List of actors who would kick Tim Robins ass

Damn, where's Fred Rodgers?

 

Cool site!

I didnt know about good old Scotty.

 

Actually I don't think any of those people could kick Tim Robbins' ass.

Those people are real heroes, but are from another era, one that gets more distant with every day of the Bush administration. The heroes listed were from an era in which we stayed out of war until attacked and then responded, in which we came to the aid of our allies when they needed our help.

The men listed weren't asked to go fight preventive wars of invasion and occupation against countries that had not attacked us or our allies. They were the heroes of the world, all europe loved them and back at home everyone supported their actions because they could see the morality in what they were doing. This can't be said about our current military actions. We ignore the wishes of our allies and the organization we created to preserve world peace, and go it alone. What a change.

-Slim

 

Heather Locklear

 

I can think of alot of people who would get a SAG card just for the chance!!

DL

 

Gotta respond to Slim's troll here............

"we stayed out of war until attacked"

This policy worked fine when the weapons of war were not what people could possibly and have accessed today. Had you implemented this policy during the 50's and 60's and the Soviet's actually attacked, we wouldn't be having this conversation, because you'd be waiting for the mushroom clouds to dissipate so that you could find your way to the congressional bunker to determine what the appropriate level of potential military response and social assistance funding should be. After all, their aggression and political/religious system was our fault too......

I'd prefer not to be known by the scientific term............."done like dinner" if I knew how to unplug the stove beforehand. TYVM.

"All Europe loved them"

Well......go ask any average Afghan or Iraqi if he wants to return to the Taliban or Saddam Hussein's regime.......

If you conduct your life worrying about what everyone else thinks about what you are going to do or say under these kinds of circumstances, then all I can say is that you are one sorry MF who deserves everything that will eventually come to you as a result of your insecurity and desire for affection from those who just want to see your undoing.

In other words.........."dinner is served"........

 

Any questions about their intentions?




Jihad Against Jews and Crusaders
World Islamic Front Statement

23 February 1998

Shaykh Usamah Bin-Muhammad Bin-Ladin
Ayman al-Zawahiri, amir of the Jihad Group in Egypt
Abu-Yasir Rifa'i Ahmad Taha, Egyptian Islamic Group
Shaykh Mir Hamzah, secretary of the Jamiat-ul-Ulema-e-Pakistan
Fazlur Rahman, amir of the Jihad Movement in Bangladesh


Praise be to Allah, who revealed the Book, controls the clouds, defeats factionalism, and says in His Book: "But when the forbidden months are past, then fight and slay the pagans wherever ye find them, seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every stratagem (of war)"; and peace be upon our Prophet, Muhammad Bin-'Abdallah, who said: I have been sent with the sword between my hands to ensure that no one but Allah is worshipped, Allah who put my livelihood under the shadow of my spear and who inflicts humiliation and scorn on those who disobey my orders.

The Arabian Peninsula has never -- since Allah made it flat, created its desert, and encircled it with seas -- been stormed by any forces like the crusader armies spreading in it like locusts, eating its riches and wiping out its plantations. All this is happening at a time in which nations are attacking Muslims like people fighting over a plate of food. In the light of the grave situation and the lack of support, we and you are obliged to discuss current events, and we should all agree on how to settle the matter.

No one argues today about three facts that are known to everyone; we will list them, in order to remind everyone:

First, for over seven years the United States has been occupying the lands of Islam in the holiest of places, the Arabian Peninsula, plundering its riches, dictating to its rulers, humiliating its people, terrorizing its neighbors, and turning its bases in the Peninsula into a spearhead through which to fight the neighboring Muslim peoples.

If some people have in the past argued about the fact of the occupation, all the people of the Peninsula have now acknowledged it. The best proof of this is the Americans' continuing aggression against the Iraqi people using the Peninsula as a staging post, even though all its rulers are against their territories being used to that end, but they are helpless.

