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16M for $229k!?!?

Discussion in '360/430' started by stokpro, Dec 31, 2010.

  1. Joe Mac

    Joe Mac Formula 3

    I'm not assuming that is correct but I know you aren't correct.
     
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  3. WILLIAM H

    WILLIAM H Three Time F1 World Champ

    Nov 1, 2003
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    HUBBSTER
    I like buying my cars fully depreciated :)
     
  4. Jason Crandall

    Jason Crandall F1 Veteran

    Mar 25, 2004
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    I've made me point.
     
  5. Drew_4RE

    Drew_4RE Formula 3
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    Dec 19, 2005
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    #129 Drew_4RE, Jan 6, 2011
    Last edited: Jan 6, 2011
    Amazon leasing gouges you. Clearly.

    On another note, if I did lease a car through my business would I be able to use pretax income to pay it?
     
  6. Joe Mac

    Joe Mac Formula 3



    is your point that your $12,000 per month statement is incorrect? That is factual (that $12,000 is incorrect).

    Your other point being that leasing a Ferrari isn't better than financing is also correct.

    If you agree with my 2 items above, you are batting 1,000, Jason.
     
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  8. lsanger

    lsanger Rookie

    Nov 15, 2003
    10
    I have had both cars. Really different animals. 16M is raw and immersive. 458 is refined, smooth and fast. Same speed in both cars, 16m feels faster. Or a fun car to drive on a nice day the 16M is very hard to beat. For a road trip I would take the 458.

    It appears to me the people speculating on the impact of the drop top 458 haven't considered the difference in the cars, lack of availability, and price differential. Seems to me the real range on 16Ms is 270-290. When the weather gets nice in a couple months I suspect the supply will tighten and prices firm up.
     
  9. TimsBlack16M

    TimsBlack16M Formula 3

    Jan 27, 2005
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    Well said Joe! We've disproved Jason1st's earlier "Guaranteed" statement that the monthly lease payment is $12,000+. Furthermore, we've shown conclusively that there are instances where it may make sense to lease (irrespective of our individual choices). Honestly, I think that Jason1st should admit his misperceptions, and bow out gracefully. Than again, there a those who will never admit that they are wrong.

    Tim
     
  10. Jason Crandall

    Jason Crandall F1 Veteran

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    #133 Jason Crandall, Jan 7, 2011
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2011
    Show me where it makes sense to lease. Be specific. I was specific.

    You're basing the $12K per month on that calculator. Call them up and get a quote with bad credit.

    Last time I asked you this question you bailed out.
     
  11. TimsBlack16M

    TimsBlack16M Formula 3

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    Jason, you really need to go back, and reread the posts. Several people have posted specific scenarios where it may make sense for a Ferrari buyer to consider leasing. In addition, you need to reread your first post. In order to refresh your memory, here it is: "a new 458 today would lease out in $12K per month range. Maybe more. Guaranteed, count on it!". At that time there was no thread references what-so-ever to people with bad credit, nor did your statement reference bad credit. In the context of the surrounding posts, yours was an across the board general statement that was glaringly inaccurate, and you were called on it. Now, in a last ditch effort to be right, you reference people with "bad credit". Has it occured to you that people with credit so bad, that they have to incur nearly a 100% premium to the otherwise $6000 approximate payment, would not qualify for a lease in the first place? Anyway, if we say "black", you say "white" . If we say "up", you say "down", If we say.....

    Rest assured, I did not bail out. Instead, you're like my teenage kids who are never wrong (in their minds). At some point, as a parent, its best to just step back and catch your breath!:)

    Tim
     
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  13. Jason Crandall

    Jason Crandall F1 Veteran

    Mar 25, 2004
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    Tim,

    You need to re-read this thread. You're taking a debate and making it personal.

    You have not showed me 1 single situation where leasing makes sense. Neither has anyone else.

    SHOW ME!! Put your money where you mouth is.
     
  14. Masher44

    Masher44 F1 World Champ

    Jan 15, 2008
    12,625
    Leasing makes major sense if you need to keep a high level of cash on hand to do business. I could have wrote a check for mine but did not because 1) I got a killer rate from the bank on a loan and 2) I always need AND like to keep as much liquid assets a pen stroke away in order to be able to do business. It is necessary.

