Positive Pressure Induction System

Well,
Technically it's not quite ready to be supplied yet, it's a work in progress.


I've purchased a set of prototypes of all the major mechanical parts from Mark Eberhardt, and I'm about to start installing the prototype system in my test car. I figured I ought to open a thread to capture the installation & testing.

The system will use a Lysholm screw type compressor, water-water intercooler, & a HALTECH E11V2 ECU for the ignition & EGI, & Coil-over plug ignition.

A lot of the system is derived from work that Mark & others have already been running for several years. I'm not claiming a lot of innovation, just putting together something that's based on well proven technology.

I've got to start pulling things apart & do a full major on the engine 1st before I actually begin work on the installation, so progress will probably be slow until after the holidays. I'll collect some posts about initial thinking here so everything's together.

I'm going to have to make drawings of the final version parts & get quotes which will take some time. I don't want spending time on documentation of parts that may be changing to get in the way of getting the prototype up & running. So, Don't ask me about pricing until I've got the system up & running. I can say that it's not going to be as cheap as Nick or Carl's systems, but then again, they won't be able to match it's performance either.

 

Here's some info about screw type compressors:
http://www.whipplesuperchargers.com/content.asp?PageID=65

Two features I love are:
- Full boost is on tap at any engine RPM starting at idle!
- Very efficient compared to centrifugal, rootes, & turbo compressor types!
- Changing max boost is as simple as changing the drive pulleys.

 

The SC will be on top of the engine blowing upwards into a new plenum that houses the intercooler's heat exchanger. Throttle body mounts on the back of the engine, displacing the oil filter to the firewall.

 

I'm getting underway. Pulled the CIS, plenum & risers. Here's the plumbing that's must be re-arranged to lay down flat on the bottom of the V to make room for the Lyshom. The thermostat housing has to be moved about 3" forward so the Lyshom's nose to allow space for the Lyshom's nose.

Also, the oil filter & it's mount are coming off & will be re-located to make room for the throttle body. That also means that that hose spagetti in the 2nd picture has to be relocated & cleaned up. It looks like I'll be able to keep the Euro oil cooler & just re-connect it to the relocated oil filter mount.

It's 308 heresy, but I'm going to mount the oil filter with the filter body downwards. I won't have to worry about dumping oil out each time it's unscrewed, & won't be limited to the handful of filters with an internal standpipe. Altho, I'll probably stay with the current list just 'cause they're known to take the 308's unusually high oil pressure. Also, the filter will stay full of oil, so won't have to wait for it to fill up & build up pressure when I start the engine. The System 1, Hamburger, & MOROSO filter mounts are the prime candadates as they also take AN fittings. I'm leaning towards the Hamburgers as I think it'll give cleaner hose routing.

Not to mention that a lot of cleaning & hose replacement has to be done.
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I'm planning development in 3 phases in order to manage risk & cash flow. My current thinking is as follows, but suggestions would be welcome:
Phase I - Basic feasability proof of concept/installation consisting of the Lysholm screw type compressor & new plenum, relocated plumbing & thermostat housing, water-water intercooler, a HALTECH E11V2 ECU for ignition & EFI. Boost will be kept within the stock clutch's limits.

PhaseII - Boost significantly increased, hopefully up to system max(pucker factor permitting). Coil-over plug ignition, Upgraded clutch, & (if necessary) radiator.

PhaseIII - QA1 coil-overs, rebuild F&R suspension, upgrade brakes, wide wheels & sticky tires.

Chris, those are the right questions. Here's current thinking:

OIL FILTER:
Didn't have a choice about relocating the oil filter as you'll see. It had to go. But yeah, I never liked it being right over the bell housing access port either.

I think the current oil cooler will be adequate. Next step would be to mount a fan behind the cooler to suck air thru it which would help a lot, especially at slower speeds. I'm a tad worried about being able to remove the outlet oil line from the cooler. I seem to remember a thread reporting problems doing this. Anyone remember the thread?

Yes, the std oil filter center-hole is 3/4-16 thread, implying roughly a 5/8" tube ID. AN-12 is the best match, & the remote filters seem to have standardized on it for the AN size.

CLUTCH: TBD
I'm not sure about the clutch yet. For the project's initial phase (ie: this spring) I'm planning on keeping the boost within the stock clutch's approx 280 hp capability, say 6-8psi. Nice thing about this type SC, just select a pulley ratio.

