355 Challenge brakes pads

Peter,

I know people that use them here in the States where it's a popular pad with the Japanese import crowd. I think for street driving they will be fine but from what I have heard don't expect too much from them at the track. Might be a good idea to swap them out for something better at the track.

What rotors are you using? Pagid blues and oranges are usually considered medium wear brake pads in terms of rotor life.

Regards,

Jon P. Kofod
www.flatoutracing.net

 

Peter,

I have run into the same problem on my Challenge car with the drilled Brembos especially on cold days with my Performance Friction Carbon Metalic pads. I had to tape up the cooling ducts to generate enough heat to get them to work.

Here in the States Brembo is making a solid slotted rotor for Challenge cars that is supposed to last much longer and get rid of the problem of cracking rotors.

Check with your Brembo distributor to see if they might have them.

At most my rotors were lasting 2 days max which is about what the guys racing in the Challenge series were getting out of them.

Regards,

Jon

 

Solid slotted discs are available in Australia, and the best all round pad is Pagid RS19.

The EBC's are very cheap though..........

 

Peter,

I too am surprised at your experience with Pagid 4-2 (blue). I've found them to be a great all around pad, OE on F40 and F50. Noisy on the street, but capable of stopping a 200 mph car. I've not had dusting issues, which is typically why a pad grinds into and abrades the rotor. Hmmm.

Orange 4-4 is softer, lower temperature, no? Try it. It may dust more though.

I also advocate the slotted only, not drilled, rotors. The slots are there to clean the dust, and arguably do this better than drilled without playing 'connect-the-dots'. For me, they'd last three race events (9 - 12 days) or more, not two days like Jon. And I'd replace them due only to excessive run-out, not wear. BTW, Alcon rotors, while more expensive, last even longer. F355 Challenge is a common rotor size and mount pattern.

I also like Pagid's ceramic compounds.


Rob

 

For a street car at a track day, I recommend Ferrodo DS2500 pads. These pads will take a lot more heat then the Ferrari stock pads, and I got 25 track days on a set of rotors (32 track days including the Ferrari pads--which did fade). These pads are streetable down here in Texas even in wintertime. The pads have good initial bite and a fairly high coefficient of friction.

 

Caution, they all say friendly on the rotors. The Pagid Blacks I have been told are the least friendly of the Pagid's on terms of rotor life.

I use PFC's for maximum performance on the track but they eat rotors faster than any other pad.

The other issue I might add is proper bedding in of your pads and rotors. If done incorrectly or not at all you will reduce your rotor life by up to 25-30% according to one race mechanic at Ferrari of Washington.

I am sure Rob, with all his years in the Challenge series can confirm this. Ferrari of Washington actually sent the rotors to some machine shop that had a machine for bedding in rotors.

I have found that most people either skip the bed in proceedure or don't do it properly.

Regards,

Jon

 

Guys you need to talk to Barry Borin down at Race Technologies:

1-310-306-3158 Ext-20

[email protected]

http://www.racetechnologies.com/catalog/

Tell him Salman sent you. He'll solve any questions you might have with your braking systems, pads and rotors especially if you're using your cars for track days. He helped me with my Brembo upgrade on my 355 and he has been a great guy.

Hope this helps.

 

Small world, Salman I used Barry for all my rotors.

Actually his direct extension is # 23

Regards,

Jon

 

No.

I'd do this for customers frequently. My "machine" was US RT 41. Do a bunch at a time, saves time at the races.

Bed new rotors with used pads, bed new pads with used rotors.

• Block 70% of cooling duct.
• Get pads up to at least 850 degF, no more than 1000 degF, in two-three laps.
• Brake at 70% on first lap, increasing to one or two 99% stops by the end of second or third lap.
• Give room for f*ing up the brake point, don't brake too late in case you hit 'green fade' (hard pedal, but no friction).
• Cool down lap and pit in.
• Let cool to ambient, move car by hand to avoid rotor hot-spots where pads cover it.
• Remove cooling duct restrictor.
• Good to go.

Follow manufacturer's procedure if different from above. Use temperature indicating paint on rotor.

Newer pad compounds bed in relatively easy.

Always move the car slightly every couple minutes while in pits for consultation. Rotor cooling at different rates is a big contributor to warping.

It's like breaking in an engine, make the molecules happy with their neighbor, get the chemicals from production out of the matrix.


Best regards,

Rob Schermerhorn

 

Peter, I think Robs description of disc cooling is possibly what didn't happen when you used the blues, and got disc wear. I'd try them again if you were otherwise happy, and be sure to follow good care practices.

I put RS 19 in all my modified road cars now, wherever available. They seem to have excellent cold bite....almost like a std pad, yet are equally excellent on the track.

You know how hard calder park is on brakes......one 550 went from doing 2 laps on std pads to 8 laps with Paul Stokell (pro) driving on the RS19.

Different car, different pads I know, but I also put them in a 365 GTC/4......and the owner overtook more cars in one meeting than he did the entire previous season........

To protect the discs more, I can get them cryogenically (heat/freeze cycle) treated. It's not very expensive, but you have to wait for a batch to go in (2 weeks or more sometimes?).

It rearranges the carbon molecules, making the steel less likely to warp, get hot/hard spots, and of course crack. They also last typically 30-50% longer on the 3 sets of 360 Challenge discs I've done. It's also good for driveshafts and anything prone to fatigue generally.

 

Everyone,

I also have Carbon/Kevlar pads with very aggressive pricing and have full track or street compounds available. Contact me if you want more info. I will also be selling them in the paddock at Cavallino Classic in Florida if anyone wants to try them on the track. Mention you are a Ferrari Chat member and I'll even give you better pricing.

Best regards,
Brent
DexM llc

 

I used to pre-bed my race pads. Don't laugh, but I came up with this on my own. Take an UNUSED toaster oven and set for the highest setting. This is usually 500 F +. Leave the pads in for at least 4 hours. This worked great on my Ferodo DS-11's. Never had a problem with green fade after that---this effectively boiled out all of the left over volatile compounds from the pads. That is why you need to bed in new pads---to eliminate green fade, which is caused by the formation of a thin layer of volatiles between the pad and the rotor. Hence, hard pedal but no friction.

DO NOT TRY THIS IN YOUR KITCHEN. IT STINKS TO HIGH HEAVEN. TRUST ME, IF YOU DO IT MAY COST YOU YOUR MARRIAGE .

Tom