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1978 308 Relay board

Discussion in '308/328' started by Alex Rainnie, Mar 6, 2018.

  1. Alex Rainnie

    Alex Rainnie Rookie

    Mar 6, 2018
    7
    Full Name:
    Alex Rainnie
    Hi all,

    I am in the process of re-wiring a 1978 RHD 308 for a customer. Brand new loom purchased and had to be fitted. I have downloaded the full colour wiring diagram from Paul Bennett and owners manual for the LHD version, Seems there wasn't enough interest to do a RHD manual.

    So far I have managed to trace everything from the fuse blocks to the peripherals, nest task is to re-wire the relay board and I have run into an issue on the board, namely 2 extra relays and a hard-link.

    The 2 relays are the ones below the flasher relay these appear to be supplying the gnd connection to the main headlight motor relay, these 2 are operated by a yellow wire on the top one and a green wire to the bottom one.
    The hard-link has a white/black(30) red/black(87a) & light blue(87)

    Anybody got the same mod or can shed some light on this?

    Thanks Alex
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  2. Alex Rainnie

    Alex Rainnie Rookie

    Mar 6, 2018
    7
    Full Name:
    Alex Rainnie
    oh the relay board was cut out of the loom prior to me getting the job :(:(:mad:
     
  3. Steve Magnusson

    Steve Magnusson F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa

    Jan 11, 2001
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    #3 Steve Magnusson, Mar 6, 2018
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2018
    What OM do you have? The 155/78 OM (for late euro carbed 308B/S) shows two "additional' relays on page 111:

    One for applying +12V to the coils during starter motor cranking (for those with points, not the electronic ignition) and this is a relay with 30, 85, 86, 87, and 87b terminals (large yellow wire on terminal 30), and

    An "optional" one for running one of the water fans when the AC is "on" (terminals 30, 85, 86, and 87 with a green wire on terminal 30).

    Does any of that match up to the car you are working on (e.g., does this '78 have points)?

    The "hard-link" at the lower right is described on the schematic (item 91) as a wiring bridge related to flashing the headlights and being provided "on request".
     
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  4. SJP 5

    SJP 5 Karting

    Jun 7, 2015
    61
    Hello,
    I am not sure if this is any help but shortly after I purchased my 1977 308 an electrician friend rewired my headlights as they originally raised with just sidelights on which I personnally did not like and now they only raise when headlights are used.
    I recall he used a Doide and extra relays so this maybe the reason for your modification.
     
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  5. Steve Magnusson

    Steve Magnusson F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa

    Jan 11, 2001
    18,732
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    Steve Magnusson
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  6. Alex Rainnie

    Alex Rainnie Rookie

    Mar 6, 2018
    7
    Full Name:
    Alex Rainnie
    Hi Steve,

    The 2 additional ones are definitely hooked into the light motor relay, the mod seems to have disconnected the green (switched gnd) wire from the parking switch and replaced it with a switched gnd through these 2 relays. Looking at the diagram it could be as SJP5 suggested that it was to prevent the lights rising with the sidelights.

    Cross referenced the schematic in the manual and the colour one I downloaded and you are spot on with the hard-link - thank you very much ( I'll just have to update the colour one to match or vice-versa lol.
     
  7. Alex Rainnie

    Alex Rainnie Rookie

    Mar 6, 2018
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    Full Name:
    Alex Rainnie
  8. Alex Rainnie

    Alex Rainnie Rookie

    Mar 6, 2018
    7
    Full Name:
    Alex Rainnie
    Hi SJP 5

    Had another look at the schematic and you may well be on the money, although going by the colour coding this one would still work off the sidelights and/or headlights. So I think someone has tried to do the same mod as you have, I will look further down that line as it seems to be the most probable.

    Thanks
     
  9. SJP 5

    SJP 5 Karting

    Jun 7, 2015
    61
    Hello Alex,
    Pleased that it may have been helpful,hope you work it out.
    Tom
     
  10. jmaienza

    jmaienza Formula Junior

    Jan 8, 2009
    460
    Massachusetts
    Full Name:
    Joe
    Perhaps the relays are related to the European version of the flash to pass function. I believe the European version, unlike the US version, used under bumper lights (fog lights or driving lights?) to perform this function so the headlights don't have to rise.