I'm going to need a lot more clutch for phase II. Need to do quite a bit of research here. I've got several options. I actually have a 10,000 RPM triple disc racing clutch & one of Nick's quartermaster clutches.

I need to talk to Nick about a couple of things with that clutch. The pedal pressure on that clutch is too much for my bad left knee. I don't know if the clutch is incorrectly adjuste, or that's just the nature of the beast. Would really like to hear from some others with Nick's clutch.

One possable remedy would be to modify the clutch link arm to change the leverage ratio. IIRC, mk e did that.

Also, The lightweight flywheel is great for the track, but it's hard to keep the engine from stalling when backing & turning in driveways & parking lots. I'd like a heavier flywheel. I need to know if the clutch can be mounted on a stock flywheel by just drilling the correct hole pattern. Hmm, I guess all I really need to do is to measure the thickness of the 2 flywheels.

RADIATOR: TBD
The OEM radiator is pretty good, especially here in cool NE. A rebuild with a high capacity core also could also be done. If necessary, I've got a high capacity Al radiator, plan to drop it in for phase II.

BRAKES:
I've got a Brembo big brake kit for phase II.

SEATBELTS:

Waterproof with replacable highly absorbant lining please.

Don't think I'll need racing belts for street use, but would be a good idea when tracking it with wider racing tires, along with racing seats. I'm not planning on doing racing seats, but belts are a good idea for Phase III.

 

Thanks PAD,
When it comes to tires, suspension tuning, etc. I plan on listening very carefully to mk e. He's been there, knows what works & has a good idea where the limits are.

Breaking a half-shaft wouldn't be too bad, but a tranny lay shaft, or rear axle hub shaft would be a different story.

 

Got the thermostat housing, WP, & all but the pipe along the front header off last weekend. That $@#%@% pipe just didn't want to come off. Finally got it to move enough so a crack was visable at all 4 gaskets. I've been soaking the stuck studs via the gasket cracks & threaded ends with PB blaster daily all week, along with tapping on the pipe with a hammer. However, it was really stuck onto those studs.

The Easter guests departed about an hour ago, so I thougn I'd see if I could make some progress with that pipe that was stuck up on the mounting studs.

1FWD:
Soaked the studs again w/PB blaster, then started tapping w/a hammer. This time the pipe started moving, but only with substantial coercion. Fought all the way off, but at least it came off!

1BACK:
Bad news is that the reason the pipe started coming off is that one of the studs broke off in the head. That stud was seriously corroded/siezed up in the pipe, I was barely able to get it out with a punch & a 3lb sledge.

The stud will have to be drilled & backed out. Hopefullly I won't destroy the threads in the process. Looks like I'm going to need a right-angle drill as there's not a lot of clearance.

I think the best way to ensure I drill straight down the broken stud's center is going to be to put the pipe back on & insert a slip fit sleeve in the stud hole to guide a small (maybe 2.5 mm) drill bit, then try to use an easy-out to back the stud out. This means I'm going to have to clean all the corrosion off of the studs & out of the pipe's holes before re-installing the pipe.

At worst, once I've got a small hole drilled down the stud's center, I can use a thinner walled sleeve & a drill that's the next size down from the stud's threads minor diameter. ie: Drill out the stud's body hopefully leaving the threads in to be cleaned up. At worst, I can use the pipe's hole to guide the drilling & tapping for a thread repair insert.

BTW, I'm trying to figure out why the studs were so corroded. The gaskets weren't leaking. All I can think is that moisture was getting around the nuts when the engine was being washed, then it developed the corrosion.
__________________
When it's NLA, Who do you call? Unobtainium Supply Co.

 

Pics show the drill guide sleeve in the flange hole & my new 90 degree drill in use.

Should have stayed with the plan of using a larger ID sleeve & drill once I had the 1/8" center hold thru the broken end. But NO, what tool did I go & use? (hint see pic #3). Forgot that tool's definition:

E-Z OUT BOLT AND STUD EXTRACTOR: A tool ten times harder than any known drill bit that snaps neatly off in stud holes, thereby ending any possible future use.

It did & they're at least as hard as a new carbide ball nose end mill(ask me how I know)...

