Shame.

    Ciao, Peter
     
  8. El Wayne

    El Wayne F1 World Champ
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    I think that there was sound reasoning behind restoring this car to its current configuration (no pontoons) and color scheme, as this represents its final appearance in competition as configured by the "factory": Sebring, 1957. The pontoons were added later in life, as was Chinetti's NART paint scheme, which most likely stayed with the car for so long only because it remianed in the hands of Coco Chinetti.
     
  9. bigodino

    bigodino F1 World Champ
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    Hi Wayne,

    I won't argue that it's a correct restoration (I've seen the car at the Mille and it looks great) but I think that a lot of charm goes out of a car when being corrected. There are numerous other examples like the CanAm cars or Drogo rebodies. Some of them have more historical meaning than how it was when it left the factory. This shouldn't be overlooked. I wonder if Mr. Shirley has kept the pontoon nose - maybe to hang it on his garage wall? If it was scrapped that really would be a shame.

    Just my 2 eurocents.

    Ciao, Peter
     
  10. Miltonian

    Miltonian F1 Veteran

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    The pontoon nose was saved and is in safe storage. Wayne's post is "spot on".
     
  11. 134282

    134282 Four Time F1 World Champ
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    OH, LOOK, AN NNO...!!!
     
  12. teegeefla

    teegeefla Formula Junior
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    Does anyone know where I can locate a picture of how the car looked in 1958 when owned by NART and driven at Watkins Glen by Gurney or Lime Rock by Kessler?
     
  13. Miltonian

    Miltonian F1 Veteran

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    This pic from R&T shows the start of the 1958 Formula Libre race at Watkins Glen. Gurney is in the #3 car. Until I get a chance to talk with Butch, I can't vouch for the identity of the car (0628? / 0700? / other?).

    Note: I don't think Barchetta's history on 0628 is accurate.
     
  14. macca

    macca Formula Junior

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  15. Bryanp

    Bryanp F1 Rookie

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    regarding the classicscars link Macca posted above, FWIW, the "histories" for 0446 and 0556 are utterly incorrect
     
  16. Old Guy

    Old Guy Formula Junior
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    Jeff,

    The #3 could very well be 0764, the "pontoon-fendered" 335 S. It appears to have some of the features of that car. #2 seems to be the 412 MI, 0744.
     
  17. teegeefla

    teegeefla Formula Junior
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    Thanks to Miltonian for the photos.

    I had brought this question up on another forum several months ago (as to whether the Gurney/Watkins Glen car is 0628 or 0700) and was told that the official entry and finish results say it is 0628, and entered by Chinetti/NART. Other websites had info that it was 0700, but I guess the official entry info swings things in 0628's favor.

    Unfortunately, I am not well-versed in identifying a 290MM (0628) from a 335 (0700). I also still wonder if the car in the photos is blue and white, like many NART machines, or red? I know it eventually was changed from red to blue (and now back to red in its current beauty), but when, and when did it get the color change and pontoon look?
     
  18. MJarrettR

    MJarrettR Formula 3

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    The two cars pictured at Watkins Glen 1958 are:
    #2 412MI s/n 0744 driven by Phil Hill to a DNF
    #3 290MM s/n 0628 driven by Dan Gurney to 2nd Overall

    -Jarrett
     
  19. Miltonian

    Miltonian F1 Veteran

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    I found one of my old pictures! You saw it here first, a picture of the bare bones of #0628, during restoration at Pete Lovely Racing.
     
  20. kare

    kare F1 Rookie
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    Yes, and Jobo (who went on to win) is following them in a Maserati 250F.

    #4 could actually be 0700... Cannot think of any other "250 Testa Rossa-style" car with closed sides, big hood scoop and LHD that would have been around at the time... but who raced it? I have Gurney finishing 3rd with a "Ferrari".

    Andrey (0674 #25) and Hugus (0732TR #22) were also there.
     
  21. teegeefla

    teegeefla Formula Junior
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    According to the following results based on a review of the lap charts and entry info compiled by Don Capps of The Nostalgia Forum, here are the results from Watkins Glen 1958:

    1st Joakim Bonnier
    No. 11, Joakim Bonnier, Maserati 250F ‘2529’
    81 laps, 1 hr 54 min 10.00 sec, 97.910 mph, $2,000

    2nd Dan Gurney
    No. 3, Luigi Chinetti, Ferrari 335S ‘0628’
    81 laps, 1 hr 55 min 27 sec, 95.60 mph, $1,200

    3rd Bruce Kessler
    No. 4, Luigi Chinetti, Ferrari 315S
    77 laps, 1 hr 55 min 19 sec, 92.15 mph, $800

    4th Vic Meinhardt
    No. 71, Porsche 550 RS
    74 laps, 1 hr 56 min 09 sec, $500

    5th Robert Kuhn
    No. 12, Lieutenant Colonel Robert Kuhn, Maserati 200SI
    71 laps, 1 hr 58 min 11 sec, $300

    6th Bill Rutan
    No. 32, W.K. Rutan, Porsche Special
    70 laps, 1 hr 55 min 19 sec, $200

    7th Phil Hill
    No. 2, Ferrari Representatives of California, Ferrari 412MI ‘0744 MI’
    60 laps, 1 min 28 min 49 sec, driveshaft

    8th George Constantine
    No. 49, Elisha Walker, Aston Martin DBR2 ‘DBR2/1’ (Lagonda ‘DP166/1’)
    47 laps, 1 hr 10 min 00 sec, blown head gasket

    9th Allen Markelson
    No. 35, Ferrari Testa Rosa 500TR
    40 laps, 1 hr 04 min 00 sec, split exhaust pipe

    10th Loyal Katskee
    No. 17, Jack Finley, Jaguar Corvette
    23 laps, 39 min 00 sec, differential

    11th Bob Said
    No. 22, Bob Said, Nisonger KLG Special Sadler Chevrolet
    23 laps, 38 min 00 sec, cracked radiator

    12th Lloyd Ruby
    No. 112, Maserati Corvette
    11 laps, 18 min 58 sec, engine – cylinder block

    13th Ray Saidel
    No. 36, Raymond Saidel, Jomar 1100 Mark 11
    11 laps, 23 min 00 sec, clutch

    14th Herb Swan
    No. 24, Ferrari
    0 laps, 2 min 36 sec, engine

    A subsequent posting on that forum clarifies that Kessler was in 0602 which was an 860 Monza (3.5 4C).
     
  22. kare

    kare F1 Rookie
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    Thanks for results! I must say though that #4 doesn't look anything like 0602M to my eye. I think I'll stick with 0700 till I find a better picture!

    Best wishes, Kare
     
  23. teegeefla

    teegeefla Formula Junior
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    So it's a boring Saturday night and I find myself rehashing some of my old FChat quests, and one that has remained elusive for more than two decades is...finding a good quality photo of the Gurney #3 car, chassis 0628, from the Watkins Glen USAC race in October 1958. Back 20 years ago, when this thread was new, some photos came close, but nothing ever fit the bill. So does anyone have the magic bullet of a good quality photo, color or black & white, of 0628 at that race? Thanks in advance.
     
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  24. miurasv

    miurasv F1 World Champ

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    You will have seen this one from here.

    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
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  25. teegeefla

    teegeefla Formula Junior
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    Thanks but yes that was actually one of the first I ever found as I am quite familiar with the BARC Boys, having grown up not far from their Watkins Glen stomping grounds. One of my queries about the car, which this photo would have answered if it had been snapped moments later, is how the white stripe appeared at the tail. Did it go straight back or did it dip down and around at the tail. Silly question that, but critical to a rivet-counting model builder.
     
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