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0052 M - ANOTHER Barn Find

Discussion in 'Vintage (thru 365 GTC4)' started by Marcel Massini, Jul 13, 2006.

  1. Boudewijn

    Boudewijn Moderator
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    May 15, 2003
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    Kare, during the RAC Tourist Trophy at Dundrod on September 15 1951 Baird raced 0136E finishing 6th. He carried racenumber 27. At least, that's the information I have.
    Best
     
  2. kare

    kare F1 Rookie
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    Nov 11, 2003
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    Baird raced a heavily modified Barchetta. A car being completed at this time (if it was even ready yet!) would hardly look like that. Best wishes, Kare
     
  3. kare

    kare F1 Rookie
    Consultant

    Nov 11, 2003
    3,244
    Please don't jump into conclusions so fast! Baird did not start in Isle of Man, I have no idea if he arrived or had a Ferrari in his hands by the time. The entry proves he thought he might be racing a 2-litre Ferrari, nothing else!!! 5 weeks later he was racing a Maserati 4 CLT...

    Best wishes, Kare
     
  4. Wouter Melissen

    Wouter Melissen Formula Junior

    Nov 12, 2003
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    Wouter Melissen
  5. dretceterini

    dretceterini F1 Veteran

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    Dr.Stuart Schaller
  6. CMY

    CMY F1 Veteran

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    Chris
    Amazing.. glad to see the car still has some age on it. :)
     
  7. ClassicFerrari

    ClassicFerrari F1 World Champ
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    Jan 7, 2004
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    Man, if you look up patina in the old dictionary....

    Amazing!
     
  8. Christian.Fr

    Christian.Fr Two Time F1 World Champ

    Jun 9, 2005
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    Thanks for the link, happy to see the car in action, incredible it looks
    out of time.
    i think it s the first one i saw in this estate in action. 0052M look so different.


    So probably Manny give us few pics more of your beautifull engin.

    Regards
    Christian

    PS: Marcel i know that you see the thread, and i know also that you want
    to talk with us. don t hesitate.
     
  9. dretceterini

    dretceterini F1 Veteran

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    As I posted in another thread, Marcel asked me to simply let everyone know he is VERY busy, and has very little time to respond to anything until July, at the earliest! He also asked me to assure everyone that it nothing personal if you do not get a response...
     
  10. Christian.Fr

    Christian.Fr Two Time F1 World Champ

    Jun 9, 2005
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    I know very well that he s busy man, there s too many celebrations this year
    But for me what is strange is the behavior. you can t do that only for a story of copyright. i know, for him this subject is important, but for us is much more important to have someone for help us and give us a reply there s too many question s.
    also if the moderators can t stop this story of copyright at time is not my fault too. i don t know why i must to pay for that.
    Look at this thread about the 0052M Marcel start the job with comments and pics, when i see it the first time it was like a strange feeling something like
    "a treasure found" very exiting, very interresting too.
    Today when i see the thread going into the deepest of thread, it s a shame.

    i m sorry for my frenglish. but it s my point of view.

    i m sorry is not here that wee can speak about that.
     
  11. dretceterini

    dretceterini F1 Veteran

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    J parlais Francis un petit. I was born in Switzerland, but never get to use my French anymore, so it is no longer very good.

    Feel free to write in French, however, as I am sure I (and everyone else) can make the most of it out with a little help from bablefish or similar.

    I agree that Marcel's input is invaluable. FYI, I have personally been waiting for a long time for him to comment on 001C/010I.
     
  12. Christian.Fr

    Christian.Fr Two Time F1 World Champ

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    Did you read the article inside the link of *************** it s very interresting, and this car is full of surprise.

    take a look for peole from ***************:

    "Ferrari's first sports racing cars rank among the historians biggest nightmare; the cars were continually changing mix of engines, chassis and body styles. The car that is currently believed to be the oldest existing Ferrari chassis, s/n 002C, has been fitted with at least three different engines and as many bodies. At the end of 1948 Ferrari launched their first 'production' car and from then onward the history of Ferrari cars gets a little less complex. To commemorate the victory of a Ferrari 166 Sport in the Mille Miglia, the new competition car is dubbed 166 MM.

