002 back to #78 | Page 3 | FerrariChat

002 back to #78

Discussion in 'Vintage (thru 365 GTC4)' started by Napolis, Oct 14, 2009.

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  1. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ
    Honorary Owner

    Oct 23, 2002
    32,118
    Full Name:
    Jim Glickenhaus
    #51 Napolis, Oct 26, 2009
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2009
    We're trying to figure that out. Do you think they did in 1947?

    I think they spray painted back then:

    http://swindlemagazine.com/issue03/spray-bond/

    The numbers for sure were hand painted.

    Best
     
  2. PSk

    PSk F1 World Champ

    Nov 20, 2002
    17,673
    Tauranga, NZ
    Full Name:
    Pete
    No idea, but I've heard of Bugatti's being hand painted, but then they were a little earlier than this car.

    Pete
     
  3. ColdWater

    ColdWater Formula Junior

    Aug 19, 2006
    621
    bicoastal USA
  4. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ
    Honorary Owner

    Oct 23, 2002
    32,118
    Full Name:
    Jim Glickenhaus
    Hi

    Thanks. I though so too.

    Best
     
  5. tongascrew

    tongascrew F1 Rookie

    Jan 3, 2006
    2,989
    tewksbury
    Full Name:
    george burgess
    Am I stating the obvious?? A few phone calls/e-mails to the historians at Classiche,Pininfarina,Zagato, as well as Massini,Muller, Schaughnessy,Niles and legends of the world of vintage and historic car restoration should get you what your looking for. Laquer paint,which I am sure you want to use, evaporates so rapidly, spray painting as already mentioned is the only way to go even in the "old days". There is a company called Paint World in New Haven, Conn which has mixing formulas for thousands,yes thousands, of custom and factory colors.I have used their Ferrari fly yellow which as far as I can tell is as close to an exact match as you can get. just one man's opinion tongascrew
     
  6. ColdWater

    ColdWater Formula Junior

    Aug 19, 2006
    621
    bicoastal USA
    I think this considerably understates the challenges of pursuing authenticity in any of the very limited number of cars built in small Italian shops during the chaos and poverty of the immediate postwar years. I'm dealing with this myself right now, and I can assure you that many commonly-held views dissolve into speculation upon rigorous questioning. The best reference is usually the car itself, but simple deductive logic from clues fortuitously found in photos and documents will often prove superior to long-held beliefs. No one can be an expert in everything, particularly in all of the small details of which restoration is comprised. Moreover, standards of authenticity in the more recent past (e.g. the '80s, when my car was previously restored) were vastly inferior to what we practice today.

    Besides, much of the joy is in the research and debate.
     
  7. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ
    Honorary Owner

    Oct 23, 2002
    32,118
    Full Name:
    Jim Glickenhaus
    Exactly.
     
  8. alebart3

    alebart3 Formula Junior

    Jun 5, 2008
    275
    #58 alebart3, Nov 10, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    This one of the best drawings of this car I see, if you go on the site you may find other nice like this from Inomoto master
    Alessandro
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  9. tongascrew

    tongascrew F1 Rookie

    Jan 3, 2006
    2,989
    tewksbury
    Full Name:
    george burgess
    Interesting comments. I fully agree that my evaluation was vey much an oversimplification. If you have the time please tell us more about the project you are "dealing with" now. thanks just one man's opinion tongascrew
     
  10. ColdWater

    ColdWater Formula Junior

    Aug 19, 2006
    621
    bicoastal USA
    To avoid hijacking this thread I'll just say that it is a '49 Maserati, about which I will someday post in the Maserati forum. Fortunately for me many of its components, materials, finishes and issues are identical to Ferraris of similar vintage, so I am grateful for the contributions to this forum by Napolis and others.

    Don
     
  11. ggjjr

    ggjjr Formula Junior

    Nov 11, 2003
    873
    Detroit
    Full Name:
    George
    Very well stated.