    I have a 78 308 USA (LHD) version and did the modification as described in post #4. The modification involved removing two female lugs from the relay board. The wire was blue with a blue jumper. A new wire was prepared with two diodes. I don't think this was done on yours otherwise a you would probably see the one wire branching into two wires. (I covered the diodes with shrink wrap on mine so it looks like a splice).
     
  11. SJP 5

    SJP 5 Karting

    Jun 7, 2015
    61
    I think the under bumper lights were introduced on the QV as a standard fitment,previous models were retro fitted on brackets on the bumper irons which do not look as neat as the QV set up.
     
  12. jmaienza

    jmaienza Formula Junior

    Jan 8, 2009
    460
    Massachusetts
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    Joe
    +1 on the earlier optional lights and the standard fitment on the QV

    Alex

    1. You say this is a RHD car. Do you know which country it was made for? Not many RHD countries from which to choose. Ferrari had different lighting configurations for different countries.

    2. Does the car have front fog lights or rear fog lights?

    3. Here is the link for the Headlight pop up diode modification. There is some useful info in the post about how the circuits work both before and after.

    https://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/posts/141221797/

    4. I assume at this point you don't have the electrical system working. If you do, can you check the operation of the headlights and the switch in all its positions.

    Good Luck and keep us posted. Definitely a challenge to re-wire the relay board. A ridiculous amount of wires.
     
  13. Grim Reaper tr

    Grim Reaper tr Karting

    Oct 6, 2014
    58
    IIRC Maranello Concessionaires had the UK delivered cars modified so that the headlights could be raised without the park lights coming on.

    Also IIRC this was only for UK delivered cars and not other RHD markets.....seem to recall that the UK cars were also modified so that the side window glass could be lowered/raised without the key being in the ignition and contact on?

    Grim
     
  14. Alex Rainnie

    Alex Rainnie Rookie

    Mar 6, 2018
    7
    Full Name:
    Alex Rainnie
    Hi jmaienza,
    Thanks for the info, definitely no diodes in the circuits, I've had a read through the post on the mod (thanks for that) and although it looks like these are the for the mod they have been wired completely different.

    Instead of working with the +12V supply from the fuse these 2 relays are switching the GND control feed to the main motor relay coil. I am assuming that the yellow wire was from the dip lights switch and the green wire was from the lights switch, which makes the mod redundant anyway. ( I say assuming because I came into the job after someone had been at it. The pic is what I was handed so no chance of actually following what was where doing what lol)

    As to your other questions:-
    1. At the moment I don't have the information on origin, but I can find out from the owner.
    2.Rear fog lights (center circle) fitted

    4. At the moment I have all the fused wiring completed, and have tested the side lights, brake lights, reverse light (after repairing the switch) indicator lights - this was done applying 12V to the relevant fuses.

    Yesterday was stripping down the steering column switches, cleaning them of 10yrs grime and crap, repairing the side light switch, now the fun part of getting all the levers back on with the fun of the springs, contacts and ball bearings. I think I have the relay board sussed now apart from the 2 extra relays, but looks like they are the headlight mod just done differently, I'll go with the posted mod I think, and then ready to start swapping over the the new loom

    Did have a small hiccup with the rear wiring loom as the lights didn't match the front (Left hand front side light & right hand rear light), turns out the panel beater had installed the loom incorrectly (fed down the left side to the boot), once I re-fitted it I had synchronised lights. (fed the loom down the right hand side).

    There are a couple of sensors missing that I will need to source (A/C pressure switch and brake failure pressure switch).




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  15. Alex Rainnie

    Alex Rainnie Rookie

    Mar 6, 2018
    7
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    Alex Rainnie
    Hi Grim Reaper,

    I have looked at that mod from another site, at the moment I can probably say it is done as I am basically starting with a brand new loom and door wiring. But I will be looking at the various upgrades and discussing them with the owner before everything is tidied up and buttoned away
     
  16. jmaienza

    jmaienza Formula Junior

    Jan 8, 2009
    460
    Massachusetts
    Full Name:
    Joe
    Alex

    That is quite a pile of wires in your picture. I’m sure are alternating between lol and wanting to take a couple of stiff drinks. Definitely a challenge. The good thing is once the wires are sorted, it won’t need to be done again, unlike belts, water pumps and valve adjustments.

    You may want to send Paul Bennet a PM. He really seems to understand the electrics in these cars

    Hang in there!
     

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