Second, despite the great devastation inflicted on the Iraqi people by the crusader-Zionist alliance, and despite the huge number of those killed, which has exceeded 1 million... despite all this, the Americans are once against trying to repeat the horrific massacres, as though they are not content with the protracted blockade imposed after the ferocious war or the fragmentation and devastation.

So here they come to annihilate what is left of this people and to humiliate their Muslim neighbors.

Third, if the Americans' aims behind these wars are religious and economic, the aim is also to serve the Jews' petty state and divert attention from its occupation of Jerusalem and murder of Muslims there. The best proof of this is their eagerness to destroy Iraq, the strongest neighboring Arab state, and their endeavor to fragment all the states of the region such as Iraq, Saudi Arabia, Egypt, and Sudan into paper statelets and through their disunion and weakness to guarantee Israel's survival and the continuation of the brutal crusade occupation of the Peninsula.

All these crimes and sins committed by the Americans are a clear declaration of war on Allah, his messenger, and Muslims. And ulema have throughout Islamic history unanimously agreed that the jihad is an individual duty if the enemy destroys the Muslim countries. This was revealed by Imam Bin-Qadamah in "Al- Mughni," Imam al-Kisa'i in "Al-Bada'i," al-Qurtubi in his interpretation, and the shaykh of al-Islam in his books, where he said: "As for the fighting to repulse [an enemy], it is aimed at defending sanctity and religion, and it is a duty as agreed [by the ulema]. Nothing is more sacred than belief except repulsing an enemy who is attacking religion and life."

On that basis, and in compliance with Allah's order, we issue the following fatwa to all Muslims:

The ruling to kill the Americans and their allies -- civilians and military -- is an individual duty for every Muslim who can do it in any country in which it is possible to do it, in order to liberate the al-Aqsa Mosque and the holy mosque [Mecca] from their grip, and in order for their armies to move out of all the lands of Islam, defeated and unable to threaten any Muslim. This is in accordance with the words of Almighty Allah, "and fight the pagans all together as they fight you all together," and "fight them until there is no more tumult or oppression, and there prevail justice and faith in Allah."

This is in addition to the words of Almighty Allah: "And why should ye not fight in the cause of Allah and of those who, being weak, are ill-treated (and oppressed)? -- women and children, whose cry is: 'Our Lord, rescue us from this town, whose people are oppressors; and raise for us from thee one who will help!'"

We -- with Allah's help -- call on every Muslim who believes in Allah and wishes to be rewarded to comply with Allah's order to kill the Americans and plunder their money wherever and whenever they find it. We also call on Muslim ulema, leaders, youths, and soldiers to launch the raid on Satan's U.S. troops and the devil's supporters allying with them, and to displace those who are behind them so that they may learn a lesson.

Almighty Allah said: "O ye who believe, give your response to Allah and His Apostle, when He calleth you to that which will give you life. And know that Allah cometh between a man and his heart, and that it is He to whom ye shall all be gathered."

Almighty Allah also says: "O ye who believe, what is the matter with you, that when ye are asked to go forth in the cause of Allah, ye cling so heavily to the earth! Do ye prefer the life of this world to the hereafter? But little is the comfort of this life, as compared with the hereafter. Unless ye go forth, He will punish you with a grievous penalty, and put others in your place; but Him ye would not harm in the least. For Allah hath power over all things."

Almighty Allah also says: "So lose no heart, nor fall into despair. For ye must gain mastery if ye are true in faith."

 

Yeah, I guess it's better to be a selfish bastard only in it for himself, eh?

I've found the exact opposite in my life experience. I treat people with kindness and respect and seek consensus where possible in decission making. It works for me and I can sleep well at night knowing I'm not coercing others into doing something they don't want to do. When attacked or the subject of hatred, I have managed to end such feeling and smooth things out without the use of violence that begets other violence.

I see no reason this way of life can't be scaled up from ones personal life to the global scale.

