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2009-2011 versus 2012+ California DCT transmission reliability

Discussion in 'California/Portofino/Roma' started by artsd, Jan 5, 2021.

  1. artsd

    artsd Formula Junior
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    May 6, 2009
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    Art
    I started shopping for 2009-2012 California recently. Trying to stay around $90k all in so probably won't be looking at more expensive 2013-2014 Cali 30 models.

    I know 2012 got an additional cooler that helps with heat related failures. I don't know if all 2012 had the cooler or if it was a mid-model-year update.

    If you were shopping early Calis, would you be extra concerned with 2009-2011 versus 2012+?
    Is it worth it to only look at 2012+?
     
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  3. tomc

    tomc Two Time F1 World Champ

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    Given the circumstantial evidence here, I would indeed focus on 2012+.
    I might even stretch or wait until 2013s get into your target area.
    Good luck...T
     
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  4. alex

    alex Formula Junior

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    As a rule of thumb, my wife and I steer clear of the first couple of production years of any car model. There are always at least a few bugs that need to be worked out. We chose a 2013 California because it was the "second generation" so to speak of the California but still had a naturally aspirated engine. Ours also has the Handling Speciale package. It seems many people suggest buying the latest model year you can afford. Bear in mind that only about 3000 cars were produced in 2013 and 2014 run. They are the California 30's: 30 Kg. less weight and 30 more horsepower.
     
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  5. Bill Phillips

    Bill Phillips Karting
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    I’ve had a 2013 for fifteen months now. The ‘12 thru ‘14 model’s gearbox was supposed to be significantly more reliable, but in the first two years after its production mine had two complete gearbox changes. It hasn’t had any issues since then, and only had 14k on the odometer, so I bought it from a SoCal dealership who had done all the required service on it for those trouble free years. It was speced out to the max and I love the car. Best of luck to you.
     
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  6. artsd

    artsd Formula Junior
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    Thanks for the feedback everyone. For what it's worth, I asked an acquaintance of mine who is a fairly well known Ferrari tech (he used to be active on these boards years ago) and he recommended 2013+ although he isn't a huge Cali fan to begin with. It is strange to me that a Getrag DCT used in several Ferraris and with likely similar design used in other makes suffers from the problems it does. Of course that could also be because people with problems of any kind are usually more vocal than those that don't have problems (not car specific behavior).

    If I knew for certain than the transmission problem could be handled for $10k or less (I've seen $7k mentioned more than once for the position sensor rebuild) then it wouldn't be so bad. But there is that fear in the back of my mind of it being a $30k or $40k issue. For that reason I am cooling on the notion of getting a Cali at this time. :( Will probably just look for Porsche 991.1 PDK. Of course PDKs can have problems too but the shear number of 911s manufactured means that the problem is cheaper to solve.
     
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  8. Bill Phillips

    Bill Phillips Karting
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    The rebuild kit is a major hurdle now because Ferrari has stopped producing them. As a result, very few service facilities will work on those gearboxes, so replacement becomes the most likely course of action in the event of any type of failure, even a small part like the speed sensor.
     
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  9. alex

    alex Formula Junior

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    Sad to hear that, Bill.:(
     
  10. Bill Phillips

    Bill Phillips Karting
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    No, I’m good. Those problems were taken care of long before I bought the car.
     
  11. alex

    alex Formula Junior

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    Well, sad to hear in general. We have a 2013 and are hoping that nothing goes wrong with the DCT. It seemed that rebuilds were possible but if you heard something to the contrary that is troubling. However, there are no guarantees! We will do regular maintenance and hope for the best!
     
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  13. tomc

    tomc Two Time F1 World Champ

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    I think the transmission is structurally sound. The issue seems to be the sensors within the DCT and specially the plastic ties that keep them in place degrading, leading to failure. At least that's my read from F-chat.

