1998 550 Maranello "sorting" thread--DIY | Page 38 | FerrariChat
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1998 550 Maranello "sorting" thread--DIY

Discussion in '456/550/575' started by moorfan, Aug 15, 2011.

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  1. moorfan

    moorfan Formula Junior

    May 11, 2009
    809
    Central Virginia
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    Pete
    #926 moorfan, May 15, 2016
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  2. moorfan

    moorfan Formula Junior

    May 11, 2009
    809
    Central Virginia
    Full Name:
    Pete
    #927 moorfan, May 15, 2016
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  3. moorfan

    moorfan Formula Junior

    May 11, 2009
    809
    Central Virginia
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    Pete
    #928 moorfan, May 15, 2016
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    The mating surfaces were cleaned with acetone, REPEATEDLY. No oil products remained on either mating surface that I could tell. Assembly lube was placed on the crank serration as well as the inner bearing races and the oil pump shaft.

    This time around, I used the OEM gasket plus an actual *bead* of Loctite 518 on both sides of the gasket.
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  4. moorfan

    moorfan Formula Junior

    May 11, 2009
    809
    Central Virginia
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    Pete
    #929 moorfan, May 15, 2016
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Things went back together reasonably well with the front cover. Again, it is a real PITA to hold that oil chain sprocket plus chain plus crank sprocket AND line everything up AND ensure that you don't touch either surface or sealant. Bleah.

    Next step was to reapply timing belts and new tensioner bearings (Thank you to Hill Engineering and Ricambi for wonderful customer service in providing new parts).

    And of course, the motor was retimed. I still can't bring myself to do lock and swap and you definitely shouldn't if you are removing the front timing cover.
    I think that each time I do the timing I get a little better at it; I try to incorporate all the lessons I have received from everyone on this thread (John, Carl, Brian) ;-)
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  5. moorfan

    moorfan Formula Junior

    May 11, 2009
    809
    Central Virginia
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    Pete
    #930 moorfan, May 15, 2016
    Everything seemed to go back together well, and I finished the job today and restarted the motor.
    Started right up, but as I walked around and listened and smelled, something was amiss....

    I smell raw fuel.

    I walk around the back end of the car and put my hand over the bank 7-12 exhaust... hot moist air is coming out and the rhythm sounds normal. The exhaust smells normal, like converter smell.

    Putting my hand over the 1-6 bank exhaust, there is cold air coming out with the strong smell of unburned fuel, and the sound is much less. Seems that bank 1-6 isn't firing.

    I have been running the Maranello Skunk Works COP ignition for the last year and it has been running very well, in fact was running very nicely right up to the point that I took it apart. A triple check was done of all connections in the engine bay and everything looks normal. Don't know what I missed.
    No thrown or pending codes.

    With John Cribb's guidance, I troubleshoot the MSW ignition harness, and ALL connections there are solid and continuous via multimeter. No apparent issues with the MSW harness. The car side ignition harness (pre-factory coil) has 14.4v with the engine running on terminal number 4, so it seems that current is there. The presence of injected fuel from the exhaust pipe seems to indicate that the angular velocity sensors on the pumpkin are functional. The timing sensor at the rear of bank 1-6 is connected but I'm not quite sure how to verify its operation.

    In anger, I went inside and ordered a 2017 Audi R8, because it has a timing chain, and a f'ing warranty.
     
  6. Dave rocks

    Dave rocks F1 World Champ
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    #931 Dave rocks, May 15, 2016
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    I use a right angle ball tip probe to hit the lifter with no cam interference and assure the indicator is coaxial to the valve/lifter.
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  7. moorfan

    moorfan Formula Junior

    May 11, 2009
    809
    Central Virginia
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    Pete
    #932 moorfan, May 15, 2016
    Very nice! Where did you get that tip? You can't see in my photo, but I am using a right angle tip to do the same thing but mine is not nearly as nice as yours!
     
