1975 365 GT4 2+2 Chassis 18295 Convertible Comversion | FerrariChat
Buy

1975 365 GT4 2+2 Chassis 18295 Convertible Comversion

Discussion in '365 GT4 2+2/400/412' started by samsaprunoff, Aug 1, 2013.

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, Skimlinks, and others.

  1. samsaprunoff

    samsaprunoff F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed

    Jun 8, 2004
    4,418
    Edmonton, AB Canada
    Full Name:
    Sam Saprunoff
    #1 samsaprunoff, Aug 1, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Good day All,

    Thanks to Brian in another thread for pointing 18295 out...

    Anyway, just documenting these cars, as they come up... Sadly, a sacrificed, neglected, and chopped car alas...

    Cheers,

    Sam

    Auctions America - Collector Car Auctions

    1975 Ferrari 365 GT4 2+2 - Convertible Conversion, Engine Removed
    Color: Red Exterior with Tan Interior
    Mileage: (?)
    Location: CA, USA
    VIN:
    Chassis: 18295
    Auction (Estimate): $ 4,000 - $ 6,000 - Offered Without Reserve


    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  2. rustytractor

    rustytractor Formula 3

    Mar 25, 2012
    1,078
    London
    Full Name:
    Russell Schacter
    #2 rustytractor, Aug 1, 2013
    Potentially a fantastic opportunity to gain all the parts required to convert an auto to manual (if you're so inclined).

    Assuming all the 'box parts are present at $4000-6000 I bet you could buy the car, do the conversion, break the remainder and sell the left over parts and end up making a profit (if you're capable of doing the work yourself).

    Which raises a question - would an auto that'd been converted to manual have a value more/less/equal to the original auto or a manual car.

    Hmmmm.....
     
  3. rustytractor

    rustytractor Formula 3

    Mar 25, 2012
    1,078
    London
    Full Name:
    Russell Schacter
    #3 rustytractor, Aug 1, 2013
    Forget to add "assuming that the 365 'box parts would fit a later 400/400i"

    I'm such a forgetful idiot sometimes !
     
  4. samsaprunoff

    samsaprunoff F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed

    Jun 8, 2004
    4,418
    Edmonton, AB Canada
    Full Name:
    Sam Saprunoff
    #4 samsaprunoff, Aug 1, 2013
    Good day Russell,

    Indeed, good value if the car sells for the estimate. The problem is for those that are not local or close to where the car is to be collected. I say this, as since the car cannot move under its own power the ability to transport the car out of state, etc presents logistic issues and costs. For example, in my case I have yet to find a transport company that would transport a non running vehicle to me for a reasonable cost. Heck... even a running vehicle will cost between $2K and $3K to get it to me (US to Western Canada). So in my case (and perhaps others too) I would have to either hire someone to trailer the car to me (which would be somewhat pricey, as there would be no economies of scale), or drive down and trailer it back myself... which is also not very time or cost effective... alas...

    Cheers,

    Sam
     
  5. rustytractor

    rustytractor Formula 3

    Mar 25, 2012
    1,078
    London
    Full Name:
    Russell Schacter
    #5 rustytractor, Aug 1, 2013
    Hi Sam,

    I totally understand your point BUT if someone lived relatively close it could be a very interesting proposition.

    What are your thoughts on value if someone did manage to pull the auto to manual swap over off assuming the bits were a) all there b) compatible and c) not trashed ?
     
  6. samsaprunoff

    samsaprunoff F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed

    Jun 8, 2004
    4,418
    Edmonton, AB Canada
    Full Name:
    Sam Saprunoff
    #6 samsaprunoff, Aug 1, 2013
    Good day Russell,

    Indeed for someone relatively local this would be a good buy.

    As for the transmission swap valuation... this would be a tough call. For me the manual transmission is highly desirable and is worth more in general... but to others perhaps autos are more desirable. That being said if I was looking at a car that was swapped to a manual, I would value it less than a factory original manual... even if all of the original auto pieces came with the car. The reason being is that the car has been modified... and all the pieces may not be there and you would not know this until if or when you decided to swap it back.

    Given the number of autos available and their current prices I have thought about a swap a few times...the most recent of which was the recent sale of that inexpensive black auto in Florida... However, I am still holding out for carbs and and a manual :)

    Cheers,

    Sam
     
  7. pricebill

    pricebill Rookie

    Oct 15, 2012
    12
    #7 pricebill, Aug 2, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Pic taken this morning of the frame rail rust and rot just behind the right motor mount. Anyone care to guess how damaging this is to the value of the car?

    Sold at $8750
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  8. samsaprunoff

    samsaprunoff F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed

    Jun 8, 2004
    4,418
    Edmonton, AB Canada
    Full Name:
    Sam Saprunoff
    #8 samsaprunoff, Aug 2, 2013
    Good day All,

    Obviously a great concern... but... as to its value... the car just sold for $8750 USD to an online bidder! The car itself may be too far gone for a restoration... but the parts alone are worth obviously at least $8750 USD to someone...

    Cheers,

    Sam
     
  9. pricebill

    pricebill Rookie

    Oct 15, 2012
    12
    #9 pricebill, Aug 2, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    $8750 + 10% buyers premium + 9% CA sales tax unless shipped out of state by certified transport or you have a dealers license. I was fairly certain that the winning bid was made by the guy in front of me. I considered this engineless vehicle desirable because there are no smog checks necessary on cars 1975 and older here in CA. There was an Arizona plate in the trunk and I assumed a title to go with it. If no one at the DMV wanted proof of EPA / DOT federalization (I didn't find a plate stating so in either door well) then you might be able to register and walk out the door with plates. That would free up your engine choices and exhaust possibilities quite a bit.

