Has Ferrari Lost It's Luster?

Why can't it be both?

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From last month's Routeclassiche in their coverage of the Aurora concours.

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"The second edition of the Scandinavian show celebrated the Italian automobile in a context of great refinement, rendering still more evident the contrast between a glorious past and an empty present."

Which is to say, you can show off the new models if you like, but if you park them next to the old models, then you won't be feeling too good about the current state of car design in Italy. In the guts of the article they talk about how all of the old skills have disappeared, and the old styling houses have closed. The author felt that just about the only bright light in cars currently being built in Italy are the reborn Stratos and 037 coming out of Cuneo. I saw them both last year at the Torino auto show and they are indeed lovely things. Beautiful, clean, simple. Also, they're not ****ing enormous.

Why does Ferrari keep building larger and larger cars? Before you know it they'll be building TRUCKS! Oh wait, that already happened didn't it.

 

Maybe that's the answer - Ferrari needs an alter ego for Manzoni's experimentation!

 

Def hasn’t lost its luster. “Lost its luster’ is the wrong phrase IMO. The brand is still the most beloved and most sought after car brand in the world. I can’t drive more than 2 blocks without someone taking a photo or making a comment. Jaguar and Lexus are brands that have lost their luster. I’d argue the term “design slump” is more fitting. I’m in my mid 40’s and wouldn’t truly consider anything after the F8. I don’t truly hate anything that’s come out post F8 with the exception of the 849 and F80 but I don’t love anything either. I just find everything they’ve release to be mid. Happy to stick with what I have for now until they rebound which will 100% happen. Valleys and peaks and I believe the least 10 years has been a big valley but they’ll pull out. Just like in music, you can never count real talent out.

 

I've been fortunate enough to have driven all the new cars... the Roma and 12 cyl are my favorites.. the 812 is spectacular as well. The SF90 - super fast, but not that good looking and its heavy.. the 296... blah... it felt cheap to me on the inside.... its fast but the looks of the car... not at all pretty, as is the all the newer cars. I will say the Dodici 12 cyl, was a lot better in person... shockingly so. But still I think the 812 is pretty hard to beat. the F8 in my opinion is the pinnacle of 21st century Ferrari's so far. the Daytona is ok, as is the F80... but what is with the Huge side mirrors? they look horrible.

 

kay ChatGPT. ROFL. LIterally a thesis that says design is objecive due to personal interpretation, culture context, creativity and emotion.

All good, man. If folks think the new crop of cars are ugly, that’s cool—the internet is forever, right? Everyone’s entitled to plant their forever flag.

That said, beyond this one of course, which other Flavio’s cars did you think missed? @nicolaprince @papou
(I never count one-offs as they are reflection of the commissioner)

 

I type my thoughts into Chatgpt and let it format them into a more readable text, as my mind races so fast it can be difficult to read. I see nothing laughable about that. We all have different skills.

I never said the new crop of cars are all ugly. I disagree that design is 'inherently subjective' as then we wouldnt need design schools and all designers would be inherently equal from Pininfarina and Jon Ives, to Joe sketching on a napkin in Starbucks.

its really a quite silly thing to claim. Just like when someone says 'all lawyers are evil' or 'all ferrari owners are douchebags'

 

As you ask me I reply.
It certainly is a matter of personal taste, but I think there’s a general agreement that the vast majority of car enthusiasts prefer simple, clean, curvy, sporty yet refined designs.
I love the 8C very much, and I never heard anyone saying that her body is very beautiful (ok, the inside is disputable).
Similar thing with F355, 288 GTO, F40, 275, 250 SWB…
It believe that there was a long period, from ‘47 to the ‘90s, when most Ferrari have been considered marvellous from day one.
Then things got a bit more tricky at the turn of the century, and from what I read and hear even the 360 Modena was not a total like, especially the front end.
And then it just seems to me that in the last 15 yrs things have turned upside down and now most models are deeply disliked from day one and generate a lot of very divisive discussions.
In the time frame I mentioned I think there is a general agreement that the Ferrari-Pininfarina design was sporty and sensual at once.
Now I think that the cars look sporty and extravagant, but I would be surprised to hear that someone finds a F80 or 849 or 12 Cilindri sensual.
If you like edges and extravaganza, I am glad for you.
Ciao.
Nic

 

Not a fan of the robocop fronts and stupid looking rear haunches. Wouldn't own a single one of the current lineup - all hideous IMO. Too much stupidity in design. Just stupid looking.