    Technically the 166 MM was very similar to the first Ferraris, and shared the tubular frame that was characteristic for all of the company's sportscars of the 1940s and 1950s. Suspension was equally straightforward with wishbones at the front and a live rear axle at the rear. Where the early Ferraris really excelled was in the engine compartment, which housed the beautifully Gioacchino Colombo designed V12. In its first configuration the tiny engine only displaced 1.5 litre, but in its third incarnation had grown in size to just under two litres or 166 cc per cylinder.

    What set the 166 MM apart from the previous Ferrari racers was the new car's body design and construction, for which a third party was commissioned. What the small car needed was a lightweight body; a task ideally suited for Touring of Milan whose Superleggera designs were the lightest available. At the car's Turin launch the press quickly dubbed the Touring bodystyle fitted 'Barchetta', which is Italian for little boat. The name stuck, as did the design, which today is the most famous Touring design ever fitted on a Ferrari chassis.

    Ferrari had intended the 166 MM mainly as a customer racing car, but when they discovered the potential a number of works cars were also constructed. Between 1948 and 1950 just 30 examples were constructed of which 25 were fitted with the Touring Barchetta body. By the time the last 166 MM was constructed, Ferrari had diverted their attention at exploring the full potential of the long block Lampredi design V12. In those early 1950s the interest in two litre racers quickly grew and to meet the demand Ferrari constructed a second series of 166 MMs in 1953.

    Both in the hands of the works drivers and privateers the 166 MM proved to be a very commendable racer, with a large number of class and overall victories. The most famous of these victories was scored at Le Mans in 1949, where Ferrari scored a victory the first time out. The winning car was entered by Lord Selsdon, but the later North American Ferrari importer Luigi Chinetti did most of the driving, 23 hours to be precise. The only reason Lord Selsdon took the helm of his Ferrari was to comply with the regulations.

    The 166 MM was a big success on and off the track and contributed greatly to the conversion of the Scuderia Ferrari racing team to a full fledged manufacturer of road and racing cars. After being abandoned for a number of years, the Colombo engine was revived and would form the basis of the 250 GT series powerplant, which had an identical bore as the 166 MM engine.

    Pictured is one of the most exciting barn-finds of recent years; Ferrari 166 MM, s/n 0052 M. Although it was never really lost, it was hidden from the public eye for almost fifty years. It finally reappeared in the September/October 2006 issue of Cavallino Magazine, some two years after marque expert Marcel Massini first made contact with the late owner's relatives. He brokered a deal for the current owner and the highly original machine left the Arizona desert and entered his stable halfway through 2005. In the following months he started to take the car apart for a mechanical rebuild, carefully preserving the car's patina.

    During the disassembling process of the engine he made some very interesting discoveries; it was no ordinary 166 MM, but in fact the slightly different Formula 2 engine. The first major clue was the gear drive for the camshafts instead of the usual chain drive. The engine stampings also suggested it was built in the same batch as the engines fitted to the two-litre F2 racers. It was the very first 166 MM to feature this type of engine and the matching numbers suggest it was fitted with it from its conception in 1950. It is now believed that 0052 M was in fact a factory experimental machine.

    In the meantime Mr Massini spent many hours in his archive to compare old pictures to get a clear view on the unique machine's competition history. He discovered it was raced at Le Mans in 1950 by the 1949 winner Lord Selsdon and a new co-driver Jean Lucas. An accident at Tertre Rouge meant a premature end for the Ferrari. During the next few years, it was actively raced in Europe with considerable success. Recognizable by its large hood scoop and red brake drums, it was also most likely also featured in the Touring 166 MM brochure. Its racing career ended in 1955 and it subsequently changed hands various times before being sold to a Californian in 1959, who rarely drove it and stored it in Arizona for the next forty-five years.

