The photo of the engine stampings clearly show Typo 350 Can Am engine not P4 engine as do gearbox. There are no P4 stampings on the engine showing it was an original P4 engine converted to a 350 Can Am engine by Ferrari. There is also the separate issue that the engine in David's "0900" seems to have the same serial # as the engine in 0858.
Sorry for any confusion. I have been known to come down on both sides of an issue before.I stand by my comments to express my opinions. tongascrew
I realise you are not involved in this rebuild/restoration and if you were would do things differently. At the same time your reputation with these cars is only exceeded by D.P. who I am sure will feel you looking over his shoulder. The final result will I am sure be controvercial as already brought out in this whole discussion of the English Wheel. It would be nice if there still were pannel beaters with the skills and molds [bucks] of those in the 1950s and 60s. My impression of what D.P. does is that it is as close to the oroginal as is possible today. The Can Am body I understand will remain with the car and and can be shown with it. If Pebble refuses the car it is their loss and a loss to those paying the big bucks for ticlets. I expect this rebuild will be superbly done and the result will enable the car to be a headliner no matter which side of the entrance gate. The market place my be the final judge for some but others will go beyond the money to what the car really represents. tongascrew
I understand the CanAm body is to remain with this car as it should be and I agree with the "time passes" comment. The discussion of the Bugatti,and so many others like it, is also a lesson to be learned from. tongascrew
George, George "It would be nice if there still were pannel beaters with the skills and molds [bucks] of those in the 1950s and 60s." There are and the original P4 bucks, molds and wireframes are still in Modena as well as those who are very skilled at using them. "My impression of what D.P. does is that it is as close to the oroginal as is possible today." Not true.
Thanks for the thoughtful responses. I'm getting it now. But from where I'm sitting, my view is that the car once was a P4,... so it can correctly be returned to that configuration. Whether it's being done properly is another issue. I get that a more original car / authentic car is being altered to a less original / authentic, but arguable more desirable car, and why it rubs many / most the wrong way. While i won't go as far to call this sacrilege, or even wrong... (I'm assuming the Can Am body and any other bits being removed are being preserved... pretty safe assumption I think),... This would not be a car I'd seek out if I were looking for a P4. Am I offended by what is being done?... No. But would I do it?... No.
I think it would be very similar to what we've read here and on the other 0858 thread. Possibly even more radical, given the sort of feeling the GTO conjures up.
I knew when I put up this post I would hear from you. I think you will agree that D.P has decades and a wide variety of experiences with the P cars. His career just behind the wheel is unrivaled and his shop experience is legendary. It seems a mystery that something must prevent him from wanting to make use of all the original building equipment that is still in Modena. I am sure there are many of us out there who would do almost anything to get the two of you on a stage together for several houirs of Q and A. When you look at the number of posts in this thread alone, the depth of interest in these few cars is wihout equal. It is apparent that the two of you take different approaches to the subject which is part of what creates such fascination by so many. Maybe next fall/winter when things slow down you might consider putting pen to paper,or however you wish to express your thoughts. A dialogue with you and David Piper would of couse be the very top of any wish list. tongascrew
I am sure that is very true today and for some past time.There was however a time when S F had the P series cars heading for the famous scrap heap. I am yet to be any kind of real authoity on the subject but from what I understand Enzo for what ever reason was happy saying so long to the P cars in just about anyway. When D P built, raced and sold his reproductions with so much original P series parts in them things changed. I am sure others out there have good stories along these lines. Let's hear some. tonascrew
If you want to cover all the bases then call it the P4,Springbok,CanAm, Piper Talacrest Ferrari.That way you may believe you make everyone happy when in fact at least you got the first part right. tongascrew