1975 Ferrari 365 GT4 2+2 Chassis 18483

Dino 206S called...they want their wheels back. har har.


That's actually quite a cool ad and project. Love to see the history and those old photos in the glovebox are priceless. I hope someone grabs it and finishes the restoration. I also notice a 228 sitting in front of it. Rare car....

 

I’m interested in purchasing and restoring this particular vehicle. I’m located about 5 hours away from the seller’s location. I’m in contact with the seller and have received 70+ pictures.

Although I have restored numerous cars, and possess the shop, tools and skills, this would be my first prancing horse and I’m concerned about getting in over my head. I know my OCD eats up a ton of time and money.

The current owner bought the car to part out and sell, however after receiving the car, he believes it should be restored. I’m trying to calculate if the juice is worth the squeeze.

What is the estimated restored value? The required body work alone is significant, not to mention, chasing down and purchasing all of the missing bits to complete the car.

Thanks in advance for your constructive feedback to my 1st forum posting.

PS: I’ve included some additional pictures that illustrate the extent of bodywork that will be required.

 

Well, all the expensive bits (lights, windscreens, running engine), do seem present (if the quote about the "chrome" is correct). The original interior is still present which is a plus as the original mouse-hair dashboard is usually totally cracked. As a side note the odometer rests at 99.999km, we can imagine that this particular car crossed the limit.

Compared to other cars of that era these cars are complex and quite demanding , but they are still within reach of a talented DIYer. As a guideline keep in mind that these car are "twice more of everything": 2 bank of cylinders, 2 complete exhausts, 2 sets of carbs (6 in total), twice as many filters, independent left and right wiring harness, two tanks, double brake circuit, etc... Unfortunately this does not translate into twice as much time, but rather more in terms of labour!

1) There is obviously quite a lot of paintwork (100hrs ?)
2) The dashboard should be removed in order to patch the covering that has shrunk (5~10hrs)
3) Suspension bushings are likely to be shot (20hrs)
4) Exhaust may or may not be re-usable (stainless is $4.000)
5) All fuel hoses tank screen and fuel filter(S) should be replaced (5~10hrs)
6) Engine will probably require a complete review as per the Owner Manual: Shim the valves, refurbish the 6 webers, replace all lubricants & filters (50hrs).
7) Chase a few electrical gremlins (5~10hrs)
7) Classical tires are approx $350 each, there are some cheaper alternatives though.
8) Do you need AC?

Assuming no horror story (i.e motor and transmission do work as advertised) that's approx 200hrs of labour.

Value of the car once fixed : $70~$100.000 ?

 

Prices are not on the rise any more... There is a clean 365 for sale on autoscout, asking price is 95.000€, still for sale.

As far as the interior is concerned this is a Ford/Chevy debate...I prefer an original leather with patina rather than new hides. I had to refurbish my dashboard, I've made huge efforts to keep the dashboard stock but for the pinnacle I had no other choice than "new hides". This was perfectly done, but really miss the original Conolly. An old hide that has slightly shrunk does have a specific look that you cannot replicate. As far as this particular car is concerned, If you look at the provided pictures, there are no tears and cracks in the leather (mink oil and URAD would restore its former glory), the wooden console looks nice, side carpets are not glued any-more but this is a no brainer. Mousehair next to the windscreen is damaged, but could be fixed.

With 200hrs of work this car would by no means be a concourse car, but probably a nice car to drive and enjoy.

 

This listing was spotted by dinoPaul last week, nice 365 under 100k€. Perfect history (only 2 owner since new). The colour maybe not everybody cup of tea (I do have a bias for it though...)

https://www.autoscout24.com/offers/ferrari-365-gt4-2-2-splendido-stato-gasoline-yellow-3d7c4c54-166c-4178-9b3d-43e208f1bc2d?cldtidx=2&cldtsrc=listPage

 

Can someone post documented online/auction price results for 2-3 of these within the last 12-18 months? I think based on my knowledge of the market that Raemin would be more accurate in that these cars are not selling for more than six figures. But, that’s my speculation and certain someone will find one that sold for $500K?!? Listing price is far different from actual purchase price. Then, you have to factor in the vehicle’s history and condition that would affect the value of its purchase.

Ultimately, the anticipated sale price of this one which, should it be repaired (while the market having already seen in its current condition), would assist Jeff or anyone else in determining whether it’s a parts car or good project. The onus would then turn on the detail associated with the restoration and, the faith placed on the restorer’s attention to the ever so large list of items on this one... Many Ferrari people are finicky and are not always receptive to revived projects.

 

On my side of the Atlantic, restored often means "fully functional", whereas your guys are much more involved and considering nuts and bolts overhaul. I've seen one pristine 412 car here in France, but the condition was more related to the less than 3000km mileage than the result of an hard restoration work. I would even be tempted to say that some US F-Chaters are restoring cars with so much attention to details that the cars often end-up better made than when they left the factory. (the suspension of my father's 365 when new was not as shiny as yours...).

There are ten 365 for sale on Autoscout right now (https://www.autoscout24.fr/lst/ferrari/365?sort=standard&desc=0&ustate=N,U&size=20&page=1&atype=C&fc=7&qry=&), the most expensive one is 120.000€ all the others below 100.000€, and even as low as 69.000€ for a car in much better conditions than 18483. I would still consider that given where 18483 stands now, with 200hrs of work it will still not match some of these ~80.000€ cars. Needless to say that in order to fetch "US-resto" price levels it would require 30.000€ paint, 24.000€ engine overhaul, 15.000€ interior, etc... I am not sure one can recoup such restoration costs given what the European market is now.

18483 could be a bargain though.

 

The situation with these cars is it doesn’t work out financially to restore one. If you love the car and plan to enjoy for many years then go for it. If planning on restoring and making money you’d be better off getting a boat, airplane, or divorced.