100 octane/race gas

The smell is good too. Have you noticed difference in power?

 

If your car is factory stock race gas will give you no more power. Higher octane only helps with higher compression ratios. If your car pings with factory recommended octane your car needs to be looked at, most likely the timing if off spec.

Octane by definition is the ratio of pinging compared to a standard. I van not remember if it is toluene or heptane. May be someone on the forum knows.

The good news is you save money if you except my advice. As a side bar the higher octane most likely not hurt your engine.

Best of luck whatever you do.

Lee

 

Completely untrue.

Here in Europe you can get Euro 95, 97 (Shell VPower in some markets, in others it's 100 Ron) 98, 100 (Shell VPower) and 102 (Aral, Gulf) RON .

Even the difference between Euro 95 and Euro 98 can be felt (mostly in the lower rev. range; rpm's more stable on stationary and pick-up). The difference between Euro 95 and 102 is very noticable, although I wouldn't be surprised if it differs from car to car. I think modern, directly fuel injected cars are probably more sensitive.

The above is both my own experience and tested by car magazines as well.

 

Technically it is true. A lot of people think it makes there car run faster but it just doesn't work that way.

I cannot talk to the European gas. All I know is Ferrari dealers did not want to sell European cars in the USA because of our gas. This is when my 360 was a new car. Things may have changed now. Nothing wrong with European gas it was different. European specked cars would show black smoke out the tail pipe with US gas.

The Ron you mention is the algebraic equation that is used to calculate octane. This was derived by a French engineer more than a century ago. I think his name was Poole, Ernest Pool I believe. I am not sure of the spelling.

We can disagree and still be friendly.

Best

Lee

 

The AKI and RON index is two very different things. 100 RON is about equal to a high quality 95 AKI. What Dustman is talking about is 100 AKI, not 100 RON, 100 RON is nowhere near 100 AKI. When talking octane and resistance to knock, the motor octane number (MON) is the most interesting one.

Octane has nothing to do with power. The density and amount of energy in the fuel is the same. Unless the specific brand of fuel has a higher density and BTU, a higher octane rating will not make more power. The reason why the high octane fuel pops and bangs in the exhaust, is because the fuel burns at a slower rate. Here's the kicker. The car will most likely make less power and run hotter in the combustion chamber with the high octane fuel. Unless the car is mapped for high octane fuel(which the 458 is not), it will NOT make more power, most likely less, as what you hear in the exhaust is unburned fuel, not delivering its power in the combustion chamber as it should. Btw. has anyone considered what kind of wear and damage running such high octane will cause as it actually makes for poor combustion and creates soot and "dirt"?

Basically what you want is a high quality 93 or 94 AKI fuel for the track. Don''t waste money pouring 100 AKI fuel in your tank, it won't make your car faster - unless you have had your engine mapped to run with a higher dynamic compression ratio and more aggressive timing.

 

Fwiw I will put nothing else in my car than the Sunoco 260 gt (100 aki, 105 ron)
that they sell at select Union 76 gas stations in Los Angeles. I don't recommend
the VP Streetblaze some 76's sell as it doesn't give the crispness of performance
the Sunoco offers.


Here are the two stations I get the Sunoco gas at:
11675 W Pico Blvd
S Barrington Ave
Los Angeles, CA 90064-2917
Phone: 310-477-6144

12037 San Vicente Blvd
S Bundy Dr
Los Angeles, CA 90049-4922
Phone: 310-476-4818

best

 

DK, agreed race fuel is unnecessary but if we are talking gasoline it doesn't have a slower burn rate nor would it have incomplete combustion. If it doesn't have any alcohol it would run slightly richer under open loop conditions as pure gasoline stoich is 14.68-1 compared to 14.1 for e10.

 

Thanks!
You should hear her now: much louder than when you heard her as the cats
have been bedded in

 

Great post and hopefully this will put it to rest. You did not fill in your profile. So you are either the smartest young person I have met or your engineering degree money was well spent

I would also add it is best to always just use the gas and oil grades recommended by the manufacturer. They know best

Best

Lee

 

What about oxygenated fuel which VP has many to choose from. I ran VP ms103 and 109 in a chipped twin turbo porsche and was told there was a small HP increase from the oxygenation not the octane.

 

+1

 

If you really want to go crazy, fill'er up with VP-c44. It's the only fuel I've ever seen actually produce more power on the dyno. Noticeably.

It's nasty stuff though. The exhaust will make your eyes water from the obnoxious smell and it's about $50 a gallon. When someone opened a jug of that stuff anyone 500ft around would know it.

 

It's doesn't really matter. I don't work for Shell, BP or any other Oil company nor have a technical or chemical background. I do have Google though ;-)

But 1 thing is certain, for 100%; there's definately a (marginal) performance difference between the Euro 95, 98, and 102 ron fuels. Why ??

Becuase I can feel it.

 

If you have a modern car and it takes 93 octane. You can tell the difference. The older cars with higher compression will ping with lower octane gas. This can cause damage to an engine.

The modern engine protects it self by retarding the timing This is done automatically so the driver never notices. The cars power is noticeably reduced. The power will return to normal. The key point is the compression ratio is high enough to take advantage of the higher octane.

My wife's 2013 Lexus use regular gas as does my 1954 Corvette. Higher gas would be a waste of money.

When I first bought my 1954 Corvette I used 93 octane because I assumed that was needed. Then someone told me that 93 octane was not even available when my '54 Vette was born. I looked up the compression ratio for the 54 and it was so low I dropped to the base gas.

Someone had mentioned the sound was different with high octane gas. I thought that was silly but as I thought about it my '54 Corvette did pop from the exhaust. That has all stopped with regular gas. I think that is caused by a faster flame front than the engine was designed for. That may be what the poster was saying.

My point is simple "use the oil and gas grade" your car manufacturer recommends. It will save you money and perhaps maintenance woes.

Best

Lee

 

+100 aki!

 

Both of your post seems to be somewhat of a contradiction; an inversion.

I already knew (most of) the theory behind octane ratings, ping, timing and ECU 's. But that's just theory which I as a non-techy/non-chemical schooled and non-technical equipped consumer cannot verify.

My point is that it's my own seat-of-pants experience that on a modern car the octane rating does seem and feel to make a difference contrary what some might or might not claim.

Your claim in your second post that putting a higher octane rating into a classic car is a waist of money seems completely logical (although a lot of classic cars/young timers demand at least Euro 98), classic cars do not have a ECU and therefor cannot differentiate between or to put it better, can'not adapt itself to fuel quality's.

 

+ 1

I am very much in tune with my car and all I can say is that after I put 100 aki (105 ron)
octane gas in my car for the first time it felt like a revelation: I had a smile up to my ears and the car felt much more powerful.
Granted perhaps the car can only use up to 93 aki (98 ron) but I don't care: the crackles are heavenly and the smell even more so.

Like I said before the skeptics can stick with regular octane gas, as for me she isn't getting anything less than 100 aki (105 ron): to each their own..

best