Electrical Advice needed for Radio Installation in 308 GT4 | FerrariChat
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Electrical Advice needed for Radio Installation in 308 GT4

Discussion in 'Technical Q&A' started by robertgarven, Feb 4, 2009.

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  1. robertgarven

    robertgarven F1 Veteran
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    #1 robertgarven, Feb 4, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    I have several issues, as most of you know I was in a rock band for 22 years and like to play music in my gt4 not unlike the opening scene in the movie "The Hidden" or in the final scene of "A Star is Born" preferably without all the crashing in both those movies!. My GT4 has 4- 4" 2 way speakers which the PO installed and are not very good for bass so I ordered a Blaupunkt small subwoofer to fit behind or under the seat. Everyone says this unit is great and my dilemma is how to get power to it.

    http://www.crutchfield.com/p_023THB200A/Blaupunkt-THb-200A.html?tp=114

    The tech at Crutchfield says I need a direct line to the battery which I would like to avoid and I was wondering if one of you experts could help me figure a way to hook up something off my fuse box or relay panel that would not blow my car up. It needs a 10 amp fuse. I cant be any harder than trying to get my center console apart to hook the damn thing up.... I remember when I put the JVC cassette in it seemed harder than changing my timing gear bearings.......

    While I was in there I was thinking about putting a CD player in to replace my period JVC cassette player however they said that they cannot think of any CD player would mount vertically. I was wondering if any of you had a vertical mounted CD receiver that you would recommend. I really do not want to take the car to an installation place for obvious reasons and really dont want a changer , woofer, power-amp in the trunk sort of situation.

    If this works can underbody black lights be far behind??

    PS I enjoy my engine sound loud just want to hear some accompanying Rock & Roll, every once and a while!!

    My neighborhood posse (below) offered to help but thought I would turn to you guys first!

    Thanks in Advance for any help!!!

    Rob
    (with no skills)
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  2. BigTex

    BigTex Seven Time F1 World Champ
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    #2 BigTex, Feb 4, 2009
    Those guys DO look well qualified.......or I could send Scott over, he rewired his Honda and has started into Electrical Engineering at UoH.....LOL!

    Others will chime in but I don't think there is "spare" capacity in the notably frail 308 fuseblocks to throw a full ten amp additional load, brudda.......

    You can't just go thru your front firewall and route the hot lead under your carpet matts to where the amp will be?

    That would avoid the console hassle.

    I like the bumper sticker I saw on a road worn speaker stack once: "Dare to dangle....."

    Kind of sums up most sound wiring I have seen....
     
  3. BigTex

    BigTex Seven Time F1 World Champ
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    #3 BigTex, Feb 4, 2009
    Marine Supply places will have a cool accessory I use on my speedboat it stacks on the battery terminal and has several terminal screws on it......take off from that but use individual in line fuse holders, for overcurrent protection.....
     
  4. Artvonne

    Artvonne F1 Veteran

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    #4 Artvonne, Feb 4, 2009
    Last edited: Feb 4, 2009
    What he said, keep it simple, and make sure the inline fuse is as close to the battery as possible.
     
  5. spiderseeker

    spiderseeker Formula 3

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    #5 spiderseeker, Feb 4, 2009
    +1 you MUST keep the fuse as close to the battery as possible.
     
  6. robertgarven

    robertgarven F1 Veteran
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    #6 robertgarven, Feb 4, 2009
    I am curious what is the technical reason for that? Cant I just get a lead of the fusebox or relay board? I have no electrical knowledge so I am asking this in earnest the device is only a 10 am unit?

    Thanks

    Rob
     
  7. sparta49

    sparta49 F1 Veteran
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    #7 sparta49, Feb 4, 2009
    Get a Stereo with a USB or IPod connector and burn the CD's to the Ipod, then you don't have to worry about vertical mounting
     
  8. BigTex

    BigTex Seven Time F1 World Champ
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    #8 BigTex, Feb 4, 2009
    10 amps continuous load is a large enough one that you don't want to add it to the fuse block bussing (invisible but surface mounted on the back of the fuse block)....

    The reason to put the fuse (overcurrent protection) as tight to the battery as possible is it minimizes the length of unprotected wire, where damage would short out the entire capacity of the battery!

    BIG sparks......