Tomorrow I start with my emergency solution(4rh pic), ain't nothin harder than diamonds.
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It's finally out. Discovered that a square nose carbide end mill would cut it, BUT only if the center were relieved first!
So I ended alternating between the sleeve guided 1/8" diamond bit in my trusty HF 105° air die grinder which made very slow progress straight down the center. Then I'd switch to the 90° drill with a 5/32" square nose end mill which would actually cut the carbide quite quickly down to the bottom of the diamond carved recess.

I don't know why the ball nose end carbide mill wouldn't cut the center tho.

Then had to try to clean up the threads. Unfortunately, the top 1/3 or so of the threads got pretty well stripped while I was trying to get the !#@$@#% broken screw remover out. Doubly unfortunately, as I feared, the stud's hole goes thru into the water jacket so I don't want to use a heli-coil. So I'll be borrowing or buying a Time-Sert kit. Wish Time-Sert made solid bottom inserts for cases like this, but I'll just put 518 on the stud's threads.

BTW, McMaster-Carr carries the assymetric thread studs used all over the 308. Sometimes the short thread end needs to be lengthened with a die tho. But the price is usually less than $1 while they run $2 to $3 from the F* distributors.

 

Hmm,
You're right of course, with a thick wall the inner & outer threads don't have to be synchronized like a Time-Sert. I'd just need a bottoming tap for the inside threads, or else make a really small internal threading point.

 

Time-Sert is in, now back to the real project. Can't find a one of my plastic gasket scrapers, so am stuck till tomorrow AM.

Also realized I was so focused on the $!% stud that I forgot to order things like gaskets & parts to rebuild my water pump.
:{

When I do the WP this time, I'm going to add a 2nd outer bearing. If it works for the Dutchman, it'll work for me...

 

Finally got back to the PPI project after traveling for 3 wks, then digging out from a big backlog of US orders & spring yard work chores. Progress should be a tad more steady from here on out.

1st picture: Top of engine stripped at last:
- Oil cooler removed for relocation
- Thermostat/ WP body removed
- Coolant pipes along heads removed.
- Studs for coolant pipes removed as several got bent fighting with the siezed pipe, & all were pretty corroded.

BTW, The old gaskets were on super hard! Got most of them off with a homemade nylon scraper, followed by an ultra-fine abrasive nylon brush in an angle grinder. However there were still blotches of gasket left. Tried a couple of things: Permatex Gasket Stripper + a brass bristle 'toothbrush' does a great job of stripping old caked on gasket! Another thing that worked about as well is Strypeze SuperStrip(tm) with the brass bristle brush.

2nd Picture: Installing pipe studs
Bought 2 sizes from McMaster-Carr. The shorter stud had the correct length threads, the longer studs didn't have enough threads on the short ends(knew when I bought them), so I cut the threads another 5mm. The studs are still a bit longer than OEM, but they'll work fine.

The end of some of the studs breaks thru into the head's water jacket. I believe coolant leaking out thru past the threads is what corroded the studs inside the pipes. I wanted to ensure the threads were well sealed, so I spread a bit of silicone into each stud hole's female threads. Next I coated the threads of each stud with black silicone sealant before installing them.

The palm ratchet/MAC roller cam stud tool works great for quickly installing studs w/o damaging the threads like double nuting can. It's also easier & quicker to use than a 'collet' type tool.
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I installed the new studs 2 weekends ago, then went to install the pipes Tuesday, 2 JY. Discovered that I'd apparently cut the threads about 3 threads too long on the shorter of the 2 studs(DUH). When they studs are seated in the head, they only protrude outside the pipe flanges about 3 mm which isn't enough to get a nut on top of a washer. Problem is I'f made the threads that go into the head the same length as the OEM studs whose overall length was about 3mm longer than the new studs(DUH).

So ordered new studs Wed 3rd. If I'd been smart, I would have had them shipped priority mail & they'd have come in yesterday & I'd be finishing installing the coolant pipes on the car instead of writing this.

At this point, the pipes are blocking progress. After I get the pipes installed, I want to give the engine a thorough cleaning before I pull the cam covers off to do the major.

280hp is the figure I'm going with based on 300hp being reported in posts by mk e & others going back to the old FChat as the point where very rapid wear sets in.

Someone recently told me that Norwoods uses a higher number, but I haven't verified that they do.

Since 'your mileage may vary' is well known to apply to dyno results, the reported clutch limits will vary accordingly.

 

Hmm,
Found Norwood's clutches:
http://www.norwoodperformance.com/clutches.htm
That kevlar clutch price looks pretty good. Will seriously consider it when it's time to replace my currently new clutch.