  8. dersark_painclinic

    dersark_painclinic Formula Junior

    Mar 8, 2005
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    Glendale, CA
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    Lazik Der Sarkissian
    #933 dersark_painclinic, May 15, 2016
    Pete, I understand your anger, the kind of profession and life style we have we would like to enjoy our spare time rather .......
    Sark
     
  9. moorfan

    moorfan Formula Junior

    May 11, 2009
    809
    Central Virginia
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    Pete
    #934 moorfan, May 15, 2016
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    "The Defense Department regrets to inform you that your sons are dead because they were stupid" (Goose, from Top Gun)

    This is how I feel now. The search button is your friend on this forum, and what has been reported several times is that this V12 engine "freaks out" when there is an air leak. I only messed with air in two places this time around...the plenum to intake manifold connection, and the SIDE PLENUM GASKETS.

    On the opposite side of the engine from the "trouble", I totally assed up the lower edge of the side plenum gasket. Photo 1 shows that one of the screws missed the gasket hole completely, resulting in a huge air leak (bottom hole that is slightly out of focus), and Photo 2 shows how many others were off.

    I'm betting when the new gasket gets here and I do it correctly, it will be all fixed.
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  10. fatbillybob

    fatbillybob Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Aug 10, 2002
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    #935 fatbillybob, May 15, 2016
    Sorry been out all day so late to party. I know you are a good mechanic but I will say this anyway. Did you check by rotating engine a few times that the 4 cam marks come very close to cam journal marks when #1 at TDC? If in ball park engine will run. My 2nd though is swap crank sensors left to right. Carefully check engine side of connector too. Kia sensors are available and cheap in a dealer near you but the pigtails are shorter than 550 sensors. They do work however and my preferred sensor eventhough shorter. I buy kia sensors by the 1/2 dozen and always keep some around. Interestingly I give them to others as needed because they just don't fail. 3rd you might be able to swap the MSW left harness to right just for a test. I have not looked closely at this. Me...I always keep the old stock wires and coil around to help me debug stuff like this. I would do the spark on the valve cover thing to see if you get spark (not likely). or use an inductive timing light to look for spark. 4th there is a ground wire on the back end of both cam covers. Check that they were not overlooked. Ferrari put 2 so both must be needed. 5th check the cam shaft sensor on the passenger side. The heat cooks the end of the pigtail of the sensor and the plastic literally fall off. But I don't think it would cause this issue.
     
  11. fatbillybob

    fatbillybob Two Time F1 World Champ
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    #936 fatbillybob, May 15, 2016
    But an air leak would give really crappy running but combustion. I would think those would look and feel totally different. While waiting for parts I would Goop the gasket to seal it and then check for spark on the 7/12 bank to confirm you got spark there...then I would wait for parts.
     
  12. moorfan

    moorfan Formula Junior

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    Pete
    #937 moorfan, May 15, 2016
    Carl, as you probably know I checked those timing marks like 18 times :)

    Ground wires, checked.
    Timing sensor, checked.

    I have another gasket coming from Ricambi, and based on how badly I messed the prior one up I am almost positive that it will make things right. If it doesn't straighten out the issue, I will pursue some of those other avenues.
     
  13. tazandjan

    tazandjan Three Time F1 World Champ
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    #938 tazandjan, May 15, 2016
    Bloody things are all female, and who understands them?
     
  14. wbklink

    wbklink F1 Rookie

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    #939 wbklink, May 15, 2016
    My technician :)
     
  15. Cribbj

    Cribbj Formula 3
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    #940 Cribbj, May 16, 2016
    Pete, don't swap the MSW harnesses; they're wired differently from side to side, because the Ferrari side of the harness is too! Why they did this is beyond me. The firing order looking into the 4 pin ignition connectors on the Ferrari harness is 3-2-1 for the right bank, and 2-1-3 for the left.

    Carl may be onto something with those earthing straps. You've already confirmed you have +12 at the coils, but if the heads are effectively insulated from the block, by a poor, or nonexistent earth connection, you won't get spark.
     
  16. ///Mink

    ///Mink Formula Junior
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    Tom Mink
    #941 ///Mink, May 16, 2016
  17. Dave rocks

    Dave rocks F1 World Champ
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    #942 Dave rocks, May 16, 2016
    Mahr Federal P/N: PT-2268

    I get that stuff from my supplier but here is a link I found on the web :)

    Mahr Federal Hand Metrology Products - Dial Indicators | Deterco, Inc.
     