    After its front-page magazine feature, the original and special 166 MM was first shown in public at the 2007 Cavallino Classis were the 166 MM model was one of the featured themes. The owner briefly drove his 166 MM on the Moroso track, before showing it on the concours field in front of the Breakers Hotel in Palm Beach. Courtesy of the mechanical, the owner told us that 0052 M now yields the best of both worlds: the highly original look and feel, while it drives like new.

    During the car's stay in Florida, our photographer Rob Clements caught up with the oldest original Ferrari racing car and its very proud owner to capture every little detail. Despite the very un-Florida weather, the above gallery shows he succeeded very well. We would like to thank the owner for his help with the shoot and his patience in answering all our questions. "
     
  13. Christian.Fr

    Christian.Fr Two Time F1 World Champ

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    #163 Christian.Fr, Feb 18, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  14. Christian.Fr

    Christian.Fr Two Time F1 World Champ

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    #164 Christian.Fr, Feb 24, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  15. ClassicFerrari

    ClassicFerrari F1 World Champ
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    I just can't get enough of this car. Great shots. That one in the desert (?) is very cool.
     
  16. Christian.Fr

    Christian.Fr Two Time F1 World Champ

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    All photographies are beautifull, suppose it s Arizona Desert, there s
    not a lot of nice shoots of Ferrari, also i decide to post them.
    i like to see the body in this estate probably the most beautifull Ferrari today.
    i would like so much that Pierre Dieudonné gives his impression about this car it should be incredible to read.
     
  17. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ
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    Oct 23, 2002
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    ?? Interesting? Perhaps. Accurate? No.

    002C's engine was bored out by Ferrari from a 159 to a 166 and possibly from a 125 (?) but it still retains it's original engine. It was originally owned and raced by Ferrari and is Ferrari's first major race winner. (The Turin GP). It's chassis is original and it's body has been replace 3 times.

    Best
     
  18. Christian.Fr

    Christian.Fr Two Time F1 World Champ

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    James, i propose to have a break, look this wonderfull 0052M
    don t pay attention about the first paragraph. only words.

    What do you think about her, looks beautifull no? i ve you ever seen a Ferrari
    like this one, it s pure.
     
  19. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ
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    Jim Glickenhaus
    She is beautifull but to answer your question I saw 0808 just after she won Le Mans still covered in dirt with sweat stained seats and for a brief moment she was "pure". I've come to realize that those moments are fleeting...

    Best
     
  20. dretceterini

    dretceterini F1 Veteran

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    If I owned 0052M, I would certainly have it gone through to make sure it is safe to use. I wouldn't want to destroy the originality of the car because something like a wheel spoke broke when driving at speed and there was a crash...

    As events can not be "physically" recaptured, perhaps they should simply stay pure in our minds, as Jim points out with 0808..
     
  21. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ
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    Oct 23, 2002
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    Jim Glickenhaus
    As Dr. Stu knows some events/objects can not even be observed without altering them...

    Another thing to keep in mind about race cars is that they evolved every time someone laid a hand on them and many times that was for the good but either way that is what was and that is what is...
     
  22. dretceterini

    dretceterini F1 Veteran

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    Actually, the simple act observation effects everything physical. To further understand this phenomena, watching the movie "What the Bleep; Futher Down the Rabbit Hole" will help.

    For anyone who is interested, here is a link to the website movie trailers..

    http://www.whatthebleep.com/trailer/
     
  23. Christian.Fr

    Christian.Fr Two Time F1 World Champ

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    i had a good fun reading your posts....sorry, but the drops comes to my eyes.
    probably the movie trailers....
     
  24. ArtS

    ArtS F1 Veteran
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    Nov 11, 2003
    5,972
    Central NJ
    Stu and Jim G.,

    Don't bring Heisenberg into this ;)

    Regards,

    Art S.
     
  25. dretceterini

    dretceterini F1 Veteran

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    What do you expect; Hawking was my "boss" for 20+ years...
     

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