2008 F1 Driver vs Team Mistakes before China

So you took a subjective fluff peice from the net and are now passing it as fact? OK.

 

How are they ever able to calculate these so called lost points? If Massa or Lewis finished outside of the points, do they lose one point or ten? How would they know where the drivers would have finished?

 

I'm not questioning your effort to post this but rather the principal of 'lost points'.

 

Well it is easy to see where the 20 SF lost points were

10 with a lost engine after dominating all weekend with 3 laps left
10 when the team can't figure out when to let the car leave the pits while dominating the weekend and headed for a win

FM threw away the first two races. SF threw away the season as it is not my opinion but rather a fact the McLaren has been the more organized and reliable of the two. One can only hope that the reliability bug bites LH in Brazil where Massa is pretty much generally unbeatable

 

@ Australia FM Ferrari engine blew

 

Ensuing penalties aside, KR also contributed to this season's looming disaster by opening the door to not only LH but everybody else on the first lap in Japan, after taking the lead on the start. He said he was surprised by LH's move, but after seeing how the guy has driven all season, why wouldn't you expect an "outbrake yourself" move? KR asleep at the wheel...

 

Your conclusion is one sided and ignores the rest of the facts.

As I stated elsewhere, the team performing well and producing a reliable car is an integral part of success in F1 and entirely within the control of the team. To highlight that the fault lies with the team and not the driver is irrelevant - it takes both to win a WDC.

On the other hand, having your competition get a helping hand from the FIA in the form of unwarranted penalties is most certainly not an integral part of success in F1 and is entirely outside the control of the teams.

Suggesting that the "real" standings are something other than they really are (i.e. suggesting Massa is somehow the rightful or talent-leading driver) is silly, especially when you discount the fact that their standings are only what they are due to FIA intervention.

If Ferrari had made the same number of mistakes as McLaren, and the FIA hadn't felt the need to 'adjust' the standings afterwards, then Hamilton would still be leading the WDC.

So stop blaming it on the team. If Massa hadn't spun out and crashed out a few times this year and let his team and Ferrari fans down, he would be leading the WDC right now. Sorry.

 

+100
Er Bingo full house again!!...

 

So how is your conclusion not one sided and obviously not based on facts? He only crashed out once. He led nobody down, except maybe the ones who were betting against him.

 

It is not based on selective facts and one sided because I haven't said or insinuated that any one driver is the 'rightful' winner/leader as was done in the original post.

As they say... "if your aunt had balls she'd be your uncle".

IF Massa hadn't...... then....

IF Ferrari hadn't....... then...

IF Hamilton hadn't..... then....

IF McLaren hadn't..... then...

To pick ONE of the above scenarios and say "this is the only one that counts, therefore my driver of choice 'should' be leading" is just silly. If, if, if.... IF Massa hadn't boned the first two races, he'd be leading in the points now too. IF Hamilton hadn't crashed into Kimi, maybe Kimi would be leading now, or maybe Hamilton would have already won.

All speculation of what could have been.


As I said, in F1, what matters is what you do on the track. That includes finishes, as well as performing correctly in pit stops and such. What is NOT part of F1 is having the favor of the officials, such that they assist you to stay close to the competition. Massa is more lucky to have that, than he is unlucky to have his spins. The team can always improve reliability, and their pit stops, etc, etc. But one thing no team can ever change or affect is the intervention of the FIA to keep things close.

But I like I said... woulda, coulda, shoulda... all irrelevant to the ends of arguing which driver "should" be leading, but isn't.

 

Fact: Bruno Senna GP2 pulls out in pit lane in front of another driver!! receives a drive through, loses race because of it.

Fact: Massa does exact same thing! receives a measly montary fine!

 

Massa made less mistakes than Hami, and is still trailing him?

Sack him already!

 

Please point out where the OP says or even insinuates that any one driver is the rightful winner or leader?

I will say though that any of these kind of analyses are pointless (no pun intended) because lost points aren't relevant. Like you say coulda, woulda, shoulda. What is a fact (and that's what I read from the first post) is that Massa has been very consistent in points scoring as opposed to Hamilton and in spite of his team's efforts/mistakes. This is reflected in his position in the championship right now which is still being lead by Hamilton (hopefully not untill the end!)

And about FIA favouring Ferrari: I don't buy that. Maybe I'm fooled but I don't think there's a grand scheme behind all the individual decisions made by many different people like stewards, SC drivers, corner workers or crane drivers (remember Germany last year?). Leave that kind of conspiracy stuff to Hollywood.

 

Keep in mind without the FIA's "adjustments" LH would be WDC as we speak.

 

Yes Correct Exactly Right.

And is in the real world! Porno MAX and hecklestone has staged the rest.