They're FUGLY to me, especially the SPs (almost as godawful ugly as some of the one-offs). Saw the 12C and PS in person for the first time last week in the NY showroom. Didn't walk in (shows you how disinterested I am) and yeah, ****ing ugly as ****.

Oh well. Glad I got it out of my system when they had nice cars.

 

I said it before and will say it again... Ferrari BEAUTY STOPPED at the F8 and the 812.... after those two, a complete nosedive and getting worse.

 

Ferrari has never been more successful. They have never made better, more finished cars. They have/ are setting design trends. Not liking their current offerings is no different than in the past. People are uncomfortable with change- human nature. The Mondial wasn’t exactly loved in its day. There are numerous others.

As an aside- the 296 is beautiful in traditional Ferrari fashion with soft flowing curves. It will age well both stylistically and from a performance and entertainment perspective. IMO.

My first Ferrari was a 328 GTS- the 296 is a modern evolution and may be the best all around regular production sports car ever made. If you haven’t spent real time driving this car… you just cannot know.

And before you flame me- note I owned a 458 spider (great car) for seven years and it does not hold a candle to the 296.

 

Agreed in full

 

Nosedive and total bomb and vision is up the rear end.

 

Ferrari may not have made more money before, so perhaps they have never been more “successful”.

While I have had a chance to drive a few, I don’t want any of the cars in their current lineup as I think they look abominable and have as much technically interesting features as a 2025 Camry (no offence intended, the 2025 Camry is a great car); my interpretation of Ferrari’s “success” may differ from the one used by their accountants.

I have three of their old cars and would prefer driving them on the roads near me over current offerings (and I live next to the roads they develop Ferraris on). Funny thing is, when I let an owner of a new model try my old car, you can see the thought developing as they drive that they could sell that new one and find a decent Testarossa that looks cool and has more character for less money.

My old Testarossa has not appreciated in value after 34 years; I doubt any of the new mass produced stuff will either.

 

It's impossible to separate car design from the eras in which they were originally penned.

I grew up on new Ferraris from the mid-80s onward. The cars were beautiful and exotic at the time, and still are. Like a lot of people of my "Ferrari generation", I don't find a lot to like about the current lineup, and have a hard time differentiating between many of them. The last Ferrari I found really beautiful as a design was the 458.

The Ferrari of today, I think, is doing a relatively admirable job of giving today's buying public cars that appeal to them design-wise. The trouble is, I just plain don't like most cars/designs of this era - it's a time of big, bloated, over-engineered, over-regulated, overly complex, too reliant on new tech, too "extravagant" (to quote an earlier post) designs. It's all too...much. But that's the era we're living in, and these are the waters in which Ferrari has to swim. I'm sure there are young, fresh-faced designers that would love to have a crack at designing Ferraris today, but man, that would be a really tough row to hoe, IMO.

I do think it would virtually impossible for Ferrari to today come out with a car that I would actually want to buy, even if I had the money. Maybe I'm wrong, but I haven't seen that car yet.

 

I agree, the PS and 12C look worse in person than in pics

 

As I said, the fact that we are at page 17 and still debating if the new Fcars are desirable or not, in my opinion is not a good sign.

We might be a diverse audience, but at 48 I do not feel any different from when I was 16. As a boy, any 308 or Testarossa on the street were exciting. As a student, any F355 was a joy to look at and an instant desire, I still remember a yellow one parked in particular.
The I learnt to appreciate the older Fmodels.

But now the point is simply that even in the last decade, a 4C, 8C, Stelvio, Elise, Porsche 911 (especially Targa), Z4 2nd gen, Dallara Stradale, F-Type, all Lamborghini, Granturismo, MC20, most Mercedes, 718 and others are way more enjoyable to me to look at than any Ferrari.
To somebody like me, with Ferrari blood in the veins, it is quite confusing to walk by a metallic red Roma without feeling any desire to own her, while that same desire is sparked by the non-Fmodels I listed above.
It is true that we are living technological and constrained times, but curvy sensuous lines can still be traced.
It is also true that the (ignorant parvenu) world likes extravaganza, but between extravaganza and eleganza the former lasts usually less.

Ciao,
Nic