Max's manager Raymond Vermeulen after the firing of Horner: "We want to return to the top." "Nothing changes."
Interesting news to start the day with! Red Bull isn't going anywhere. F1 is a marketing tool for all of these teams, and Red Bull have a unique brand that has a real cultural vibe in not just F1, but all the events they have. From the soap box races to daredevil stunts, it's brilliant what they have created as Red Bull is now associated with the bleeding edge of 'things' that are not necessarily official sports. Other non-manufacturer teams are totally out in the wilderness to me in terms of what they're attempting to market and cultivate with their F1 teams. I seriously don't see what point Williams is now that it's not run by any Williams', and what is Williams trying to market? Seems like Williams is just a thing for the playboys who run Dorrellton capital, an excuse to go racing. Kick-Sauber or whatever they are(??). Point being, neither are works-related teams really, and neither have any level of culture built as Red Bull have.
The user you quoted (part of my ignore list) should see a doctor ASAP - it's not normal to have intense PITA for almost 4 years (since Abu Dhabi 2021)
They're just trophy assets of their current owners so they can go to all the F1 events and rub elbows with who they want and be seen with who they want...all ego related imo.
Williams is an investment. Why do you think current teams oppose new entries? Because if someone wants to entry, the quickest way is buying an existing team. Dorilton is just waiting for that buyer.
Just like with any pro team here in the US. Billionaires buy them as a trophy asset and get the best seat in the house and mingle with whoever they want and brag about owning the team, but don't make much return off the teams via cash flow until they sell. That's the only way they can justify spending so much on getting into the club by jacking up the price to the next person even with a junk team that never wins.
As are many owners of vintage Ferrari's going to Pebble Beach etc. Those cars and events create opportunities to meet and do business with people just as F1 does. It's all business isn't it.
highly doubt this. Its a huge money making business. Even if they are last, the F1 team slot is worth close to $1B. they are not going anywhere soon.
probably until Max leaves. Max gone = car not near the top for the foreseeable future, no one in the pipeline to replace him...
Red Bull needed Horner to woo another driver if Max goes. It's a sticky situation. Horner not running Red Bull makes it a total unknown quantity for any perspective (top quality anyway) driver. Especially with Newey long gone too. I'm not sure if this was a last-ditch effort to keep Max there or not, but I still think Max would be a fool not to head to Mercedes with Mercedes being the team for 2026 outside of Mclaren as the rules will be so engine dependent. Red Bull will be again an unknown quantity with Ford in the mix and a new drivetrain, both of which have no experience doing in F1.
Toto I'm sure thinks that God is with him now, Max has to seriously consider moving for 2026. There were plenty of stories and indications Max' side wanted Horner reduced/replaced, but is going to Meknies enough to keep him? As you rightly say, 2026 engine plays to MB's strength, he has to go there, even with the risk.... maybe he does a one year with automatic extension, with right to leave if honda/AM gets it better.
Call it an unsurprising shock to read the news this morning. The rumors have been circulating for quite awhile now so I guess that makes it unsurprising, but despite what anyone thinks, Horner is one of the best Team Principles in F1. The success he lead to Red Bull can not be erased. So that makes it a shock. I think one thing for certain is there is a LOT we the public, as well as the all the media simply do not know. So it's all down to speculation. On paper on a very basic level, it does not make sense to release Horner, especially so suddenly. Some maybes based on the rumors: Corporate Red Bull and Horner have been butting heads for some time and that came to light when Dietrich died. The Christian Horny scandal obviously was a bad look surely shook the boat within the company. Perhaps people lost respect for Horner, perhaps there are other allegations that have been swept under the rug, who knows. Apparently Jos and Horner do not get along that well. How much this has to do with Jos apparently having a thing for the lady that Horner made inappropriate advances on? We don't know. Jos seems to still have an influence on Max's career. Could be false, but if Jos wants Max to leave, I'm sure that's a problem for Red Bull. Red Bull did sign with Ford (which is just a sticker on the RBPT program), which I suppose you could put that accountability on Horner. Impossible to say how that engine will perform, but it's very unlikely that a brand new manufacturer will be as competitive as a team that has been developing since the hybrid era started. If Max wants a car that compete for wins and championships, if the PU is the worst, that will make it exponentially more difficult. We all saw what happened with Alonso with McLaren-Honda. Who knows how much blame can be given to Horner for the likes of Newey and Wheatley and a bunch of other Red Bull staff leaving. If his staff doesn't trust him or want to work for him, then it makes perfect sense why he got fired. -------------------------- I struggle to see how firing Horner is going to benefit Red Bull in the short term, especially performance wise. A TP doesn't design the car so what is a different TP going to do? Max already has an exit clause in place due to lack of performance and that hasn't changed. So what's to stop him from leaving just because Horner is gone?
This is really the thrust of the situation I've been banging on since the start of the season. Max would be an utter fool not to leave, with the very best available seat being at Mercedes. I personally don't see Newey and Aston as being a contender for a few years but I could be very wrong. Negotiations with Max could be stalled due to the George or Kimi situation. Toto has the authority from the Merc CEO to stroke the 102 million Euro check, or whatever it is, to get Max out of his contract even if the exit clause hasn't been activated. Toto has serious pressure on him to beat their customer team.
??? there is a bench of new talent in the industry that would LOVE to join an organization like Red Bull. Just because a company fires its CEO they don't all of a sudden shut down the business unit.
Absolutely agree. Whilst I love Red Bull, to rebuild that team as it sits now into a contender again is a LONG project. The engine itself is a huge question mark already, and key to being successful. Max has indicated more than once that he's not interested in being in F1 till he's old and cripple, and Mercedes has the best chance for him to offer him the chance at success next year. So many good people have left Red Bull in the last 2 years, it's a house of cards. If Max is gone they're completely shagged surely.