    My paychecks do not come every two weeks and especially after the recession of the last two years, I will ALWAYS strive to keep as much cash on hand as possible.
     
  15. Jason Crandall

    Jason Crandall F1 Veteran

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    Leasing and financing are not the same thing. Did you lease or finance?

    I'm not saying a loan doesn't make sense. I'm saying the "leasing a Ferrari" makes no sense.
     
  16. Masher44

    Masher44 F1 World Champ

    Jan 15, 2008
    12,625
    #138 Masher44, Jan 7, 2011
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2011
    Financed for me.

    But I think the same can be applied to leasing. Only paying xxxxper month as opposed to paying xxxxxx up front.

    Plus if the world almost melts again you can always toss the keys in the bank parking lot and have your cash on hand.
     
  17. Jason Crandall

    Jason Crandall F1 Veteran

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    Lease works very differently from a loan.
     
  18. Masher44

    Masher44 F1 World Champ

    Jan 15, 2008
    12,625
    I've never considered one but can understand the logic behind it to a point. I am not nearly as familiar with the terms or conditions and no clue how it would be a huge benefit and a tax incentive but curious how it could be.
     
  19. Sellnit

    Sellnit Formula Junior

    Mar 22, 2010
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    Tim, I agree with your sentiments, this particular individual just wants to be right no matter what, and changes the parameters of the conversation to make it so. IE brings up issues that were not part of the original equation. Lets just move back to the cars, that is why we are here.
     
  20. jordanfsl

    jordanfsl Karting

    Dec 11, 2010
    80
    Los Angeles
    #142 jordanfsl, Jan 7, 2011
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2011
    I have to chime in on this, as I am in the process of leasing my first F-car. A few notes to start out with:

    1. I do have the ability to pay cash if desired.
    2. I am the owner of a business.
    3. In California, sales tax is paid on the monthly lease payment not on the purchase price of the car.
    4. I am planning on keeping the car for about 2 years.


    Leasing (open-ended, through Putnam for example) offers several advantages that have been previously mentioned. First and foremost, I will only pay sales tax on the 24 monthly payments I make, NOT the entire purchase price. At 9.75%, that is a massive savings. Second, the lease payment itself is tax deductible, although I won't engage in the debate on auditing, etc. Third, I can keep my liquid cash available for better returns instead of being sunk in a depreciating asset.

    Many people do not realize that it's rare to take an open-ended lease (in my case 5 years) all the way to the end of term. If I sell the car in 2 years, there is a simple formula to work the remaining payoff. Think of it as leasing that amount of money itself, not a car.


    In my circumstances, leasing is a far more attractive (and cheaper!) way to enjoy a Ferrari. The sales tax savings alone nearly cover the interest payments for a year. As always, your mileage may vary.

    I don't understand why some people on this board are so opposed to the idea of leasing an exotic. Really, what does it matter to you what method others use? As someone mentioned, the people who purchase these cars are rarely stupid. I work in finance for a living, and do have the ability to calculate different scenarios and choose what is best for me.
     
  21. tonyswfla

    tonyswfla Formula Junior
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    Jordan

    One of the first intelligent posts in this thread
    thank you
     
  22. Russell996

    Russell996 Formula 3

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    +1
     
  23. Jason Crandall

    Jason Crandall F1 Veteran

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    First post on FChat.....

    You don't work for a leasing company do you?:)
     
  24. jordanfsl

    jordanfsl Karting

    Dec 11, 2010
    80
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    Nope....I run a private equity firm in California and have been lurking here on FChat for awhile.

    I'm pretty easy to find online, so if anyone is really dying to know they can PM me for a real name.
     
  25. Sellnit

    Sellnit Formula Junior

    Mar 22, 2010
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    Man u do not quit, let it rest.
     
  26. TimsBlack16M

    TimsBlack16M Formula 3

    Jan 27, 2005
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    Thanks for the support...time to move on!

    Tim
     
  27. Russ Birch

    Russ Birch Formula Junior

    Oct 31, 2003
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    Yes. I've done it 8 times. (Well, 8 different exotics, 2 were Ferraris)
     
  28. Buxton

    Buxton Formula Junior

    Oct 31, 2010
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    They put the ad back up on ebay again. Same price, $229k, no mistake.
     

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