I may be a buddhist surfer whose learned a lot about life from studying Aikido, but I seem to remember from a childhood in the Christian religion that the same things are prescribed as proper action for Christians as well. I don't remember anything that allows killing under any circumstances, even when attacked one's self, much less under lesser circumstances. I remember things about giving the shirt off one's back and turning the other cheek and just generally not being an aggressive sob.


p.s. 4sfed4, any of that about the motivations of secular Iraq? Didn't think so. In fact, had we not attacked Iraq, it wouldn't mention them at all. All we've done is created another reason to be hated by extreemist muslims. Having said that, I have no problem with fighting Al-Qaeda. They've asked for it. But the Iraq thing is totally out of line.

 

Slim....

If you are a Buddhist, then the Chinese have proved my comment that you just remarked upon in the last reply to be....well......110% correct.

Dessert anyone ???

 

Are you trying to say that the peaceful nature of Buddhism has led to its demise at the hands of the Chinese? I don't think your understanding of Asian history is correct.

Latest numbers show 380 million followers. Including 102 million in China itself. Not bad for a belief system that contains no dogma and doesn't give people an escape from personal responsibility.

 

Slim....

I am remarking upon the Chinese occupation of Tibet.....which I believe is the spiritual home of Buddhism. I am one of the "die on my feet than live on my knees crowd".

Case closed I think. Unless you have a magical chant that will turns their guns to butter.

 

I guess it just becomes a case of whether one blames the agressors for their behavior, or the victims for not being agressive enough themselves.

I also fail to see how any of this has anything to do with Iraq. Did you feel they had caused any harm to the united states or were a real threat to the mighty united states. I certainly didn't.

 

>Actually I don't think any of those people could kick Tim Robbins' ass.

Stupid comment. My Wife could kick baby tim's ass right back to momma. And yours, I might add....

 

Sorry that everything is about the ass kicking for you. My point was that all those people are old, many dead. They come from another era, where people behaved much differently, and much more morally correct than they do today. The reason you don't see today's actors jumping into the military is, sure, partly because of the money involved in their lives now. But it's also because it isn't as clear of a choice morally as it was in WW2.

There is a reason that the country was united then and isn't now. It's not that the population has become stupid or lazy or less patriotic. It's that what is being asked of them isn't as morally correct as what was being asked of the ww1 and ww2 populations.

 

"I also fail to see how any of this has anything to do with Iraq"

Slim......I'm at the point of becoming openly outright insulting, which is not my intention on this board, so I'll ask you a question, do you even read what you and others here have written and are you capable of comprehending it clearly ?

Do so and you will have your answer.

 

]

In your first post, you seemed to be saying that had we taken my stance against the Soviets, that we'd have died from nuclear attack. But in reality, we did not attack the Soviets, we allowed them to produce weapons of mass destruction, continued diplomatic efforts, and hey, we are still here just fine. We did not launch a preemptive strike against them as you seem to be advocating we go around the world doing now.

Where we also disagree is that you seem to view Iraq as some sort of threat to the United States. I don't. The intelligence agencies of most world countries (and increasingly even our own) also don't. Therefore it wasn't a question of kill or be killed. They had no means to harm us. They weren't even really talking **** about us. Sure, they violated some u.n. resolutions, but many of those were like "show us your weapons" and Iraq was like "we don't have any more so buzz off". Guess what? They weren't lying or trying to trick the world - they really didn't have anything. Besides, the u.n. is squarely against the u.s. actions in this case. We are acting outside the world community. I just can't agree with you that the rest of the world is just stupid and only the Bush administration knows what is best for us and the world.

So basicaly, none of the points you've brought up have anything to do with Iraq. Bin Laden and Al Qaeda, sure. But Iraq, no.

-Slim

 

That fatwa was written in 1998.

 

And we attacked Iraq in 1991 (after telling them we didn't care if they attacked Kuwait or not), and have bombed them thousands of times in the last decade and have kept them from selling anything and inforced no-fly zones on their land.

 

Theres no need to make personal comments towards Slim.

