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360 2004 360 Spyder, Top problem

Discussion in '360/430' started by capnal63, Jul 10, 2024.

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  1. capnal63

    capnal63 Rookie

    Oct 8, 2021
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    Alan J. DeSa
    #1 capnal63, Jul 10, 2024
    A year or so ago I traveled from Hilton Head, SC to Ferrari in Orlando and had the top serviced and the elastic bands replaced among other things. A week ago while putting up the top there was a hydraulic leak on the passenger side to the left of the sun visor. Not sure what exactly happened... lose hydraulic fitting, bad cylinder etc.
    Has anyone had a similiar leak or had to replaced a bad part, or a schematic of the system.
     
  2. EastMemphis

    EastMemphis Formula 3
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    #2 EastMemphis, Jul 10, 2024
    Sounds like the locking cylinder leaking. It's a typical problem that also is probably present on the two secondary cylinders which are about shoulder position on each side of the top.

    These cylinders are under a lot of strain and are very small. Add in heat, 20 years of aging, and materials that weren't designed to last for ten years and the result is always the same. Leaks.

    You can fix it yourself relatively easily or you can ship your car off and have it cost about $3000 or so. An F shop will replace not only the cylinder, but the lines as well. That's labor intensive. You can just snip the lines and buy a splice package from a rebuilder and have the whole job done for less than $500.

    Then there's the cleanup. Be prepared to smell hydraulic oil for the next year or two, if you do a great job cleaning it up now. I suggest getting on that as the oil just soaks into stuff.
     
    Need4Spd and Qavion like this.
  3. GogglesPisano

    GogglesPisano F1 Rookie
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    #3 GogglesPisano, Jul 10, 2024
  4. 400iGuy

    400iGuy Formula 3
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    #4 400iGuy, Jul 10, 2024
    I've had the same leak. A leaking hydraulic cylinder that operates the latches in the windshield headliner. My Ferrari mechanic (Bruce Anderson, Maranello Autosport, Eustis, FL) send the cylinders out to be rebuilt. I don't know the specifics of where he sent them but someone rebuilds the cylinders reportedly with better materials than original. Why did they run hydraulic lines from behind the passenger seat to hydraulic cylinders up in the top of the windshield instead of a couple of wires and a solenoid to latch the top? It's crazy!

    Al
    2004 360 Spider F1 (Titanium/Bordeaux)
    1984 400iA (SerBlu/Tan)
     
  5. Qavion

    Qavion F1 World Champ
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    #5 Qavion, Jul 10, 2024
    You may find a few YouTube videos on the subject. The actuators on top of the windshield seem to be some of the hardest ones to pull and repair because they don't have easily detachable hydraulic lines. Some cutting or grinding required.
     
  6. priericky128

    priericky128 Formula Junior
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    #6 priericky128, Jul 11, 2024
    You can replace the whole mechanism for about $100 if you want to re run the lines yourself. It’s not that hard, took me about two hours when I did it.

    It’s a Mercedes part https://www.ebay.com/itm/165265903818?mkevt=1&mkpid=0&emsid=e11051.m43.l1123&mkcid=7&ch=osgood&euid=4a38d445db6d41ca96b385cf3a636cab&bu=45225747197&osub=-1%7E1&crd=20230212213527&segname=11051

    Three potential things to watch out for: hoses will not be labeled with Ferrari pump part numbers (so label them yourself), new hoses can be slightly larger diameter (tight but do able), and the ends that plug into the pump on merc parts are not hooked like the Ferrari ones (the cover does still fit though).

    I got a stupid quote to fix mine so I did it myself. Glad I did.


    Sent from my iPhone using FerrariChat
     
  7. LorenzoR

    LorenzoR F1 Rookie
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    #7 LorenzoR, Jul 11, 2024
    Rick for the fchat community is that ebay listing for all 3 cylinders up front?
     
  8. priericky128

    priericky128 Formula Junior
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    #8 priericky128, Jul 11, 2024
    No that is the front lock only.

