Enzo or McLaren F1?

Put me down for the F1, ultimate roadcar ever...but why it only pulled a .86 on the skidpad in the test I saw i have no clue...Hasnt it done better? was that a wet skidpad?

 

Does a first in class count?

Greg A

 

Does this question have to be asked? Of course the Enzo! Is this not a Ferrari chat site?!

 

i'm surprised the votes are this close... i thought the McLaren would slaughter the Enzo... This has been brought up before and the majority seems to favor the McLaren- not surprisingly, i'll add... For a car that's 10 years old, it's still up there among the greats... The McLaren is an awesome car... i've only seen one, once... i can only imagine (and barely at that!) what it must feel like to move (on the ground) at 240 mph... 0-100 in 6 seconds... Damn... That car is truly a huge milestone in automotive history...

With that said, it's pretty obvious what my choice is:


...The NNO. (@#$%, i love this car!)

 

McLaren F1 by far. You guys can say all you want about how the performance numbers are similiar but the F1 was built over 10 years ago and Ferrari's current supercar can now match some of its numbers. With only 100 or so built, the F1 will continue to hold its value IMHO. The sad part is that the new McLaren SLR cannot compete at all with the F1. McLaren out did themselves back in the early 90s.

 

The F1's a keeper. Love to get one someday.

 

Well, I'm in for the Enzo. In my own opoinion, the Mclaren is a mix of 2 cars, and therefore I don't consider it as one. It's a BMW engine, and is should be called a BMW F1, since it's the engine that does the trick. The Mclarens looks and aerodynamics have been matched and beatened by many cars and several Ferrari's amongst those.

And to those who say "ooh, its 10 years old and is still the best" I can only say, yes. Offcourse it is. No one has tried to top it. If Ferrari would, they could make a faster car. But Ferrari has never stated that they would try to make a car more "super" than the F1. Pretty sure both Porsche and Lambo could do it too (Others too).

It was a milestone, no doubt, but I wouldnt call it the ultimate supercar anymore.

PS: To the guy that said an Enzo would never reach 240, well you are wrong. If you look at alle tests, the figures say 2..+ (That means it can go faster, but they do not have the means or balls) And Ferrari has stated that the Enzo is electronicly limited. They have made a limit to its speeds but it can go faster.

 

Uh, well that eliminates pretty much every modern car. Your Enzo is going to be pretty useless if you remove every part manufactured by someone other than Ferrari. That's a ludicrous argument against the McLaren.

 

One thing I've wondered for 7 years is why BMW has never put that engine into any of their own cars, or sold it to any other supercar builder? It's what the Z8 should have had.

Jonas - I understood the 218mph limit was "drag limited" meaning that the actual shape of the car prevented speed beyond that because of the physics, even though the engine has more power.

Any engineers to verify that (I know there's plenty here!)?

 

Des
The owner of the one you saw also has an Enzo so this is not a prob.
Having driven both I can say this is like arguing about which is better:
Le Relais or Cafe Malano. They're both great but quite different. At this level better becomes a meaningless.

 

You're missing the point, Jonas... yes, they all could have done it... but only McLaren did do it! We're not rating the companies' capability... we're not even rating the companies at all... if it was Ferrari vs. McLaren, Ferrari would win easily... we're rating what is the greatest supercar ever... all things together (performance, technology, beauty, historical significance, race heritage, mystique, etc.), nothing can touch the McLaren F1!!

 

My friend, who let me have his McLaren for three days, also has purchased an Enzo. He loves both of them for different reasons. And he drives his cars. He put 15K miles on the Enzo in the first year he owned it. Picked it up in New Jersey and drove it home to Texas.

Incidentally, he broke the mainshaft on the main gear cluster in the gearbox and had to have a new one machined. I says he will make a decision if he is going to sell one of them. I believe he may have already had a buyer for the McLaren as I have not spoken to him in a couple of months.

His, by the way, is the one that was tested in Road and Track back in 1997.

 

Not when you are talking about the engine..

 

Why don't you just say his name (CB)? You've practically told us who he is w/all of this information anyway.

Greg A

 

I saw an Enzo recently, and was following a McLaren in Scottsdale about two weeks ago. My choice is the McLaren based on racing performance and stunning looks.

 

i figured when you get to that level, it doesn't matter much unless you're pushing balls to the wall, squeezing every second and every tenth of a mile per hour out of the thing... They're both beautiful, wondrous automobiles... If i had a choice, it would be the NNO, that's all... Not because i'm a Ferrari Flagship whore (or however Mako put it), but because i like it, more... i'll never have the driving ability to physically and personally know the difference between the two at their limits, so those few extra miles per hour don't matter much... i was waiting for you to chime in.

 

For me having a supercar is having a very good car went going on race tracks ...and here we could see the Enzo is way superior in that category. Just look at the Enzo went its cornering ...its flat!! And in the F1 you have body rolls like in a normal road car. (F1 has soft suspensions)
I don't care about going on a trip in the country or going to the supermarket with a 1 million dollar car(McLaren claimed it could do that.)

IMO The Enzo is the better car where supercars should reallly be ..race tracks.
Plus I find the Enzo nicer and you get a 660 bhp Ferrari experience.

 

wow! i'm really surprised at the current results - i would have expected a much heavier ferrari leaning.

neat!

enzo for me, please. black or yellow. i'm not too picky .

doody.

 

John T

Body roll? Too soft suspension??

When did you drive one to experience this and when did you drive the Enzo? Or were these observations you pulled out of a magazine? I am here to tell you that the McLaren will stick in a corner like crazy. If you are talking about the 1997 test that Road and Track did on my friends McLaren, there are some things you should remember and know.

The car was tested in Arizona at 105 degrees, so performance would suffer a little. They had also worn out the tires when they got to the skidpad and track testing. They also burned up the clutch during the test and loaded the car up and sent it back to my friend in that condition. He finally got them to pay for a new set of tires but they would not pay for replacing the clutch (over $5K). After the new tires were installed and a new clutch put in I got to keep it for three days and drive it a lot.

Until you have driven one yourself, I would be careful about quoting someone else's results. They could be flawed as the Road and Track test was. If these road tests are all you have for information, take them all with a grain of salt. I know I do.

 

Road & Track wouldn't pay to replace the clutch...? Even after they burned it out...?

 

If you read the Mclaren F1 book Driving Ambition they wrote that the car wasn't as tight without anti-roll bars. But it made it easier to 'fling' the car around corners, still providing excellent handling.

When anti-sway bars were attached to the car, the test drivers all deemed it "undriveable" hence why they were removed.

I highly recommend the book.

 

I had to vote McLaren for 3 reasons:

1) I've loved the F1 since I first saw it.
2) The F1 won LeMans (the only race other than some rallies that I pay attention to.
3) Gut feeling says the Enzo will be a flash in the pan 10 years on and its looks will not age well.

 

With the looks of the McLaren, its performance, ability to seat three along with the extensive racing pedigree of McLaren from sports cars to F1, the Enzo is an just an also ran. Remember, while Ferrari may have won more races overall, if you consider how much longer Ferrari has been racing, I believe McLaren has a higher percentage of wins for the period of time it has been racing.

 

Your paraphrasing is not quite right. The car is fitted w/a front anti-roll bar, but not a rear one. Jonathan Palmer asked that a rear one be fitted b/c he thought the car rolled too much.

A "thin and flexible one--which should have had minimal effect--was made up and fitted." He said it was undriveable after one lap. pg. 159


Greg A