  18. moorfan

    moorfan Formula Junior

    May 11, 2009
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    Central Virginia
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    Pete
    #943 moorfan, May 17, 2016
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Problem solved by correctly installing the side plenum gasket. Everything is normal again. Purrs like a liioooonnnn.... :)

    Hard to see, but there is exhaust steam coming from BOTH sides of the car now.
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  19. moorfan

    moorfan Formula Junior

    May 11, 2009
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    #944 moorfan, May 17, 2016
    Dave, this vehicle you pictured here is NOT a Maranello, no? The lifters appear to be close to aligned vertical with the cams, and NOT angled off at 25-30 degrees like in our cars...
     
  20. tazandjan

    tazandjan Three Time F1 World Champ
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    #945 tazandjan, May 17, 2016
    Pete- F355. The intake cams are really weird looking since they depress 3 valves. Just looked at one today that my techs were doing a 5 year on.
     
  21. Cribbj

    Cribbj Formula 3
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    #946 Cribbj, May 18, 2016
    Wow Pete, that must've been one helluva air leak! Glad it's sorted!!!
     
  22. Dave rocks

    Dave rocks F1 World Champ
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    #947 Dave rocks, May 18, 2016
    Hey Pete, As Taz said, this is from a 355 - I've got 3 of them :)

    It's a 5 valve per cylinder motor (3 intake, 2 exhaust). The side intake valves are at a 3.5 degree angle so the cam lobes are ground at that angle so they make flat contact on the hydraulic lifters.
     
  23. moorfan

    moorfan Formula Junior

    May 11, 2009
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    Pete
    #948 moorfan, Sep 29, 2016
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    I know that cross-posting is annoying, but I like to keep this thread updated with a running record of all of the maintenance that I have performed on my 550. Just in case I ever want to sell it ;-) Further information is in the linked thread:

    http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/456-550-575-sponsored-bradan/532912-instrument-fuse-blowing-alternator-stoping.html

    Post follows below:
    Today a new Bosch auxiliary water pump arrived for me to install in the 550. (Figure 1) To recap, I replaced my #5 7.5a fuse and the car ran normally again while in the garage. I had decided to replace my auxiliary cooling pump "just because".

    I did this change quick and dirty...I haven't even gone 200 miles on the new coolant since I changed it and I was not interested in redoing it so soon. Hose clamps solve the problem of coolant leak. (Figure 2)

    Once the old pump was out, I had to clip off the old hardwired connections and then plug those back onto the mini-spade connectors of the new pump. This was sealed up with silicone. I also discovered that the pump inlet and outlet port diameters are SMALLER on the -064 pump that was in my car than the port diameters in the new pump. However, it is easy to do a swap of the plastic cap that has those ports, and you can see the old cap on the new pump. The new pump was filled as much as possible with distilled water prior to fully connecting the hoses and releasing the clamps. Hopefully this minimizes the risk of airlock somewhere in the system later on (Figure 3)
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  24. girgio

    girgio Rookie

    Dec 5, 2016
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    #949 girgio, Mar 30, 2017
    Good morning, I write from Italy,I have a 550 Maranello like yours, unfortunately you do not turn Why not get Gasoline (pumps do not light) I Verified:
    The electric voltage to the spark plugs is OK; relays C and D work and move when you turn the key; The inertial switch is OK; The CHEK is OK on the multi function display; The gasoline pumps do not light, the electric voltage arrives for a moment and then does not reach there.
    Can you help me? Thank you Giorgio
     
  25. girgio

    girgio Rookie

    Dec 5, 2016
    4
    #950 girgio, Mar 30, 2017
    Good morning, I write from Italy,I have a 550 Maranello like yours, unfortunately you do not turn Why not get Gasoline (pumps do not light) I Verified:
    The electric voltage to the spark plugs is OK; relays C and D work and move when you turn the key; The inertial switch is OK; The CHEK is OK on the multi function display; The gasoline pumps do not light, the electric voltage arrives for a moment and then does not reach there.
    Can you help me? Thank you
     
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