    It looked a bit better in 2000 when it sold for $23.5 at Christies 1975 FERRARI 365 GT4 2+2 'CONVERTIBLE' | Christie's
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  10. samsaprunoff

    samsaprunoff F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed

    Jun 8, 2004
    4,418
    Edmonton, AB Canada
    Full Name:
    Sam Saprunoff
    #10 samsaprunoff, Aug 2, 2013
    Good day Pricebill,

    Wow, what happened to this poor car in the last 13 years?... obviously unloved...

    As for the new owner, I think it was an internet bidder, as I was watching the bidding online. Although the bidding was going pretty fast and so perhaps a local person was able to get the last bid in?

    Thanks for the additional pics and the pic from 2000!

    Cheers,

    Sam
     
  11. bundas

    bundas F1 Veteran
    Owner

    Dec 31, 2005
    7,090
    lexington ky usa
    Full Name:
    mitchell barnes
    #11 bundas, Aug 2, 2013
    listened to the $$$ scale up and kept my mouth shut. have too many projects. and really. a cut 365? why? I have a spare complete motor/trans. so the project would have been doable. getting more selective in old age.
     
  12. Autoart

    Autoart Karting

    Jun 12, 2006
    119
    Melbourne, AUSTRALIA
    Full Name:
    Mike Nicholas
    #12 Autoart, Aug 3, 2013
    I looked at the pics on the internet but did not see any of the engine bay.

    I thought about bidding online on this very car but decided against it at the last minute.

    Surely this is not the way to encourage confidence with phone or online bidders - particularly where the flaw is obvious and of a substantive nature to undermine the structural integrity of the car.

    the car should have been described as a parts car only not a restoration project.

    Anything can of course be restored, but its current status is salvage not restoration given the low values attributed to this model
     
  13. 180 Out

    180 Out Formula 3

    Jan 4, 2012
    1,280
    San Leandro, CA
    Full Name:
    Bill Henley
    #13 180 Out, Aug 3, 2013
  14. pricebill

    pricebill Rookie

    Oct 15, 2012
    12
    #14 pricebill, Aug 3, 2013
  15. 180 Out

    180 Out Formula 3

    Jan 4, 2012
    1,280
    San Leandro, CA
    Full Name:
    Bill Henley
    #15 180 Out, Aug 4, 2013
    The car must be even more needy than it looked in the photos. I predicted $21,000: $2,255 too high!
     
  16. bundas

    bundas F1 Veteran
    Owner

    Dec 31, 2005
    7,090
    lexington ky usa
    Full Name:
    mitchell barnes
    #16 bundas, Aug 4, 2013
    for that mess. I am really out of touch
     
  17. shaughnessy

    shaughnessy Formula 3
    Rossa Subscribed

    Apr 1, 2004
    1,869
    Wolfeboro NH
    Full Name:
    Thomas E Shaughnessy
    #17 shaughnessy, Aug 4, 2013
  18. willrace

    willrace Three Time F1 World Champ
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Oct 21, 2006
    34,424
    North Tay-has
    Full Name:
    Kurt
    #18 willrace, Aug 5, 2013
    That front frame section in front of the front bulkhead is available from Ferrparts, minus the whole front sheetmetal clip I needed for #22579, IF someone wants to graft that much into this car. My clip was from a convertible conversion as well, coincidentally.
    I have to wonder how deeply back into the rails the rust has compromised them, though.
     
  19. bundas

    bundas F1 Veteran
    Owner

    Dec 31, 2005
    7,090
    lexington ky usa
    Full Name:
    mitchell barnes
    #19 bundas, Aug 5, 2013
    how much for the motor and do u know anything about it
     
  20. bundas

    bundas F1 Veteran
    Owner

    Dec 31, 2005
    7,090
    lexington ky usa
    Full Name:
    mitchell barnes
    #20 bundas, Aug 5, 2013
    well there is a transmission, a set of wire wheels and a windshield. add the freight and there goes another 1-2,000. b hard pressed to justify
     
  21. dinopaul

    dinopaul Formula Junior

    Jan 27, 2010
    443
    Paris, FRANCE
    Full Name:
    Paul
    #21 dinopaul, Aug 8, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  22. Ashman

    Ashman Three Time F1 World Champ
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Sep 5, 2002
    32,975
    MA
    Full Name:
    John
    #22 Ashman, Aug 8, 2013
    The exact same thing that happened to countless 250PF, 250GT, 250 GTE 2+2, 330GT, 330GT 2+2 and even some much rarer models of the 50's as they all became just old used cars in the 70's and suffered neglect, Chevy engine transplants and simple wasting away.

    An old college friend of mine tried to convince his father to buy him a Lusso for $8,000 in 1975 and another friend told me he bought a 250 GT SWB in a distress sale for $3,500 around 1970 or so.

    Eventually some of those cars came to be appreciated for what they once were, values increased and restoration became economically feasible for the reduced number of survivors out there. The speculative Ferrari boom of the 80's saved a lot of those cars when they were only 20-25 years old and many of them lasted through the market crash of the 90's and are still riding the market wave of the 2000's.

    Will that ever happen to the 400 series? Anything is possible but, the anomaly of the 80's excepted, generally a car needs to get to be 40 or more years old before prices start to rise. For the 412s that were in production until 1990, that could take as long as 2030, a mere 17 years away!
     

Share This Page