    George
     
  12. tongascrew

    tongascrew F1 Rookie

    Jan 3, 2006
    2,989
    tewksbury
    Full Name:
    george burgess
    Hi, darn! I hoped it would be a Ferrari. If I only had the time to take on both. Let us know on FerrariChat when you post on the Maserati forum. I would love to see it. thanks just one mN'S OPINION TONGASCREW
     
  13. rauldejalapeno

    rauldejalapeno Karting
    BANNED

    Apr 21, 2008
    156
    Dallas, TX
    Full Name:
    Randy Bush
    ++1
     
  14. ColdWater

    ColdWater Formula Junior

    Aug 19, 2006
    621
    bicoastal USA
    Sorry to disappoint, Tongascrew. But the differences during that era are perhaps less than generally imagined. In postwar Italy most small 'manufacturers' were really engine-building and assembly shops that subcontracted coachwork, frames and most components. There is a fascinating commonality of details among Ferraris, Maseratis, coachbuilt Alfas, Lancias and Fiats, as well as etceterini like Citistalia, Siata, etc. I succumbed to purchasing the Maserati because it offered a particularly appealing collection of details.

    The overall production volumes are extraordinarily small. Through 1957, for a dozen years after the war, AFAIK Ferrari made a total of fewer than 800 cars, of which perhaps a third were intended for competition. Maserati made just over 300 cars, of which more than half were for competition.

    Unless it already exists without my knowledge, the book I'd most like to see written (in English) is an overview of the early postwar years discussing the interrelationships among these Italian shops and their suppliers.

    And just to clarify, the best Maserati forum IMO is part of FerrariChat, although it unfortunately combines modern and vintage. The "other Italian" forum on AlfaBB also has some interesting threads relating to the early postwar era.

    Don
     
  15. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ
    Honorary Owner

    Oct 23, 2002
    32,118
    Full Name:
    Jim Glickenhaus
    Very Cool. I remember a cycle fendered Maserati Stan Nowack had. Is your car like that one?

    Best
     
  16. ColdWater

    ColdWater Formula Junior

    Aug 19, 2006
    621
    bicoastal USA
    #66 ColdWater, Nov 11, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    The scholars posting in FerrariChat and AlfaBB say that Nowak was associated with s/n 2014, the cycle-fendered A6GCS in the photo. Mine is a more mundane single-cam A6 1500 3C Pinin Farina berlinetta, although it is apparently the first and only surviving "competizione" version with triple Webers and just "due posti" whereas the others had rear seats. Looks like a slightly larger and more upmarket Cisitalia 202. Ex-Bill Noon.

    The driving experience must be somewhat akin to your #002 - crash box, steering with no mercy, approximate brakes, mechanical whine that drowns out the exhaust. Really wonderful. Now working towards giving the same authenticity to cosmetics of the engine compartment and interior.

    Thanks,
    Don
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  17. readplays

    readplays Formula 3

    Aug 22, 2008
    2,350
    New York City
    Full Name:
    Dave Powers
    I'm looking forward to following the Maserati section to see your posts. Thanks for the illumination in terms of the framework of the Italian sports/comp car industry circa 1950.

    Best,
    Dave
     
  18. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ
    Honorary Owner

    Oct 23, 2002
    32,118
    Full Name:
    Jim Glickenhaus
    #68 Napolis, Nov 12, 2009
    Last edited: Nov 12, 2009
    The one I remember Stan having had a central headlight in the grill but did look like the one in your photo.

    I remember him renting it out to a movie.

    "The Baron aka Black Cue aka Baron Wolfgang von Tripps"

    Best
     
  19. ColdWater

    ColdWater Formula Junior

    Aug 19, 2006
    621
    bicoastal USA
    The headlight within the grill is just a little lower than what's visible in the photo.

    Calvin Lockhart in an A6GCS ? Wow.
     
  20. Michele

    Michele Formula Junior

    Aug 27, 2006
    510
    The Hague, Holland
    Full Name:
    Michiel Mulder
    #70 Michele, Nov 13, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Headlight not in place but this is the basic idea:
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  21. wbaeumer

    wbaeumer F1 Veteran
    Consultant

    Mar 4, 2005
    8,828
    Thats #2002, ex-Ascari!
    A very successful car!

    Ciao!
    Walter
     
  22. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ
    Honorary Owner

    Oct 23, 2002
    32,118
    Full Name:
    Jim Glickenhaus
    Thanks for info and photo's on Stan's car.
     
  23. wbaeumer

    wbaeumer F1 Veteran
    Consultant

    Mar 4, 2005
    8,828
    Jim,
    #2002 is owned in Europe, Netherland I assume!

    Ciao!
    Walter
     
  24. Michele

    Michele Formula Junior

    Aug 27, 2006
    510
    The Hague, Holland
    Full Name:
    Michiel Mulder

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