    An inline fuse would be the way to go.....
     
  9. BigTex

    BigTex Seven Time F1 World Champ
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    #9 BigTex, Feb 4, 2009
    A stereo with those modern features (or even a CD player) will not go into our dash, without extensive use of a power reciprocating sawzall......:D

    The metal backing plate is the old square opening with two holes either side for a cassette player or AM/FM only...I have put a removable faced CD unit into one of mine.....
     
  10. sparta49

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    #10 sparta49, Feb 4, 2009
    I would think one of the companies that makes the classic radios with the ipod hook up would work .

    http://www.normansclassicautoradio.com/
     
  11. DGS

    DGS Seven Time F1 World Champ
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    #11 DGS, Feb 4, 2009
    If you run a long wire to the fuse, then you have a long wire that can short without a fuse popping. If the fuse is at the battery, then a short in the long wire will pop the fuse, rather than melt the wire (and possibly start a fire).
     
  12. BigTex

    BigTex Seven Time F1 World Champ
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    #12 BigTex, Feb 4, 2009
    I got a nice iPod for Christmas...it's still in the box! LOL!
     
  13. Brian24

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    #13 Brian24, Feb 4, 2009
    I replaced my tape deck with a CD player in my GT4, mounted vertically. I read somewhere that they can be mounted up to 60 degrees from horizontal. However mine functions perfectly vertical. Clear even sound. No skipping.
     
  14. robertgarven

    robertgarven F1 Veteran
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    #14 robertgarven, Feb 4, 2009

    Can you give me the model and make???? Will it play CDR's

    I prefer CD as i like high fidelity and the small files that most units play aare compressed files with little fidelity, they are great for i pods but i need more.

    Rob
     
  15. robertgarven

    robertgarven F1 Veteran
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    #15 robertgarven, Feb 4, 2009
    What size wire gauge should I get and should I mount it to the battery or can I take a lead of my fuse box or relay? It is a 70 wat 8" subwoofer so it only uses a 10 amp fuse? Im not against attaching to the battery just not sure how to get it through to the console???

    Thanks

    Rob
     
  16. maurice70

    maurice70 F1 Rookie

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    #16 maurice70, Feb 4, 2009
    Robert I have a Clarion radio/cassette stereo which has a 6 disc cd stacker located under the drivers seat.
     
  17. Brian24

    Brian24 Rookie

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    #17 Brian24, Feb 5, 2009
    It's a Pioneer DEH-1950. It won't play unfinalised CDRs.
     
  18. DGS

    DGS Seven Time F1 World Champ
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    #18 DGS, Feb 5, 2009
    The power line is for the subwoofer's internal amp. Once you get the console apart, you're past the hard part. There should be any number of openings from behind the dashboard to the forward area (I'm assuming that's where the battery is in a GT4 -- I'm not that familiar with those).

    Wiring and current limits: http://www.powerstream.com/Wire_Size.htm. For 10A, you'll probably want 16 or 14 gauge multistrand wire -- or match the power lead that comes with the subwoofer. (According to your link, the wiring kit is included, although you may have to extend the power lead length.)

    There might be a battery cable buss near the fuse panel. Obviously, before playing with anything of that sort, you'll want to disconnect the battery. The 328 has a big battery connector at the fuse panel, but it doesn't use a connector you can tap into. I think some of the earlier 308s might have had a screw-post buss, where you could add another circle terminal.

    But unless you can find a big honkin' thick battery cable inside the cabin, your best bet is to run independent power off the battery directly.

    Part of the reason for this becomes more apparent when you've encountered after-market gear a previous owner installed. Trying to trace some of the "innovative" wiring done to cars over the years can be annoying, especially when trouble shooting an unrelated issue. It cost me ten hours of shop labor to have all the after-market wiring removed from a 20 year old car.

    A straight, independent wire to the battery keeps your "accessories" wiring isolated from any electrical problem the car may be having. The fuse at the battery is a quick way a shop tech can "unplug" your extras, to quickly determine that any electrical gremlin he might be chasing isn't caused by your subwoofer. (Shop techs are in the habit of blaming add-ons for most problems first -- a habit born of experience.)
     