    911 is a great car too. I have a 997.2S and I love it. Such a different driving experience from the Cali...T
     
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  14. Husker

    Husker F1 Veteran
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    This is really eye-opening about the California. Hard to believe that a relatively new Ferrari wouldn’t be covered by the factory for such a potentially expensive repair.
     
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  16. alex

    alex Formula Junior

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  17. tomc

    tomc Two Time F1 World Champ

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    Terrible. I can't recall seeing one grenade before...T
     
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  18. Bill Phillips

    Bill Phillips Karting
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    Wow, wish I could un-see that.
     
  19. Akajak1

    Akajak1 Karting

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    Really sorry to hear this; has your car a full Ferrari service record ? If so surely worth a goodwill claim through your dealership.


    Sent from my iPhone using FerrariChat.com mobile app
     
  20. Archiebald

    Archiebald Rookie

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    There I was looking at Cali’s in my budget and now thinking I’ll double back for a 430. The Cali was the perfect solution for me with two younger children
     
  21. Shark01

    Shark01 F1 Rookie

    Jun 25, 2005
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    FWIW, before I bought my last car I had a discussion with my indy mechanic of 7 years, who has extensive experience with Ferrari & Lamborghini, about a California......his recommendation was to limit my purchase to a T or newer.

    But then I went and fell in love with a hardcore manual transmission icon, so that was that.
     
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  22. SAFE4NOW

    SAFE4NOW F1 Rookie
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    I'm not sure who told you this information, but I can 100% assure you and others that it is not the case. I have a DCT repair in the shop right now, parts on the bench, and repairs are about to commence.

    There are however different levels of repairs possible, but each level is its own repair, with some overlap. If the case itself is damaged, then yes, you may have to replace the entire unit. Or, if you need to replace 3 or more internal components then you may just replace the whole unit, each situation is different.

    In the end all of these parts are still available as of today.

    If it fails under the initial 3 year warranty it is covered
    If it fails under the 4th & 5th year warranty its covered
    If it fails under New Power Warranty its covered
    If it fails under Main Power Warranty its covered
    If it fails under Power Warranty... its covered

    If it hasn't been maintained at a Dealership, no service records available, and its on the 3rd owner.. yeah, probably not covered.


    WOW! Never seen that before... are you sure they didnt slip a TR Diff in your California on accident!
    I'm sorry that happened.
    I'm very interested in what they confirmed as the actual cause of failure was/is ? Did they tell you?

    While I tend to agree, Cali T over California, you may be trading 1 concern for another.
    ( DCT Gearbox issue for engine oil leaks )

    S
     
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  23. Husker

    Husker F1 Veteran
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    So what would be the worst case DCT failure expense? And is this common among the model, similar to valve guide issues were with the 355, or is it relatively uncommon?
     
  24. SAFE4NOW

    SAFE4NOW F1 Rookie
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    Worse case, entire DCT replacement, over $40k range. Repairs can be low teens to high $30's all depending on the actual failure. In my experience.

    Define common, so far only 1 in 2021, in 2020 counting cars that have come to us from all over the US, eight that I can remember. One of which was in a 488 Challenge car.

    Now, TTV8 engine oil leaks, I would venture to say more are leaking that are not leaking...

    S
     
  25. tomc

    tomc Two Time F1 World Champ

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    I'm thinking any F-car can toss up a four-figure repair bill.
    T
     
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  26. tomc

    tomc Two Time F1 World Champ

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    Steve - sensor issue on the DCT? Have you ever seen a mechanical failure on a Cali transmission like the one in post # 12? Thanks...T
     
  27. SAFE4NOW

    SAFE4NOW F1 Rookie
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    Um, any Ferrari can throw up a 5 figure repair bill... < wink >

    S
     
  28. SAFE4NOW

    SAFE4NOW F1 Rookie
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    never have I ever... that kind of failure would have stored codes for days, storing errors and faults leading up to failure.
    That's why I asked, what was the owner told the cause of failure was...

    S
     
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