    Here are the left and right:
    left:https://www.ebay.com/itm/375528837652?itmmeta=01J2HBZBW97R5AXFT0T0A4097G&hash=item576f435214:g:3w0AAOSwn6BmjXIz
    right: https://www.ebay.com/itm/235510000546?itmmeta=01J2HC38C8YMBZEXPQP5336D9B&hash=item36d57d6ba2:g:2nAAAOSwpPRlY4Si&itmprp=enc%3AAQAJAAAA4PWFKcI%2F40fUC5O6ut7zS73xuw4eIYKVTPy3rUaFtgB5aS1bALiSRqKkspr%2F1AsViLWXqr2kC1ISRXMLUZFFW1sA1qjHa%2BPd8TI5cozkT%2Fcdps7K1tnYP1AdAdLr4a4iC9GofWiTfBjRvtLINn7ZOu4allWEqGcOGcEofW5aaLR6Ai%2F3evTwi7MKO7OvCtVzZtnq2NBfj8UvOpi6WAl73rp1SbHMc8llY9J6XekR3cHSUQBKqbvY0zMxJyXPDLrcvxhEsgEPeVBKtspZawDFR%2BkOSzhF3danxB7MiZ8TffQX%7Ctkp%3ABk9SR5yGjayUZA

    full disclosure, i have not used the left or right ones; i resealed mine.
     
  9. capnal63

    capnal63 Rookie

    Oct 8, 2021
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    Alan J. DeSa
    #9 capnal63, Jul 14, 2024
    capnal63
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    360/430
    360 2004 360 Spyder, Top problem

    Discussion in '360/430' started by capnal63, Wednesday at 2:12 PM.
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    capnal63
    capnal63
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    #1 Wednesday at 2:12 PM
    A year or so ago I traveled from Hilton Head, SC to Ferrari in Orlando and had the top serviced and the elastic bands replaced among other things. A week ago while putting up the top there was a hydraulic leak on the passenger side to the left of the sun visor. Not sure what exactly happened... lose hydraulic fitting, bad cylinder etc.
    Has anyone had a similiar leak or had to replaced a bad part, or a schematic of the system.
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    EastMemphis
    EastMemphis
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    #2 Wednesday at 2:18 PM
    Sounds like the locking cylinder leaking. It's a typical problem that also is probably present on the two secondary cylinders which are about shoulder position on each side of the top.

    These cylinders are under a lot of strain and are very small. Add in heat, 20 years of aging, and materials that weren't designed to last for ten years and the result is always the same. Leaks.

    You can fix it yourself relatively easily or you can ship your car off and have it cost about $3000 or so. An F shop will replace not only the cylinder, but the lines as well. That's labor intensive. You can just snip the lines and buy a splice package from a rebuilder and have the whole job done for less than $500.

    Then there's the cleanup. Be prepared to smell hydraulic oil for the next year or two, if you do a great job cleaning it up now. I suggest getting on that as the oil just soaks into stuff.
    Qavion likes this.
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    GogglesPisano
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    #3 Wednesday at 2:25 PM
    Yup, like John said. I just went through the same thing. I'd plan on replacing them all at some point, but the front one is especially easy with this vendor: https://cabriolethydraulics.com/vario-roof-front-latch-cylinder-fix/
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    400iGuy
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    #4 Wednesday at 2:26 PM
    I've had the same leak. A leaking hydraulic cylinder that operates the latches in the windshield headliner. My Ferrari mechanic (Bruce Anderson, Maranello Autosport, Eustis, FL) send the cylinders out to be rebuilt. I don't know the specifics of where he sent them but someone rebuilds the cylinders reportedly with better materials than original. Why did they run hydraulic lines from behind the passenger seat to hydraulic cylinders up in the top of the windshield instead of a couple of wires and a solenoid to latch the top? It's crazy!