  19. Protouring442

    Protouring442 F1 Veteran

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    #19 Protouring442, Feb 5, 2009
    Given the distance, and the potential voltage drop, I think I would use a 10gage wire directly from the battery. Definitely run the fuse as close to the power source as you can though, fire is never a good thing!

    Shiny Side Up!
    Bill
     
  20. robertgarven

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    #20 robertgarven, Mar 7, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    All,

    I took everyones advice and ran a 10 gauge wire from my battery to the subwoofer, with a 10 amp fuse around six inches from the post. I spent around 4 hours removing the screws, seatbelt, shift gate etc so I could access the underside of the stereo. I hooked up all the wires and before i put it back together I mage sure it worked and it sounded great. Fast worrward 8 hours putting everything back and cleaning etc. I pull the car out of the garage
    fire it up and evenj with the stero off I get a loud crackling through my speakers! I unhooked everything one wire at a time and it seemed to be the expensive street wire RCA cable that attached from the back of my cassette deck to the subs RCA inputs!

    I removed everything again and this time cleaned up all the wire under the radio etc and tried a rockford fosgate shielded RCA cable this time started up the car and no crackling!! Great!! I put everything back together ( again) and pull the car out of the garage and this time the sub is making a weird gurgling sound, I remove the RCA plugs and this reduces it but it is still there.

    Here is my problem?

    I am running solid core wires and NGK BP6ES plugs. I know I know, but the car runs great with the wires and I will do without the sub before i remove them! Will a resistor plug solve my problem?

    Remember my stereo (cassette) never had any noise ever (the radio did but I dont listen to that). The sub has high powered speaker leads which I could try but the unit is obviously making weird nosise with only the power attached an no inputs so I am nt sure that would be much better. This thing sounds great with the car off and gives just enough bass to make the 4" speakers sound great. I anyone has any suggestions.

    I know you guys are going to say no but it seems that interference is coming from my ignition being picked up by the power wire and the RCA cable (but the cassette sounds fine). Since this is such a small 70 watt unit why cant I hook it up to the same power wire that my cassette is hooked up to eliminating the 10 gauge wire.

    Here is a photo of the unit which slides under the passenger seat easily and also a weird braaket under my relay cover which I think is after market, have any of you seen something like this. It was screwed in with sae hex screws so I tossed it hope its not stock!!

    Rob

    Thanks for all your help in advance. If a resistor plug might work I would like to try that as changing plugs is about 10 times easier than removing the console again!!!
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  21. Protouring442

    Protouring442 F1 Veteran

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    #21 Protouring442, Mar 8, 2009
    You can try running all of the wires through a stainless wire mesh tube, with the mesh grounded on both ends.

    Shiny Side Up!
    Bill
     
  22. robertgarven

    robertgarven F1 Veteran
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    #22 robertgarven, Mar 8, 2009
    That is a good idea not sure where I would get the mesh.

    here is what I tried

    moving the ground to the same location the stereo is grounded
    using a different power wire same as to cassette
    moving the power and RCA cables apart
    disconnecting the antenna

    I am still getting this ignition sound with the RCA cables unhooked and just the power attached.

    I will try the high power leads next!

    Has anyone used resistor plugs on a 308???
     
  23. GCalo

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    #23 GCalo, Mar 9, 2009
    Robert,

    What you need is a noise filter on the (+) lead to the radio. This should cancel the noise you are getting.

    You can get one from a good car stereo shop.

    An inductor with at least #20 gauge wire about .35 Mh or higher should do the trick.

    If you can't find one let me know.

    I used to make 100's of those for car stereo people.
     
  24. DGS

    DGS Seven Time F1 World Champ
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    #24 DGS, Mar 9, 2009
    You need to connect the RCA cables. Unhooked, they become antennae, picking up ambient electrical noise. Connected, they are referenced to system ground.
     
  25. robertgarven

    robertgarven F1 Veteran
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    #25 robertgarven, Mar 14, 2009
    I tried the high power speaker wire hook-up to the subs amp and still the same gurgling noise. I bought a set of resistor plugs BPR6ES. I am running standard ignition with solid core wires and non resistor extenders could this in anyway damage my ignition?

    I am running out of options. I went to Radio Shack and every stereo store and none had the noise filter although one said he would order me one. I have tried everything you guys have suggested and am running out of patience. I can disassemble my console in less than an hour now.........
     
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