I for one also informally tend to lean towards Buddhist thoughts. In fact, if all the world were Buddhist, then many of the problems we face today would probably vanish.

Unfortunately, fortunately......depending on ones viewpoint, the world is not currently in that state. We just have to accept things as they are and try to change (on a personal level) what we can.

Internet banter (like I see starting here) is no different than the struggle being discussed, it is only on a smaller scale here. But, the mentality is the same.

I am sorry if my post of the fatwa has stirred the pot, but something so blatant as that declaration needs to be taken seriously. It would be foolish to take it, those who make such statements or support such thoughts, as an idle threat.

 

Sorry for replying late.....a customer walked in and it's snowing and -15 !!!

4sfed4.....

I didn't say anything about Slim.....or he would have said so.

I was putting my point into "factual" terms he can relate to. There is enough recorded pacifism in history to show where it has constantly failed in the face of what we have now been forced to deal with.

Sorry that my example hit the bullseye. Learn from it.

Slim.....

You sure read a lot into things that are not there. Never were in fact.

The USSR never attacked because of one thing. The strong perception of the US intention to use overwhelming, catastrophic military force in the event thereof.

We didn't attack the USSR......but tell me if this means anything......we flew nuclear armed B-52's around the arctic circle 24 hours a day for over a decade, we still have SSBN's circling the globe and missiles in silos.....and hopefully, always will. Delivery in under 30 minutes or it's free. They knew what would happen.

Tell me if the Arab/Muslim world and the perpetrators of this new war felt the same way about the pascifist US under Bill Clinton. On second thought....don't do that, because I'll just bring up more stuff to defeat your points because you "seem" not know your history, or you just merely interpert it differently than the rest of us do.

If you are holding up the UN and their handling of Iraq and the overall Arab/Muslim world (insert the dictator, terrorist or nation of your choice) as the direction that you'd like the world to go in....then my friend....I am glad that I will expire before it ever reaches that state.....because it is doomed to failure, and all of us along with it.

Iraq "was" just the largest and most visible snake on the Medusa head that is the current Arab/Muslim world. Hopefully they will see themselves.......get it ?........so this madness stops before we have to stop it the good old fashioned way.

It has everything to do with Iraq.

 

Slim - you IDIOT.

Perhaps, before spouting your Bush-hating left-wing agenda, you should read some WWII history.


You f*ckin' idiot.

GO READ SOME HISTORY, ASSH0LE. Germany did not attack us, nor did Italy. JAPAN DID, yet we waged war on all three coutries. Yes, they were allied, but Germany had it's hands full with Englang and was IN NO WAY A MILITARY THREAT TO THE US when we waged war on them.

You defend us attacking Germany and Italy after being attacked by Japan, but you **** on us when we attack Iraq after being attacked by muslin fanatics who hate us.

Go figure. You don't need history though, do you? You've got your F*CKIN' BIAS to work towards your advantage.

I'm sick of *****-footing around people like you - people who attack our policies, right or worng, because you don't like Bush. Go f*ck yourself, and come back when you have done a little UNBIASED RESEARCH and can put that chip on your shoulder away. I guarantee that when you are able to look at our current situation without whatever pre-conceived notions you have about the right-wing conspiracy, you'd se that what we have done is the RIGHT THING. ****, the people of Iraq think it's the right thing, but I guess you are a better authority on their wants and needs than they are, right?

 

Slim, Its a shame you weren't in the upper floors of the world trade center. Maybe with a little kindness and respect you could have
convinced the men piloting those planes to have a change of heart.
(I am not saying that I would want anyone to have been there
we all know many lives were changed forever that day)

The point is its a different world today and civillians are the primary
target of these various groups and some governments.

Should we have attacked Iraq I'm not sure but the world is on notice.

 

The "magic chant" was what I was referring to! You knwo you meant that as a little dig

Personally, I dont necessarily disagree with the majorities viewpoint here. Its just better when these conversations dont resort to name calling thats all.