    Al
    2004 360 Spider F1 (Titanium/Bordeaux)
    1984 400iA (SerBlu/Tan)
    Al ----------- 1984 400iA sn 50605, 2004 360 Spider F1 Titanium/Bordeaux
    "I live with fear every day and occasionaly I leave her and go racing" Gene Felton
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    Qavion
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    #5 Wednesday at 5:51 PM NEW
    You may find a few YouTube videos on the subject. The actuators on top of the windshield seem to be some of the hardest ones to pull and repair because they don't have easily detachable hydraulic lines. Some cutting or grinding required.
    Tools
    Like + Quote Reply
    priericky128
    priericky128
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    Feb 11, 2021
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    #6 Thursday at 7:50 AM NEW
    You can replace the whole mechanism for about $100 if you want to re run the lines yourself. It’s not that hard, took me about two hours when I did it.

    It’s a Mercedes part https://www.ebay.com/itm/165265903818?mkevt=1&mkpid=0&emsid=e11051.m43.l1123&mkcid=7&ch=osgood&euid=4a38d445db6d41ca96b385cf3a636cab&bu=45225747197&osub=-1%7E1&crd=20230212213527&segname=11051

    Three potential things to watch out for: hoses will not be labeled with Ferrari pump part numbers (so label them yourself), new hoses can be slightly larger diameter (tight but do able), and the ends that plug into the pump on merc parts are not hooked like the Ferrari ones (the cover does still fit though).

    I got a stupid quote to fix mine so I did it myself. Glad I did.


    Sent from my iPhone using FerrariChat
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    LorenzoR
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    #7 Thursday at 8:55 AM NEW
    Rick for the fchat community is that ebay listing for all 3 cylinders up front?
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    priericky128
     
  10. capnal63

    capnal63 Rookie

    Oct 8, 2021
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    #10 capnal63, Jul 14, 2024
    Prier Ricky128 How did you reseal the leaking locking cylinder on the F360
     
  11. priericky128

    priericky128 Formula Junior
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    #11 priericky128, Jul 14, 2024
    I did not re-seal it, I ended up replacing it. I don't remember exactly, but the new seal was pretty tight to fit, and you need to drill out the head of the piston to separate it from the rest of the assembly once you remove it to get the seal onto the shaft.

    For me, replacing the lines and re-running them was less work than drilling out the old piston, but at that time, I was working a small garage with limited tools.
     
  12. capnal63

    capnal63 Rookie

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    #12 capnal63, Jul 14, 2024
     
  13. capnal63

    capnal63 Rookie

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    #13 capnal63, Jul 14, 2024
    Prier ricky128, How did you reseal the leaking right locking cylinder on the F360??
     
  14. priericky128

    priericky128 Formula Junior
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    #14 priericky128, Jul 14, 2024
    On the right and left ones above the windows, I drilled a small hole near the top of the cylinder to be able to get my pick in to hold the retention ring. I used two picks to pop it out. You need to be extremely careful so you don't go too low into the cylinder and defect it by making a leak. If you look closely, you can see the little gap you have in there to work with. It's really small and you need to both use a small enough drill bit and make it high enough that you do not make it leak.

    I have talked to others and you can remove the retention ring without drilling the hole, but I am not good enough to do that. I put a small picture below marking approximately where I drilled.
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  15. capnal63

    capnal63 Rookie

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    #15 capnal63, Jul 17, 2024
     
  16. EastMemphis

    EastMemphis Formula 3
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    #16 EastMemphis, Jul 17, 2024
    I would note that these cylinders have fixed lines. The OEM units have removable lines. To change out the two secondary cylinders, it's a stand up job that takes about 15 minutes a side. The lines aren't touched. I'd say the better choice for a proper job would be to send the OEM units to a rebuilder. It's a bit more expensive for the proper parts but worth it in this case.
     
  17. capnal63

    capnal63 Rookie

    Oct 8, 2021
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    Alan J. DeSa
    #17 capnal63, Jul 17, 2024
    prierricky128
    Good news. I talked to a friend at a local car show and he mentioned SCE auto repair on Hilton Head.
    These folks have repaired his BMW over the years. I drove over and they could not have been nicer.
    They repair all “exotics” including Ferrari’s but their website doesn't mention that. I will take the car in next week. Then they will send in the cylinders for reconditioning and re-install. If you come to HHI as planed contact me, we can have lunch or something.
    Thanks for Your help.
    Al
     

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